First South West (Kernow & Buses of Somerset)

[TheGrandWazoo]

That's to stop anyone getting goosed for Christmas.

For jokes that bad, you should be reported to the old BILL

 

[Busaholic]

For jokes that bad, you should be reported to the old BILL

I'd duck and dive to avoid that - I'm too chicken

 

[83G/84D]

Along with the usual coaches on rail replacement work at Plymouth tonight is Vario 52554 on a stopper from Plymouth to Liskeard. I could have caught this rather than the fast coach as when I got to Liskeard I had an hour to wait for the next train west. Hopefully a Vario appears next weekend on rail replacement duties.
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Both First Kernow Varios were at Camborne today and 52554 was seen departing. The driver said it was going to Plymouth for next weekends Rail replacement works. When I said "why today/so early" he said it would probably take two days to get there!

 

[Busaholic]

Along with the usual coaches on rail replacement work at Plymouth tonight is Vario 52554 on a stopper from Plymouth to Liskeard. I could have caught this rather than the fast coach as when I got to Liskeard I had an hour to wait for the next train west. Hopefully a Vario appears next weekend on rail replacement duties.
--- old post above --- --- new post below ---
Both First Kernow Varios were at Camborne today and 52554 was seen departing. The driver said it was going to Plymouth for next weekends Rail replacement works. When I said "why today/so early" he said it would probably take two days to get there!

52554 has been a regular on the 16 and 11 these last few weeks - last spotted on 8th p.m.

 

[South Westerly]

52554 has been a regular on the 16 and 11 these last few weeks - last spotted on 8th p.m.

Both Varios are expected to run until the DDA deadline. More buses are due in the next fortnight ready for the 5 Jan increase in pvr.

 

[TheGrandWazoo]

Both Varios are expected to run until the DDA deadline. More buses are due in the next fortnight ready for the 5 Jan increase in pvr.

Any clues as to how many, what type and where from?

 

[South Westerly]

Any clues as to how many, what type and where from?

Afraid not. Complicated cascades again, and involving non DDA buses in the short term in other parts of the South West.

 

[Goldfish62]

Both Varios are expected to run until the DDA deadline. More buses are due in the next fortnight ready for the 5 Jan increase in pvr.

And they can of course still be used on rail replacement services after 31st December as these are exempt from DDA (I believe).

 

[richw]

And they can of course still be used on rail replacement services after 31st December as these are exempt from DDA (I believe).

Only those operating a timetabled service are covered by this DDA deadline.

 

[83G/84D]

The Bristol VR & Bristol Lodekka that were used on the seasonal service 300 were apparently both used on services in connection with late night shopping in Truro yesterday.

The VR was noted with "18 Truro" on the destination blind. Anyone see or photograph them? i'd love to see some photo's.

 

[richw]

The Bristol VR & Bristol Lodekka that were used on the seasonal service 300 were apparently both used on services in connection with late night shopping in Truro yesterday.

The VR was noted with "18 Truro" on the destination blind. Anyone see or photograph them? i'd love to see some photo's.

One of my Flickr contacts has a picture of them together both displaying 18 Truro.

 

[swifty]

The Bristol VR & Bristol Lodekka that were used on the seasonal service 300 were apparently both used on services in connection with late night shopping in Truro yesterday.

The VR was noted with "18 Truro" on the destination blind. Anyone see or photograph them? i'd love to see some photo's.

Here you go! https://flic.kr/p/qk2tL9

 

[TheGrandWazoo]

Afraid not. Complicated cascades again, and involving non DDA buses in the short term in other parts of the South West.

Something along the lines of...

Solars into Camborne from Reading, displace Eclipses to Taunton and that enables B7L Eclipses to be swapped with B10BLEs in Bath that then move to Somerset and displace nonDDA Darts to Kernow.

 

[CD]

Any clues as to how many, what type and where from?

Olympians 34044 and 34167 have moved from Weymouth to Taunton, so could be on the way to Cornwall.

 

[South Westerly]

Something along the lines of...

Solars into Camborne from Reading, displace Eclipses to Taunton and that enables B7L Eclipses to be swapped with B10BLEs in Bath that then move to Somerset and displace nonDDA Darts to Kernow.

All except the last bit, which I believe is actually EL darts to scrap!

