First West of England (Bristol, Bath & The West)

[TheGrandWazoo]

Some non FSA questions. How many of the Taunton B7Ls are still working in Somerset? What's the latest state of play on the cascades?

Also, when does the Truro park and ride change/expand? It's been reported that the council not First will supply the vehicles. This true, and what are they getting?

 

[Private Baxter]

I couldn't really do a pub crawl on the 376 - all the pubs along this way are slowly fading away - Temple Inn - gone, Warwick Arms - too stuck up and expensive, Camelot Inn - Impossible to get to - all the good ones are not so easy to get to!

Wells do seem to be very short at the moment. They have 1 bus in the depot as a spare all the time - I have seen 2 buses in, but have assumed this other one will go out on another duty (i.e. 375, 173, 377 or X75).

Today I saw/assumed the following - 161 - 41144 and 46603 were on there; X75 - 43849 was on this and assumed two ALX200s were on this; 377 - assumed 66100 (saw this one this evening), 66107 & 66160, as 66108 was in the depot this morning; 375 - assuming the other ALX200 and a B7 were on there; the 02 plate B7 and 2 69*** range were on 173; therefore leaving 7 59 plate Eclipse buses on 376 (saw 69446, 69443, 69438, 69440, 69448). 69442 was in the depot this evening and 66108 wasn't - therefore assuming this was on 375.

It's as a driver said to me last week - it only needs 1 person to be sick on one bus, a puncher on another and a break down and Wells has to start cancelling journeys - not good.

Whilst we are on the subject of Wells, got a response from First and the traffic commissioner to say they are looking into the poor performance of the 376. Could we see some improvements in Nov or Jan/Feb?

Haha, my 376 pub crawl comment was meant partly in jest; I don't think I'd make it all the way to Bristol!

Normally Wells only have two spare buses, one dart, and one B7 or B10. However with 69445 presumed absent atm, with nothing in its place, that must mean there is only one spare!! Serious?!

66355 is currently a regular on the 173, thikb I've seen it on there every day this week. Also one of the AXL darts was on there yesterday. But you're right, clearly not in a good position, should even one bus break down. Unfortunately all depots appear to be short atm.

What's the situation with the 376? Yoiu say it's performing badly. This is slightly unusual, especially after all that talk recently about overcrowding along certain sections. I suppose the Wells to Street section might be a bit thin, simply due to all the other services going that way, but then I'm pretty sure that isn't the issue.

 

[ValleyLines142]

Your friend who drove down the bus lane, although he might be lucky because AFAIK South Glos don't bother to enforce their bus lanes!

I know, it was a nightmare. We had to turn around then because a man had fallen unconscious in the middle of the road so a parademic blocked the bus lane off. We then had to do a u-turn and just as we turned around a police car came to attend the incident so very lucky!

Just praying she doesn't get a fine as to be fair Kingswood is an absolute nigjtmare to drive through! (it's bad enough on the 43!)

 

[THarris123]

Haha, my 376 pub crawl comment was meant partly in jest; I don't think I'd make it all the way to Bristol!

Normally Wells only have two spare buses, one dart, and one B7 or B10. However with 69445 presumed absent atm, with nothing in its place, that must mean there is only one spare!! Serious?!

66355 is currently a regular on the 173, thikb I've seen it on there every day this week. Also one of the AXL darts was on there yesterday. But you're right, clearly not in a good position, should even one bus break down. Unfortunately all depots appear to be short atm.

What's the situation with the 376? Yoiu say it's performing badly. This is slightly unusual, especially after all that talk recently about overcrowding along certain sections. I suppose the Wells to Street section might be a bit thin, simply due to all the other services going that way, but then I'm pretty sure that isn't the issue.

Sorry wrong language used. It's not regarding the loadings - they're better than they've ever been. I meant the poor punctuality and reliability of the 376.

 

[ValleyLines142]

Exciting news regarding the X74!

Gemini 37761 has been branded for it! So it will be operated by Geminis! Just saw 37761 on the 43 in town but obviously it's just been prepared for it. Exciting!

 

[ryson357]

Exciting news regarding the X74!

Gemini 37761 has been branded for it! So it will be operated by Geminis! Just saw 37761 on the 43 in town but obviously it's just been prepared for it. Exciting!

What was the branding like? What colour?

 

[swifty]

What was the branding like? What colour?

It'll more than likely be very similar to the X7 branding on the upper deck windows, but still be in standard Olympia livery.

 

[ryson357]

It'll more than likely be very similar to the X7 branding on the upper deck windows, but still be in standard Olympia livery.

