LHCS FA Cup Specials?

[455driver]

Anyone going to answer these or what-

Morning trip-
Which services will be the busiest?
How busy will they actually be?
What do you do with the train now?

Afternoon trip-
What time is the game supposed to finish?
Which service are you going to put the LHCS on?
What happens if there is extra time?
What happens if there are penalties?
What happens if everyone goes to the pub to celebrate/console themselves?
Which service are you putting the LHCS on again?

Easy isn't it!

I see you have all gone quiet and there was me thinking you had all the answers!

 

[DarloRich]

it's FA Cup Day, Middlesborough are hosting Manchester City

The Boro were at City - not the other way around. They sold their full allocation of 5000 tickets

). However Northern Rail's priority is generating profits for the parent company's shareholders, not passengers, and it's cheaper to simply leave people behind.

Wibble – they operate to maximise their profitability, like all other private companies. Perhaps you can offer some evidence to back up this assertion.

It would not be beyond the bounds of possibility to insist strengthening on key dates within franchise specs?

I guess so – but you would look stupid when, say, City were draw away at Plymouth Argyle! The draw was made less than a month ago, with several ties still to be decided. Then you have to wait to find out who the TV wants to cover then what time kick off that gives you etc. Hard to make arrangements in such a short space of time.

It isn’t 1967 and throwing on a number of short notice special trains to cater for a one off flow is almost impossible. EMT can do it from time to time as they have slack in their HST fleet usage meaning spare stock is available, especially at weekends. Although a cavalcade of pacers from Middlesbrough to Manchester might be fun or the clubs could hire in resource it is often much easier for the club just to hire in a fleet of coaches and transport everyone in one easily controllable manner to and from the ground.

 

[higthomas]

Morning trip-
Which services will be the busiest? It doesn't matter, strengthen all of them.
How busy will they actually be? Assume very.
What do you do with the train now? Let it sit around.

Afternoon trip-
What time is the game supposed to finish? Read the programme
Which service are you going to put the LHCS on? All of them.
What happens if there is extra time? Have LHCS specials running all evening.
What happens if there are penalties? Ditto.
What happens if everyone goes to the pub to celebrate/console themselves? Ditto.
Which service are you putting the LHCS on again? All of them

Who's going to pay for it? The great pie in the sky full of money, otherwise known as the taxpayer.
What will happen when we don't have enough LHCS to fulfill this grand plan? Use all those extra carriges that just sit around all weekend doing absolutly nothing.

Easy isn't it!

Very!

 

[306024]

The draw was made less than a month ago, with several ties still to be decided. Then you have to wait to find out who the TV wants to cover then what time kick off that gives you etc. Hard to make arrangements in such a short space of time.

Unless it is your normal operational area, by the time you have got all the answers you need to commit to running a special train the game will have kicked off. Road coaches are simply more flexible and easier to arrange.

Certainly isn't easy, but that is what AGA have to do for all Spurs home games, regardless of opposition, and pre planned engineering work. Add in the possibility of extra time and penalties and you need a plan B and plan C.

Of course next season LOROL are responsible for most services via White Hart Lane, while AGA have Northumberland Park. Stitching that lot together at short notice will be interesting with both sides looking for paths and platforms at Liverpool St.

Call me a cynic but I'm sure this thread has less to do with transporting football supporters, and more to do with enthusiasts looking for a rare train to ride on.

 

[telstarbox]

Coaches are also preferred by the Police who have a major say in the arrangements for football matches, as they can control the movement of away fans more easily.

 

[455driver]

Who's going to pay for it? The great pie in the sky full of money, otherwise known as the taxpayer.
What will happen when we don't have enough LHCS to fulfil this grand plan? Use all those extra carriages that just sit around all weekend doing absolutely nothing.

Very!

As it is soooooo easy can you give me a list of the 30 available rakes of coaches, the 60 locos, the 90 or 120 drivers and guards with the necessary route and traction knowledge etc then! :roll:

 

[LeylandLen]

Coaches are also preferred by the Police who have a major say in the arrangements for football matches, as they can control the movement of away fans more easily.

If an away support of, say 5000, is to travel and each coach carries approx. 50 passengers, then about 100 coaches would be needed. Imagine trying to park them at somewhere like Arsenal or Chelsea in central London.!! Also, are 2 drivers required for longer trips? That 200 drivers !Bradford City took a few thousand to Chelsea last Sat. I could not find any special trains laid on so presume service trains very busy into Kings Cross. Also 100 coaches add up to a lot of congestion ! And some of the new ones are so big ! Obviously a lot would travel in shared cars and minibuses .

