Do both Two Together Railcard holders need the same tickets for their journey?

[politicfool]

With a Two Together railcard do both ticket holders have to hold the same tickets for the journey, or simply travel together?

Example scenarios where Persons A and B hold a Two Together railcard:

• Person A has a season ticket covering the entire journey, Person B doesn't
• Person A has a season ticket covering part of the journey, so can take advantage of Section 19(c) when purchasing a ticket for the remainder. Person B does not have a season ticket, so cannot use 19(c).
• Person A has just enough East Coast Rewards points to get themselves a free single ticket, Person B doesn't

In these cases can the railcard discount be used separately by Persons A and B to buy the individual tickets they need for the journey they are making together (which might be no tickets at all for Person A)? Or do the same tickets need to be held by both?

Many thanks.

 

[gordonthemoron]

person B can purchase a discounted ticket at least in the first case. I think that TVMs will allow purchase of such a ticket (I'd thought you'd have to use a ticket office), I have used a two together in such circumstances

 

[hairyhandedfool]

....Person A has a season ticket covering the entire journey, Person B doesn't....

The terms of the Railcard imply that both people have to buy discounted tickets, though it is not specifically said. However, there is an example for the Family & Friends Railcard which allows one person to have a discount and the other not.

....Person A has a season ticket covering part of the journey, so can take advantage of Section 19(c) when purchasing a ticket for the remainder. Person B does not have a season ticket, so cannot use 19(c)....

It will depend on who you ask. I know of clerks that would allow it and clerks that would not.

....Person A has just enough East Coast Rewards points to get themselves a free single ticket, Person B doesn't
[/LIST]....

I don't believe there is a specific indication either way, but see the two notes above.

 

[Bletchleyite]

FWIW this scenario is explicitly allowed for the Gold Card, but not mentioned at all for the Network Railcard.

Neil

 

[CyrusWuff]

Whilst it may theoretically be acceptable to only purchase one discounted ticket in the scenarios mentioned, the odds against being able to do so are rather high as it depends on the ticket machine (be that staff or passenger operated) being programmed to allow them to be purchased other than in pairs.

 

[politicfool]

Thanks everyone. It seems clear as mud!

Another scenario - what if Person A had expected to travel alone and bought a non-discounted ticket, but then subsequently Person B decided to go along for the journey - would Person B be able to buy a discounted ticket?

Whilst it may theoretically be acceptable to only purchase one discounted ticket in the scenarios mentioned, the odds against being able to do so are rather high as it depends on the ticket machine (be that staff or passenger operated) being programmed to allow them to be purchased other than in pairs.

Wouldn't machines have to allow single purchases so that the two railcard holders can pay separately, even if they turn up at the ticket office together? The Railcard publicity does say that you can get a railcard together with any other person, not just your partner, and gives the specific example of co-workers with whom you travel regularly. Many companies' expense controls (including mine!) require rail tickets to be purchased on the corporate credit card of the person traveling.

 

[hairyhandedfool]

Thanks everyone. It seems clear as mud!

Another scenario - what if Person A had expected to travel alone and bought a non-discounted ticket, but then subsequently Person B decided to go along for the journey - would Person B be able to buy a discounted ticket?....

Pretty much the same as point one or three I think.

...Wouldn't machines have to allow single purchases so that the two railcard holders can pay separately, even if they turn up at the ticket office together? The Railcard publicity does say that you can get a railcard together with any other person, not just your partner, and gives the specific example of co-workers with whom you travel regularly. Many companies' expense controls (including mine!) require rail tickets to be purchased on the corporate credit card of the person traveling.

Most ticket office machines can accept multiple payment methods for one transaction.

 

[razor89]

Whilst it may theoretically be acceptable to only purchase one discounted ticket in the scenarios mentioned, the odds against being able to do so are rather high as it depends on the ticket machine (be that staff or passenger operated) being programmed to allow them to be purchased other than in pairs.

STAR at least will only allow you to sell Two Together discounted tickets in pairs.

 

[maniacmartin]

Will the TIS allow two to be sold, and then one of them to be subsequently voided? Or would that create accounting problems for the clerk?

 

[gordonthemoron]

Bedford ticket office and LM TVMs can sell individual tt discounted tickets

 

[RJ]

I can and would do it where I work.

 

[hairyhandedfool]

Will the TIS allow two to be sold, and then one of them to be subsequently voided? Or would that create accounting problems for the clerk?

IIRC, FasTis will, not sure about Smart, but STAR doesn't like to play ball. It would be possible to manually enter a fare I think, but I'm not sure if many clerks would be willing to do that.

 

[razor89]

IIRC, FasTis will, not sure about Smart, but STAR doesn't like to play ball. It would be possible to manually enter a fare I think, but I'm not sure if many clerks would be willing to do that.

I have to say I wouldn't be willing to do a manual fare as I would not be 100% confident that the resulting ticket would be correct. I think it would be possible though to issue the two tickets and then immediately non-issue one of them. Obviously for cash it wouldn't be a problem but for cards this would mean a partial refund onto the passengers card.

 

[CyrusWuff]

Will the TIS allow two to be sold, and then one of them to be subsequently voided? Or would that create accounting problems for the clerk?

Haven't tried it, but I suspect FasTIS would prompt you to non-issue both tickets. It certainly won't let you put two in the basket and void one before issue, nor will it let you issue them individually.

 

[hairyhandedfool]

.... It certainly won't let you put two in the basket and void one before issue....

That's interesting because I recall the instructions for issuing an extra ticket with a F&F Railcard was to put the Adult and Child ticket in the basket and then void one.

 

[trentside]

Perhaps unsurprisingly, Avantix will allow you to apply a Two Together discount to be applied to only one ticket.

 

[causton]

Yes, Tribute will pop up a box saying passenger conditions not met, but knows you are smart enough to double check and will give a fare for one!

 

[CyrusWuff]

That's interesting because I recall the instructions for issuing an extra ticket with a F&F Railcard was to put the Adult and Child ticket in the basket and then void one.

It's possible with Family & Friends, Network, Network Gold Card and Forces Railcard discounts, and the various "flat fares" provided by Govia TOCs, but not with Two Together Railcards or Groupsave.