Yeah, wouldn't surprise me. I imagine it be a pinky colour branding similar to the Olympia livery

 

[TheGrandWazoo]

It'll more than likely be very similar to the X7 branding on the upper deck windows, but still be in standard Olympia livery.

As per the X39 branding that was removed??

 

[ValleyLines142]

Yeah it is just a pink sticker in the window saying £1.50 single anywhere. No side branding, but huge branding on the rear.

37761 was by The Centre on the 43. Of course the X74 isn't running yet but they've obviously branded it ready. I imagine 37760 and 37762 shall follow (although I've seen both lately and not done yet).

So that answers the question as to what will operate the X74. Great to see!

 

[Class 33]

Exciting news regarding the X74!

Gemini 37761 has been branded for it! So it will be operated by Geminis! Just saw 37761 on the 43 in town but obviously it's just been prepared for it. Exciting!

Would have preferred Enviro 400's on this service to be honest! But no seriously, great news that the service will be double decker only served. As single deckers would be too small for this service. Great news too that the buses used will have special X74 branding to them too.

In other news, the axing of the 20 and Daniel Farr's campaign to save it was mentioned on the news on Jack FM today. Might possibly be on ITV News Westcountry and/or Points West tonight too, if not then maybe next week. And there's a petition page for the Save the 20, which currently has 80 signatures. http://saveour20bus.bristolpetitions.com

 

[swifty]

Yeah it is just a pink sticker in the window saying £1.50 single anywhere. No side branding, but huge branding on the rear.

That'll be the cheap fares they've been on about, but what about the 'Great £1 student fares' that have been mentioned for all First routes that serve a UWE campus?

Also slightly on topic, whilst mentioning UWE, Wessex have revised their fares too, and tickets are now valid on all Wessex and WessexStar services.

http://www.wessexbus.com/news/ChangestoServicesOperatingtoUWE_257.html

I also found this on flickr of two of the Tridents on their way to Bristol, https://www.flickr.com/photos/46868364@N04/14732173959/.

 

[TheGrandWazoo]

Would have preferred Enviro 400's on this service to be honest! But no seriously, great news that the service will be double decker only served. As single deckers would be too small for this service. Great news too that the buses used will have special X74 branding to them too.

In other news, the axing of the 20 and Daniel Farr's campaign to save it was mentioned on the news on Jack FM today. Might possibly be on ITV News Westcountry and/or Points West tonight too, if not then maybe next week. And there's a petition page for the Save the 20, which currently has 80 signatures. http://saveour20bus.bristolpetitions.com

I had fully expected 2006 Darts but I hope that First's optimism is justified. As this takes another 3 DDs from an already stretched LH, does this mean that the Tridents that are stated due for HE will help displace some B7TLs to LH?

80 signatures to save the 20 doesn't sound many

 

[CD]

Some non FSA questions. How many of the Taunton B7Ls are still working in Somerset? What's the latest state of play on the cascades?

Also, when does the Truro park and ride change/expand? It's been reported that the council not First will supply the vehicles. This true, and what are they getting?

Only been to Taunton once in the last two weeks (this Wednesday). But from what I saw little if anything has changed recently. Believe 60911-15 still there and the "expected" 40580/81 have not arrived. Even Marshall Capitals Dart which was expected to be withdrawn at the end of July is still in service. Bridgwater Olympians 34179/89 still at Taunton with Tridents 33381/82 at Bridgwater in their place. Though this is thought only until all the ex Glasgow Tridents are in a fit condition to be trusted on the 21.

 

[South Westerly]

Only been to Taunton once in the last two weeks (this Wednesday). But from what I saw little if anything has changed recently. Believe 60911-15 still there and the "expected" 40580/81 have not arrived. Even Marshall Capitals Dart which was expected to be withdrawn at the end of July is still in service. Bridgwater Olympians 34179/89 still at Taunton with Tridents 33381/82 at Bridgwater in their place. Though this is thought only until all the ex Glasgow Tridents are in a fit condition to be trusted on the 21.

As of last week there were 5 B7Ls there, three still required for the 28, the other two awaiting transfer to Plymouth in exchange for the last two DDA B6s. This is only taking time because the two B6s are being painted before they leave Plymouth, and the number of vehicle changes within First SW is being controlled to prevent it overwhelming day to day operational ability.

The Marshall Dart was not meant to go in July, but that and two of the remaining East Lancs Darts will be leaving shortly, replaced by four Plaxton Darts transferring up from First Hampshire Dorset and Berkshire as medium term replacements to see off the most tired Darts.