Can someone tell me the max capacity of say an EMT HST used for St Pancras Sheffield, first and second class, and an 11car Pendelino ?

 

[Hadders]

Balancing what I have just posted with rugby, which bright spark thought of a millenium stadium event on a Friday evening. Just when capacity through Cardiff Central is at its most stretched.

The television companies whose money is worth more than the paying crowd!

 

[CockneySparrow]

If an away support of, say 5000, is to travel and each coach carries approx. 50 passengers, then about 100 coaches would be needed. Imagine trying to park them at somewhere like Arsenal or Chelsea in central London.!! Also, are 2 drivers required for longer trips? That 200 drivers !Bradford City took a few thousand to Chelsea last Sat. I could not find any special trains laid on so presume service trains very busy into Kings Cross. Also 100 coaches add up to a lot of congestion ! And some of the new ones are so big ! Obviously a lot would travel in shared cars and minibuses .

Can someone tell me the max capacity of say an EMT HST used for St Pancras Sheffield, first and second class, and an 11car Pendelino ?

They would park up in the Bounds Green area
--- old post above --- --- new post below ---
Another note is that not only is it perhaps difficult to get some slam door carriages for such events but these type of trains are slow, not just slow very slow and with an already overcrowded network it would cause more problems and delays to following trains, the track line speed needs to be considered, I remember a couple of years ago GA run such a train from Norwich to Peterborough for the cup game and the timings were very poor

Problem is that people who don't know nothing about the railway see track and empty carriages in a siding and don't understand, its the same as a so called football fan in the pub who have never played the game understand nothing see their team go a goal down or miss a couple of chances or their favourite player is on the bench so they hurl a load of abuse at the TV

 

[higthomas]

As it is soooooo easy can you give me a list of the 30 available rakes of coaches, the 60 locos, the 90 or 120 drivers and guards with the necessary route and traction knowledge etc then! :roll:

...I was joking...

 

[DarloRich]

.......Call me a cynic but I'm sure this thread has less to do with transporting football supporters, and more to do with enthusiasts looking for a rare train to ride on.

Surely not

If an away support of, say 5000, is to travel and each coach carries approx. 50 passengers, then about 100 coaches would be needed. Imagine trying to park them at somewhere like Arsenal or Chelsea in central London.!! Also, are 2 drivers required for longer trips? That 200 drivers !Bradford City took a few thousand to Chelsea last Sat. I could not find any special trains laid on so presume service trains very busy into Kings Cross. Also 100 coaches add up to a lot of congestion ! And some of the new ones are so big ! Obviously a lot would travel in shared cars and minibuses .

Can someone tell me the max capacity of say an EMT HST used for St Pancras Sheffield, first and second class, and an 11car Pendelino ?

Using large number of coaches for football happens fairly often. Of course, unless mandated by the police, the coach isn't the only option

 

[30907]

Bradford City took a few thousand to Chelsea last Sat. I could not find any special trains laid on so presume service trains very busy into Kings Cross.

So I believe.
IIRC there was a special on a recent Wembley occasion but there were probably more than a mere 5000 City fans involved so the market share wasn't huge, and there was a certain amount of lead time to arrange things.

 

[tadhatter]

Luton Town chartered a pendolino for their Conference play-off final at Eastlands (Man City's ground) in May 2011 from Milton Keynes to Manchester Picadilly.

I've no idea how well patronised or successful it was. We were all too busy being depressed at the final whistle and I didn't travel on it anyway.

 

[455driver]

...I was joking...

Yeah of course, with the angry smillie on the end it is sooo obvious you were joking! :roll:

 

[D6975]

Why Northern?

Surely the bulk of a Middlesboro-Manchester ticket's income goes to TPX?

I don't think it's even possible to do on Northern only, although a fair bit of it could be done on Northern stoppers (at considerable time penalty)

edit - just put it into NRE and it doesn't even offer via Darlington most of the time, it only offers the direct TPX service for most of the day.

 

[61653 HTAFC]

Why Northern?

Surely the bulk of a Middlesboro-Manchester ticket's income goes to TPX?

I don't think it's even possible to do on Northern only, although a fair bit of it could be done on Northern stoppers (at considerable time penalty)

edit - just put it into NRE and it doesn't even offer via Darlington most of the time, it only offers the direct TPX service for most of the day.

The lack of any Northern service between Darlington and York means you'd have to go via Durham Coast, Newcastle, Carlisle, then either down the S&C to Leeds, then Calder Valley or Huddersfield stoppers to Victoria; or down the Cumbrian Coast to Preston!
Think you'd definitely need at least one night in a hotel if you were planning to go to the match!

 

[30907]

Was the Tweeter travelling from M'boro? Could even have been a City fan?