Haulage announcement from GB Railfreight re sleeper.

[crehld]

Refurb is refurbed isn't!

Refurb is listed as a verb, meaning the past participle is also valid

 

[Peter Mugridge]

4 92s? So are they expecting 100% availability then?

This could be a "contracted to provide" number rather than a fleet / pool total number?

 

[CosherB]

This could be a "contracted to provide" number rather than a fleet / pool total number?

I agree. It would be nuts to expect 100% availability. Reckon GBRf will keep a couple of extras in reserve out of their pool of 16 ..... in glowing BR Railfreight grey!

 

[laseandre]

Presumably the fifth 73 will be required for the Edinburgh - Carstairs - Edinburgh portion so only one of those spare.

Why would Edinburgh - Carstairs need a diesel loco? It's entirely under the wires and I believe it uses a 90 right now (though I may be mistaken).

 

[sprinterguy]

Why would Edinburgh - Carstairs need a diesel loco? It's entirely under the wires and I believe it uses a 90 right now (though I may be mistaken).

That is the case at present, however if GBRf are indeed only providing four class 92s each night to work the sleepers, then they are a loco short to work the Edinburgh – Carstairs (and return) portion of the sleeper, which requires a fifth loco.

 

[matchmaker]

Does the use of slower 92s mean an end to the possibility of the lowland sleeper arriving anything up to 50 minutes early at Euston? The advertised time is 0707 but it appears to typically arrive around 0630. Indeed, when I caught it last week, it arrived at Euston at 0610.

http://www.realtimetrains.co.uk/train/G97236/2015/02/10/advanced

That occurred to me as well - Cl92 max speed 87mph, Cl90 max speed 110mph, sleeper currently permitted up to 100mph to make up time.

 

[theblackwatch]

That occurred to me as well - Cl92 max speed 87mph, Cl90 max speed 110mph, sleeper currently permitted up to 100mph to make up time.

Should make no difference to booked timings though, as the train is timed at max 80 mph for passenger comfort (and presumably to ensure people don't arrive at their destination too early!).
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That is the case at present, however if GBRf are indeed only providing four class 92s each night to work the sleepers, then they are a loco short to work the Edinburgh – Carstairs (and return) portion of the sleeper, which requires a fifth loco.

It may be that GBRf prefer to use a diesel on this leg for flexibility, as it could be utilised on something else during the daytime, such as a works move of rolling stock.

 

[D6975]

That is the case at present, however if GBRf are indeed only providing four class 92s each night to work the sleepers, then they are a loco short to work the Edinburgh – Carstairs (and return) portion of the sleeper, which requires a fifth loco.

Assuming of course that the Edinburgh portion is still going to run via Carstairs and be the other half of the Glasgow portion. Has this been confirmed? Indeed has the makeup of portions of the two trains been confirmed yet?

 

[alexl92]

4 92s? So are they expecting 100% availability then? I hope their contract with ACLG extends to emergency cover for the service when one of the 92s is unavailable.

ACLG? Who's got a contract with them? Does that mean we could be seeing 86s on the sleeper?

 

[sprinterguy]

ACLG? Who's got a contract with them? Does that mean we could be seeing 86s on the sleeper?

GB Railfreight have arranged a contract for Electric Traction Limited (ETL) to provide AC Locomotive Group locos to work the sleeper stock moves between Wembley and Euston.

 

[alexl92]

GB Railfreight have arranged a contract for Electric Traction Limited (ETL) to provide AC Locomotive Group locos to work the sleeper stock moves between Wembley and Euston.

As it happens, here's a photo from wnxx's twitter of 86101 in Caley livery... https://twitter.com/wnxxuk/status/568463174682472448

 

[37038]

Should see 86101 86401 and 87002 acting as ECS locos from Wembley. There's a good chance they could produce as emergency cover or, more likely, on Euston-Wembley moves prior to a ECML divert

92014 92018 92023 92033 are the dedicated sleeper locos (GBSL - Sleeper pool) with 92010 92032 92044 in the reserve pool (GBST - Sleeper/Channel Tunnel)

 

[alexl92]

Should see 86101 86401 and 87002 acting as ECS locos from Wembley. There's a good chance they could produce as emergency cover or, more likely, on Euston-Wembley moves prior to a ECML divert

92014 92018 92023 92033 are the dedicated sleeper locos (GBSL - Sleeper pool) with 92010 92032 92044 in the reserve pool (GBST - Sleeper/Channel Tunnel)

So 2 86s and an 87 in Caledonian Sleeper blue?! Brilliant, looks smart

 

[CosherB]

As it happens, here's a photo from wnxx's twitter of 86101 in Caley livery... https://twitter.com/wnxxuk/status/568463174682472448

Jolly smart! Some tasteful vinyls for the branding, should look a treat!

 

[mpb56125]

Should make no difference to booked timings though, as the train is timed at max 80 mph for passenger comfort (and presumably to ensure people don't arrive at their destination too early!).

Sleepers are timed 100 MPH south off Crewe otherwise they would get in the way off Pendolino's

Mark
http://www.mark5812.smugmug.com

 

[alexl92]

Sleepers are timed 100 MPH south off Crewe otherwise they would get in the way off Pendolino's

Mark
http://www.mark5812.smugmug.com

How will the 92s manage that?!

 

[matchmaker]

How will the 92s manage that?!