The Glasgow Tridents are all in service. The swap around was to get Tridents onto the 21 while schools are off. More Tridents are expected but not confirmed yet, with a view to seeing off probably 5 of the last 7 remaining Olympians.

With the commonwealth games now over and the new vehicles entering service with their intended companies, there are a significant number of vehicles becoming available within First. Some are not DDA but are replacing older vehicles where they are better, like two Cymru Olympians going to Cornwall, and the Darts from First HDB going to BoS. Some are able to be converted to DDA and available to transfer. There are some DDA buses too, like Tridents. Expect quite a few changes in the area therefore in coming weeks and months.

 

[Class 33]

I had fully expected 2006 Darts but I hope that First's optimism is justified. As this takes another 3 DDs from an already stretched LH, does this mean that the Tridents that are stated due for HE will help displace some B7TLs to LH?

80 signatures to save the 20 doesn't sound many

Tridents due for Hengrove?! I wasn't aware of that! Good stuff! How many of these are we getting? Got a link to a Flickr photo for the particular ones we will be having?

80(edit, currently 86) signatures to save the 20 doesn't sound very many no. But it will only really be people who use the service who sign it. It's not going to get thousands of signatures like the campaign for cheaper Bristol bus fares did. Regardless though, a solution needs to be found regarding the service 20. What with Bristol being awarded 2015 Green Capital and trying to get us out of our cars and onto public transport instead it's ridiculous that there will be areas of Bristol which don't have public transport links anymore. The fit and healthy will probably be able to get by without the 20, albeit at a bit of an inconvenience still with the extra walking involved to use other buses instead. But for the elderly and disabled, there being no 20 anymore will be a massive loss for them and will leave them isolated.

Just one comment from that Save our 20 petition....

As a 92 year old it is my ONLY way of getting down and back into Westbury village to go to the doctors, post office, bank etc. curtailment of this route will totally affect my independence as I am unable to cope with walking back up the hill. My daughter lives the other side of the city and cannot be there to help me with these everyday tasks. This closure will also affect many of my elderly neighbours.

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On another note, I saw a Marshall Dart leaving Bristol Bus Station the other day. But unfortunately didn't catch which service it was working. It departed around 1640. Which service could this possibly have been?

 

[ryson357]

I've signed the petition, but can't see First doing anything about it now but really the council should of stepped in especially wanting to be green capital.
I've seen a marshal on service 121 earlier but that was the 14:30 ish departure

 

[Class 33]

I also found this on flickr of two of the Tridents on their way to Bristol, https://www.flickr.com/photos/46868364@N04/14732173959/.

Oh so it's these buses. Still good buses though. But I didn't think these were called Dennis Tridents, I thought these were called ALX 400 Volvo B7's! I thought Dennis Tridents were like the ones formerly on the Park & Ride services in Bristol and were on such services as the 20, 36, 75 & 76 from late 2011 till early 2013.

 

[iantherev]

Oh so it's these buses. Still good buses though. But I didn't think these were called Dennis Tridents, I thought these were called ALX 400 Volvo B7's! I thought Dennis Tridents were like the ones formerly on the Park & Ride services in Bristol and were on such services as the 20, 36, 75 & 76 from late 2011 till early 2013.

The ALX400 was available on Volvo B7TL, Trident and DAF DB250 low floor. The Trident/ALX400 combination was Stagecoach's standard decker until replaced by the Enviro 400 came along.

 

[baza585]

Oh so it's these buses. Still good buses though. But I didn't think these were called Dennis Tridents, I thought these were called ALX 400 Volvo B7's! I thought Dennis Tridents were like the ones formerly on the Park & Ride services in Bristol and were on such services as the 20, 36, 75 & 76 from late 2011 till early 2013.

They are ALX 400 bodies on Dennis Trident chassis. The P&R Tridents had East Lancs bodies. They are transfers down from Glasgow Parkhead but were originally in service in London, where they will have had a very hard life. They may be good buses but don't bank on it; early Tridents don't have a great reputation for reliability, particularly ex London!

 

[swifty]

Oh so it's these buses. Still good buses though. But I didn't think these were called Dennis Tridents, I thought these were called ALX 400 Volvo B7's! I thought Dennis Tridents were like the ones formerly on the Park & Ride services in Bristol and were on such services as the 20, 36, 75 & 76 from late 2011 till early 2013.