I believe it's non DDA Bristol B6s to Plymouth to release DDA Darts to Kernow.
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Olympians 34044 and 34167 have moved from Weymouth to Taunton, so could be on the way to Cornwall.

This is a loan and the Olympians have to be returned by Spring. It's to replace the S reg ex Bolton Olympian at Taunton that is parked up with corrosion issues. The Somerset S/AAE Olympians are dropping like flies with chassis corrosion and I understand that this is all a short term solution until newer deckers arrive in Somerset for the 21.

 

[baza585]

All except the last bit, which I believe is actually EL darts to scrap!

I believe it's non DDA Bristol B6s to Plymouth to release DDA Darts to Kernow.
--- old post above --- --- new post below ---


This is a loan and the Olympians have to be returned by Spring. It's to replace the S reg ex Bolton Olympian at Taunton that is parked up with corrosion issues. The Somerset S/AAE Olympians are dropping like flies with chassis corrosion and I understand that this is all a short term solution until newer deckers arrive in Somerset for the 21.

2 Southampton W reg. B7TLs have arrived in Weymouth to cover for the two loaned Olympians, or possibly to release Weymouth's last two non DDA Tridents eastwards; not clear which at this stage.

Fair play to First South West though; there is a good deal of co-operation between opcos to make the Kernow revolution work.

Seems Plymouth is being left to struggle on for the time being though whilst Somerset and Kernow get sorted. Hopefully AC and his management team can turn their attention there soon; it needs it.

Also heard a rumour that Yeovil may be going green at some point??

.

 

[TheGrandWazoo]

All except the last bit, which I believe is actually EL darts to scrap!

I believe it's non DDA Bristol B6s to Plymouth to release DDA Darts to Kernow.
--- old post above --- --- new post below ---


This is a loan and the Olympians have to be returned by Spring. It's to replace the S reg ex Bolton Olympian at Taunton that is parked up with corrosion issues. The Somerset S/AAE Olympians are dropping like flies with chassis corrosion and I understand that this is all a short term solution until newer deckers arrive in Somerset for the 21.

Had subsequently read that at least one B6 had moved from Hengrove to Plymouth. One wonders what the prognosis is for Plymouth....

The later Olympians are very susceptible to chassis corrosion (and they were worked hard)
--- old post above --- --- new post below ---

Also heard a rumour that Yeovil may be going green at some point??

.

Who knows how accurate that rumour is but it would make sense in terms of naturally synergies and even simpler things like having three firms dealing (or possibly dealing) with Somerset CC

 

[Busaholic]

Had subsequently read that at least one B6 had moved from Hengrove to Plymouth. One wonders what the prognosis is for Plymouth....

The later Olympians are very susceptible to chassis corrosion (and they were worked hard)
--- old post above --- --- new post below ---


Who knows how accurate that rumour is but it would make sense in terms of naturally synergies and even simpler things like having three firms dealing (or possibly dealing) with Somerset CC

Do you think First may give up on Plymouth? It's been clear for years that there's barely enough profitable business there for one firm, let alone two.

 

[TheGrandWazoo]

Do you think First may give up on Plymouth? It's been clear for years that there's barely enough profitable business there for one firm, let alone two.

Hmmm..... I usually steer away from such pronouncements as I don't like to think that staff affected may read a raft of speculation from people about their jobs (as well as getting it wrong )

There's one of two things going on here. It could (and I really hope not) that First are running things down (as per Northampton) in readiness for exit.

Alternatively, it could be that the DDA compliant stuff is being moved to Kernow as it's better placed to absorb the depreciation, enabling the Plymouth operation to be more cost efficient and competitive in the meantime

 

[Rich McLean]

Hmmm..... I usually steer away from such pronouncements as I don't like to think that staff affected may read a raft of speculation from people about their jobs (as well as getting it wrong )

There's one of two things going on here. It could (and I really hope not) that First are running things down (as per Northampton) in readiness for exit.

Alternatively, it could be that the DDA compliant stuff is being moved to Kernow as it's better placed to absorb the depreciation, enabling the Plymouth operation to be more cost efficient and competitive in the meantime

The Plymouth Model is to have older vehicles, in order so that fares can be kept low and entice passengers off the more expensive PCB services and onto theirs.

By using older vehicles they can afford to do this, with newer vehicles, they would have to raise prices and even then there is no Guarantee.

I have a feeling they may well keep things low cost, cheap fares down there with old kit for quite a while and then re-asses when it gets reviewed.