Might be okay southbound as it is downhill.

 

[alexl92]

Haha! Seriously though, will the sleeper be re-timed to 87mph or will they make it up in other ways?

 

[TheGrew]

I thought they used the slows and therefore only completed with 350s?

 

[al.currie93]

Should see 86101 86401 and 87002 acting as ECS locos from Wembley. There's a good chance they could produce as emergency cover or, more likely, on Euston-Wembley moves prior to a ECML divert

92014 92018 92023 92033 are the dedicated sleeper locos (GBSL - Sleeper pool) with 92010 92032 92044 in the reserve pool (GBST - Sleeper/Channel Tunnel)

Great to see 86401 with regular work again! I know that one in particular had an uncertain future! Are these locomotives going to actually be registered on TOPS again (if they were ever deregistered) for these purposes?

 

[JonathanH]

I thought they used the slows and therefore only completed with 350s?

The Lowland sleeper appears to be timed / booked for the slow line south of Hanslope but if the fast line is open will use that and arrive early. In the normal course of events, it doesn't interact with 390s.

The Highland sleeper is more of a problem as it really does interact with 390s being booked to arrive in Euston at 0747. It passes Rugby only ten minutes ahead of a service from Liverpool which is due into Euston at 0750. Its timing is noticeably shorter between Euston and Crewe than the down service.

 

[DarloRich]

The Lowland sleeper appears to be timed / booked for the slow line south of Hanslope but if the fast line is open will use that and arrive early. In the normal course of events, it doesn't interact with 390s.

The Highland sleeper is more of a problem as it really does interact with 390s being booked to arrive in Euston at 0747. It passes Rugby only ten minutes ahead of a service from Liverpool which is due into Euston at 0750. Its timing is noticeably shorter between Euston and Crewe than the down service.

I have only rarely seen the sleepers take the slow line through Bletchely or MK. They are almost always flying down the fast line - they take to the slow lines only when running very late

 

[deltic08]

With all portions of the Highland sleeper combining/splitting at Edinburgh, unnecessary additional mileage and extended journey times for Inverness and Fort William portions are incurred.

It is unfortunate that the Aberdeen and Edinburgh portions cannot run together via the East Coast route to Kings Cross or St Pancras and FW, Inverness and Glasgow portions run together West Coast to Euston or St Pancras. The more direct route down the west side should see arrival in Crewe 20 minute earlier to stay ahead of Pendos south of Crewe. The only downside would be combining two portions at Mossend in rain and snow.

The electrically hauled Glasgow portion would be added at Carstairs as now but to different portions.

The downside here is that the current Glasgow portion would arrive London later and leave London earlier.

 

[The Planner]

Sleeper will never go to St Pancras, i would put money on it having to arrive earlier into Euston come 2017.

 

[Mag_seven]

With all portions of the Highland sleeper combining/splitting at Edinburgh, unnecessary additional mileage and extended journey times for Inverness and Fort William portions are incurred.

It is unfortunate that the Aberdeen and Edinburgh portions cannot run together via the East Coast route to Kings Cross or St Pancras and FW, Inverness and Glasgow portions run together West Coast to Euston or St Pancras. The more direct route down the west side should see arrival in Crewe 20 minute earlier to stay ahead of Pendos south of Crewe. The only downside would be combining two portions at Mossend in rain and snow.

The electrically hauled Glasgow portion would be added at Carstairs as now but to different portions.

The downside here is that the current Glasgow portion would arrive London later and leave London earlier.

And where exactly are they going to get long enough platforms at St Pancras let alone the paths and long platform occupancy? The current arrangement is perfectly adequate.

 

[Boothby97]

Great to see 86401 with regular work again! I know that one in particular had an uncertain future! Are these locomotives going to actually be registered on TOPS again (if they were ever deregistered) for these purposes?

All those locos have remained on TOPS, 86101 and 87002 still see occasional mainline use (86101 is now up at Mossend for ice breaking duties, covering for 87002 which is at Brush for repaint). All those 92s have remained on TOPS albeit stored, and I'm sure 86401 has remained on TOPS.

 

[al.currie93]

All those locos have remained on TOPS, 86101 and 87002 still see occasional mainline use (86101 is now up at Mossend for ice breaking duties, covering for 87002 which is at Brush for repaint). All those 92s have remained on TOPS albeit stored, and I'm sure 86401 has remained on TOPS.

Thanks! Great to see them back on the run! Two 86s and an 87 in regular revenue earning service indefinitely and an official livery to match, great to see!

 

[deltic08]

And where exactly are they going to get long enough platforms at St Pancras let alone the paths and long platform occupancy? The current arrangement is perfectly adequate.

Exactly in the International platforms where Sleeper services from the Continent were going to terminate here. West Coast would have to stay at Euston.

 

[Peter Mugridge]

Exactly in the International platforms where Sleeper services from the Continent were going to terminate here.

I fear there is a slight flaw with this plan, namely that the first Eurostars start running hours before the Sleepers get in to London. The earlier Sleepers northbound would also overlap with the last Eurostars of the day.

You'd end up with all the Sleeper passengers having to go through the full passport and baggage screening just to get to and from Scotland.

 

[RichmondCommu]

A quick question here. If (and that's a big if!) one of the class 86's was called in to replace a class 92 would it be able to haul the long and I'm guessing heavy train over Shap?