So it turns out we've got 8 of them from Glasgow, hopefully these'll turn out not to be complete dogs!

http://www.swhite.org.uk/steve/aug.htm

 

[overthewater]

So it turns out we've got 8 of them from Glasgow, hopefully these'll turn out not to be complete dogs!

http://www.swhite.org.uk/steve/aug.htm

They are awful, and thats being nice. You can keep them, no really don't let them go.

 

[TheGrandWazoo]

They are ALX 400 bodies on Dennis Trident chassis. The P&R Tridents had East Lancs bodies. They are transfers down from Glasgow Parkhead but were originally in service in London, where they will have had a very hard life. They may be good buses but don't bank on it; early Tridents don't have a great reputation for reliability, particularly ex London!

Yep, early Tridents that've been hammered round London are known for their lack of performance. Have to say they look in reasonable nick externally.

 

[Colly405]

Regarding the 20, I was in Westbury early yesterday afternoon and saw one go through in each direction. The one from town to Southmead (a Marshall Dart) arrived empty and picked up 6 passengers. The one going the other way arrived with 4 on, and left empty.

Also, regarding the x74, great to see that Eclipse Geminis will be used, but how do we know it will be that busy? North of UWE it is replacing the 13, which I have never seen with more than a handful of people on...

 

[THarris123]

What services will the 8 Tridents be used on?

Could it be the 72? Or are we thinking more along the lines of 50/51?

Of what it looks like, a lot of the Tridents in this range (329**) appear to be getting withdrawn. I think this could be a temporary measure for Hengrove - and I expect (to the ringing of certain peoples ears) will be replaced by E400s.

 

[TheGrandWazoo]

Also, regarding the x74, great to see that Eclipse Geminis will be used, but how do we know it will be that busy? North of UWE it is replacing the 13, which I have never seen with more than a handful of people on...

That was my thought. A brand new service so we just don't know. I hope the optimism is rewarded and that it is that popular.
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What services will the 8 Tridents be used on?

Could it be the 72? Or are we thinking more along the lines of 50/51?

I was thinking the latter or possibly just allowing some re jigging and no increase in HEs decker requirement?. If deckers are on the X74, that will further strain LHs decker requirement so wondering if these are to HE allowing some newer deckers to head to LH?
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Tridents due for Hengrove?! I wasn't aware of that! Good stuff! How many of these are we getting? Got a link to a Flickr photo for the particular ones we will be having?

80(edit, currently 86) signatures to save the 20 doesn't sound very many no. But it will only really be people who use the service who sign it. It's not going to get thousands of signatures like the campaign for cheaper Bristol bus fares did. Regardless though, a solution needs to be found regarding the service 20. What with Bristol being awarded 2015 Green Capital and trying to get us out of our cars and onto public transport instead it's ridiculous that there will be areas of Bristol which don't have public transport links anymore. The fit and healthy will probably be able to get by without the 20, albeit at a bit of an inconvenience still with the extra walking involved to use other buses instead. But for the elderly and disabled, there being no 20 anymore will be a massive loss for them and will leave them isolated.

Just one comment from that Save our 20 petition....

Just 86 people, albeit with genuine needs, perhaps highlights that it isn't so emotive. One for BCC to sort out
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What services will the 8 Tridents be used on?

Could it be the 72? Or are we thinking more along the lines of 50/51?

Of what it looks like, a lot of the Tridents in this range (329**) appear to be getting withdrawn. I think this could be a temporary measure for Hengrove - and I expect (to the ringing of certain peoples ears) will be replaced by E400s.

The reason for those Tridents being withdrawn is that (as well as new Streetlites) they got some 51 plates in Glasgow, displaced from Sheffield by new e400s.

I doubt they've a long life and that e400s might appear. I'd not expect a huge number if some do arrive only because I think more Streetlites will come. Replacing non DDA single decks will again be the priority. That's a subject for next years order

 

[THarris123]

That was my thought. A brand new service so we just don't know. I hope the optimism is rewarded and that it is that popular.
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I was thinking the latter or possibly just allowing some re jigging and no increase in HEs decker requirement?. If deckers are on the X74, that will further strain LHs decker requirement so wondering if these are to HE allowing some newer deckers to head to LH?
--- old post above --- --- new post below ---


Just 86 people, albeit with genuine needs, perhaps highlights that it isn't so emotive. One for BCC to sort out
--- old post above --- --- new post below ---


The reason for those Tridents being withdrawn is that (as well as new Streetlites) they got some 51 plates in Glasgow, displaced from Sheffield by new e400s.