Apart from the 2, 15 (Woolwell), 48 and the 93 all the other routes in Plymouth are in direct competition (or near enough) with PCB. (P&R not included).

PCB at some stage may well register a route in competition with the 2, by offering a cross city service to Derriford if they see any weakness and can afford to up the Mileage, but not at present, as PCB need to sort out their PVR issues first

 

[TheGrandWazoo]

The Plymouth Model is to have older vehicles, in order so that fares can be kept low and entice passengers off the more expensive PCB services and onto theirs.

By using older vehicles they can afford to do this, with newer vehicles, they would have to raise prices and even then there is no Guarantee.

What I was driving at with my second point

 

[freetoview33]

I think they are just keeping costs as low as possible for now. See how things go in Cornwall, then reassess things at a later point. I think the Plymouth ops could do well but would again require big investment, which I can't see in the short term maybe 2016/17? Just an idea (Not that I know much about the area) would/could Target Travel be an attractive acquisition for First?

 

[TheGrandWazoo]

I think they are just keeping costs as low as possible for now. See how things go in Cornwall, then reassess things at a later point. I think the Plymouth ops could do well but would again require big investment, which I can't see in the short term maybe 2016/17? Just an idea (Not that I know much about the area) would/could Target Travel be an attractive acquisition for First?

That's the flip side in that it would require a lot of investment. I assume its the last few DDA Darts being moved away and that would leave AFAIK, just the Torpoint and Dartmouth Tridents, and the P&R fleets (B7L/Trident/e400) with any depreciation. That's a very elderly fleet.

That may be ok in hanging in for a while but merely to survive. As has been the case for sometime, it's a case of seeing who blinks first.

 

[Goldfish62]

I think they are just keeping costs as low as possible for now. See how things go in Cornwall, then reassess things at a later point. I think the Plymouth ops could do well but would again require big investment, which I can't see in the short term maybe 2016/17? Just an idea (Not that I know much about the area) would/could Target Travel be an attractive acquisition for First?

Target Travel are up for another PI. Second one within a year - not good.

 

[Robertj21a]

The Plymouth Model is to have older vehicles, in order so that fares can be kept low and entice passengers off the more expensive PCB services and onto theirs.

By using older vehicles they can afford to do this, with newer vehicles, they would have to raise prices and even then there is no Guarantee.

I have a feeling they may well keep things low cost, cheap fares down there with old kit for quite a while and then re-asses when it gets reviewed.

Apart from the 2, 15 (Woolwell), 48 and the 93 all the other routes in Plymouth are in direct competition (or near enough) with PCB. (P&R not included).

PCB at some stage may well register a route in competition with the 2, by offering a cross city service to Derriford if they see any weakness and can afford to up the Mileage, but not at present, as PCB need to sort out their PVR issues first

As someone who has lost touch a bit with the Plymouth area in recent times, can anyone briefly outline what the First fleet there comprises at the moment ? How many deckers/saloons etc - Thanks.

 

[richw]

As someone who has lost touch a bit with the Plymouth area in recent times, can anyone briefly outline what the First fleet there comprises at the moment ? How many deckers/saloons etc - Thanks.

A full fleet list can be found here:

http://www.ukbuses.co.uk/fleet/fdc.pdf

 

[TheGrandWazoo]

A full fleet list can be found here:

http://www.ukbuses.co.uk/fleet/fdc.pdf

Should be 95% accurate but don't treat as gospel!

 

[richw]

Should be 95% accurate but don't treat as gospel!

I haven't seen anything that stands out as incorrect, other than very recent changes.

 

[TheGrandWazoo]

I haven't seen anything that stands out as incorrect, other than very recent changes.

Really? 34621 is there... That's been preserved for the last three years. Think the only closed top of that batch still extant is 34615 (and two of the others went to Weymouth years ago)

34336 - was that ever FDC?

32523/4 - have never left Halifax

Don't get me wrong. They have a hard job to keep on top of things but as I say, treat with care.

 

[richw]

Really? 34621 is there... That's been preserved for the last three years. Think the only closed top of that batch still extant is 34615 (and two of the others went to Weymouth years ago)

34336 - was that ever FDC?

32523/4 - have never left Halifax

Don't get me wrong. They have a hard job to keep on top of things but as I say, treat with care.

I had only really paid attention to cornwall, which seems pretty accurate