Early Mk 3 haulage query

[kermit]

Unable to locate slide of Deltic hauled mk3s but found image of Class 86 hauled Euston - Manchester service back in 1974 at Stockport with mk3 prototype Buffet/Kitchen vehicle in a mk2d rake (4th coach) Also a shot of Western Class 52 at Exeter St David's on a Paddington service formed of mk2d air conditioned stock in 1975. Being new to this Iam not sure if I have been successful in attaching these, if not they are available to view in my pictures, also just to add these are poor quality screen shots as scanner has been playing up.

That's actually a very evocative shot of the 86 in the (presumably brief) overlap between headcodes being displayed, and the introduction of Mk3 stock - and very well spotted at that, the skirt being the main giveaway!

Remembering how often Westerns were still found on express work in 1975 - were uncomfortable, unlit, unheated and unventilated journeys out of Paddington quite commonplace with Mk2d air conditioned stock back then?

 

[Ash Bridge]

That's actually a very evocative shot of the 86 in the (presumably brief) overlap between headcodes being displayed, and the introduction of Mk3 stock - and very well spotted at that, the skirt being the main giveaway!

Remembering how often Westerns were still found on express work in 1975 - were uncomfortable, unlit, unheated and unventilated journeys out of Paddington quite commonplace with Mk2d air conditioned stock back then?

I would have thought quite rare back then really, funnily enough when looking at the slides (presume you saw the Western shot in my pictures because it didn't attach) there's a shot of the following service to Paddington with older stock but hauled by a Class 50 which are eth fitted! Back to the 86 did you also notice the lack of flexicoil springing? Plus the mk3 was in the original predominately grey with blue window surrounds (Pullman style) livery.

 

[edwin_m]

These prototype Mk3s were presumably the ones used in the prototype HST. I seem to recall this having standard ETS jumpers, with the non-standard three-phase system only coming in with the production units which therefore couldn't have the heating and A/C powered by normal locos.

 

[Ash Bridge]

These prototype Mk3s were presumably the ones used in the prototype HST. I seem to recall this having standard ETS jumpers, with the non-standard three-phase system only coming in with the production units which therefore couldn't have the heating and A/C powered by normal locos.

That was the question I kept meaning to ask about the prototype HST. The trailers were also buffer fitted unlike the production series were they not? Also are there not a handful of these prototypes still in service with I think FGW? You could always tell them internally from the central saloon partitions which were solid and unglazed I think on the prototypes.

 

[Ash Bridge]

Hopefully here's an additional shot of a Class 52 on mk2d ac stock.

 

[Taunton]

Remembering how often Westerns were still found on express work in 1975 - were uncomfortable, unlit, unheated and unventilated journeys out of Paddington quite commonplace with Mk2d air conditioned stock back then?

Surprising, I never saw it happen. The Mk 2 air-con stock on the WR was only used initially on Bristol/South Wales services, with Class 47/4, until the HSTs came along, while the remaining Westerns were getting confined to the West of England and pretty much gone before the AC stock was moved on to the WofE services.

I am just wondering, that's not the rake which had a generator car in an adapted BG attached to the other end is it? And do I recall correctly that in the Western Mk 2 AC sets they were normally, from the Paddington end, BG 3FO RB 5SO, while this photo has a seated vehicle at the London end.

 

[Ash Bridge]

Surprising, I never saw it happen. The Mk 2 air-con stock on the WR was only used initially on Bristol/South Wales services, with Class 47/4, until the HSTs came along, while the remaining Westerns were getting confined to the West of England and pretty much gone before the AC stock was moved on to the WofE services.

I am just wondering, that's not the rake which had a generator car in an adapted BG attached to the other end is it? And do I recall correctly that in the Western Mk 2 AC sets they were normally, from the Paddington end, BG 3FO RB 5SO, while this photo has a seated vehicle at the London end.

Must add that I took this shot back in early October 1975, did'nt think the generator car existed then, but I stand to be corrected on that. Finally looking at the coaches, the first three look to be 2nd. Opens followed by a mk1 (possibly catering)vehicle, the loco incidentally is D1046 Western Marquis.

 

[Taunton]

Oh well, there's a photo to prove what we would have said didn't happen!

By summer 1967 the pioneer NBL D600 Warships were at the end of their time, eking out odd freight turns ...... weren't they? However, one quiet sunny afternoon that year at Taunton, what's this rumbling into the station from the west but none other than D602 Bulldog, nicely turned out in blue and with a fully blue/grey train (by no means universal then), looking for all the world like a contemporary express loco. I didn't have a camera but I was there to see it. You can just imagine the conversation at Laira before they set off.

Driver : "WHAT. Some mistake here".

Foreman : "'fraid not, 'ee be all us have got left. It's that or two D6300 in multiple".

Driver : "Oh. OK. In that case I'll take it quick before you change your mind .....".

In truth one of the few redeeming features of the D600 (and there were apparently only a few) was that the 6-axle bogies gave a very smooth, quiet and comfortable ride, certainly compared to the "bucking bronco" D800s that followed.

 

[Ash Bridge]

Would have given anything (well almost) to have seen those in service,and to apply blue livery just a few months from withdrawral?

 

[Bevan Price]

Yes you are correct and it was basically tough on the passengers!
The fans would run and the lights would go onto emergency but if it was a hot day then the coach got very hot inside.

Many of the Birmingham drags were worked by Saltley drivers, who seemed to "know" all classes of diesel. They were generally booked for Class 47/4, but somehow it often happened that there were insufficient 47/4s available on Sundays.....

I can't remember if pairs of 25s were ever used on these services, but it would not surprise me.

 

[455driver]

I can't remember if pairs of 25s were ever used on these services, but it would not surprise me.

It would surprise me if it didn't happen, although 25s were not exactly smooth at speed.
I am sure Saltley men tried to outdo each other with their weird trips, one of the best must surely have been when a driver was told to take 56059 and haul a failed XC HST from Birmingham to Plymouth, but the driver thought they said 58002, cue lots of phone calls when they realised what was happening but the loco was attached so it was too late to do anything about it, end result the first (and last?) case of a 58 on a scheduled passenger service to Plymouth .

 

[fowler9]

I would have thought quite rare back then really, funnily enough when looking at the slides (presume you saw the Western shot in my pictures because it didn't attach) there's a shot of the following service to Paddington with older stock but hauled by a Class 50 which are eth fitted! Back to the 86 did you also notice the lack of flexicoil springing? Plus the mk3 was in the original predominately grey with blue window surrounds (Pullman style) livery.

First thing I thought when I saw your picture was about the massive looking hunks of iron the wheels seemed to be attached to. Ha ha. They were more common when I was younger.