I doubt they've a long life and that e400s might appear. I'd not expect a huge number if some do arrive only because I think more Streetlites will come. Replacing non DDA single decks will again be the priority. That's a subject for next years order

Think you're right on this. Don't expect to see those Tridents go anytime soon!

 

[TheGrandWazoo]

As of last week there were 5 B7Ls there, three still required for the 28, the other two awaiting transfer to Plymouth in exchange for the last two DDA B6s. This is only taking time because the two B6s are being painted before they leave Plymouth, and the number of vehicle changes within First SW is being controlled to prevent it overwhelming day to day operational ability.

The Marshall Dart was not meant to go in July, but that and two of the remaining East Lancs Darts will be leaving shortly, replaced by four Plaxton Darts transferring up from First Hampshire Dorset and Berkshire as medium term replacements to see off the most tired Darts.

The Glasgow Tridents are all in service. The swap around was to get Tridents onto the 21 while schools are off. More Tridents are expected but not confirmed yet, with a view to seeing off probably 5 of the last 7 remaining Olympians.

With the commonwealth games now over and the new vehicles entering service with their intended companies, there are a significant number of vehicles becoming available within First. Some are not DDA but are replacing older vehicles where they are better, like two Cymru Olympians going to Cornwall, and the Darts from First HDB going to BoS. Some are able to be converted to DDA and available to transfer. There are some DDA buses too, like Tridents. Expect quite a few changes in the area therefore in coming weeks and months.

Thanks for that. Lots of interesting info there. I suspected that the move of B6s for B7Ls might have been to do with both paintshop capacity and just the number of changes.

Take it that the redundant Darts from FHD are R/S reg but are a stop gap and in better nick underneath than the Sprytes? On FHD enthusiasts site, says that they too may need more deckers for tender work, so more superannuated Tridents?

I had heard it rumoured that the three Olyms that Cymru had would head to Cornwall after the Games. Wonder if the Somerset Olyms might head there though not all machines of that age are great underneath.

 

[Class 33]

Regarding the 20, I was in Westbury early yesterday afternoon and saw one go through in each direction. The one from town to Southmead (a Marshall Dart) arrived empty and picked up 6 passengers. The one going the other way arrived with 4 on, and left empty.

Also, regarding the x74, great to see that Eclipse Geminis will be used, but how do we know it will be that busy? North of UWE it is replacing the 13, which I have never seen with more than a handful of people on...

It doesn't appear to be very busy at off-peak times no. But it must surely be busy during peak morning and evening times? But the axing of this service will leave the elderly, disabled, and people who have problems walking, isolated. They would face for example at least a 20 minute walk to other bus stops to go into town. And for these such people who want to travel from Kellaway Avenue to Westbury on Trym, they would face at least a 40 minute walk each way to get to a bus stop for an alternative bus. Completely unacceptable for a so called European Green Capital!!! Gearge Fergusson should do something about this, instead of all these silly Sunday Fun Days, The Park Street Water Slide, and such like that he keeps bragging about. Do something necessary and essential for Bristol instead!!!

First don't seem interested in saving the service. They say basically "It's not making us any more. Sorry, but we defend our right to withdraw it. There are alternative services the 2 and 76 to use instead if people walk to Gloucester Road or Southmead Road instead.". Bristol City Council don't seem interested, saying they have no control of what First Bristol does.

Allthough the axing of the 20 won't effect me, I really hope the users of the 20 really kick up a fuss about this and that something is done about it. Leaving the elderyly, disabled, etc, isolated with no bus service is unnaceptable.


On a more positive note, I think it's great that the X74 will be an all double decker served. Whilst we don't know for sure yet how busy these services will be, I think putting double deckers on this service is a sensible idea. The service might well not be very busy during Monday-Friday off-peaks, but I think it will be during Monday-Friday peak times and on Saturdays. AND it will also help ease over-crowding on the 73 at these times too. On it's inaugural day of service I will be doing a journey from Bradley Stoke to the Centre, and returning from the Centre to Filton during peak afternoon/early evening times, and will report back on how busy they were.
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Back to the 20, and it appears First might be giving up the 20 allready as according to BristolDanny's Twitter page a number of services not turning up today! https://twitter.com/BristolDanny/with_replies

 

[TheGrandWazoo]

Arguably, if the 20 is busy at peaks and has reasonable trade off peak, then you'd ask a)why are First axing it and b) why isn't someone coming in to register it? Perhaps it's a service that doesn't pay it's way but if there's a social need, BCC should step in.

In news not in Bristol, see Yeovil has now got the 2 2003 Solos that were in Bridgwater. That's almost space age for that depot!