First West of England (Bristol, Bath & The West)

[freetoview33]

Got a reply back from first regarding the 20 and 70 just saying that plans are not yet finalised.

 

[TheGrandWazoo]

60895 was at Bridgwater for about a year before moving to Plymouth. Both 60911 and 60914 have had spells at Bridgwater this year as well.
Yesterday all 4 of 42841-44 were on the 21. I assume their move to Bridgwater is for the 21 shorts which start Monday week, which require 4 additional vehicles.
The 1 yesterday was 43811, 53009 and 53013.
Only saw two of the 3 vehicles on the 14, 53001 and 53014.
The 102 was 34171.

Thanks for that. I don't get down to BR as regularly as I used to but even on my now less frequent trips to there, TN and WsM, I hadn't clocked a 60*** B7L in use on the 21. Funnily enough, was out for a run this morning and suddenly twigged that the four ALX Darts might end up on the short 21s.

Think the Olym on the 102 might've been overkill. Especially for a Saturday as the service gets chopped in a few weeks time. Would've been a nice view leaving Woolavington though!
--- old post above --- --- new post below ---

The Wessex group of 3 services already has that market covered, and from the times I've seen it recently the loads on the deckers have been in single figures at peak times. Admittedly this has been in Central Bristol, so I can't say how busy they are at the other end?

The 71/2 were also extended to Cribbs/Aztec West when they became the U7/8 in a last ditched attempt to attract extra passengers before both were pulled, so one can assume the links didn't prove that popular?

Loadings I've seen on the 3 could've been accommodated with a taxi. A fair bet is that Charlton Hayes will get served by a rerouted (and hopefully enhanced) Thornbury service.

 

[Rich McLean]

Some changes afoot with the Plymouth Operations

Of note, from the end of August, the 4 is no more, with the 1 and 1a doing the same route at PCB 5 & 5a in Saltash.

Meanwhile, First 81/81A only down to operate as far as Torpoint Ferry and will no longer serve HMS Drake. I wonder what will happen to First's bus Garage in Torpoint.

Not sure on the PCB details as of yet, but changes there to. Surprised First are pulling out of Torpoint, and the 4 used to be one of their better .

However, the Bus war continues, but even with higher prices, PCB have the upper hand

 

[South Westerly]

Some changes afoot with the Plymouth Operations

Of note, from the end of August, the 4 is no more, with the 1 and 1a doing the same route at PCB 5 & 5a in Saltash.

Meanwhile, First 81/81A only down to operate as far as Torpoint Ferry and will no longer serve HMS Drake. I wonder what will happen to First's bus Garage in Torpoint.

Not sure on the PCB details as of yet, but changes there to. Surprised First are pulling out of Torpoint, and the 4 used to be one of their better .

However, the Bus war continues, but even with higher prices, PCB have the upper hand

No. The 81/81a still runs across the ferry and Torpoint depot isn't closing. It's just one of the vagaries of VOSA registration descriptions.

 

[Class 33]

I'm sure I've seen double deckers on the 3 going along Filton Road at peak morning times and they're pretty busy.

The Thornbury services should be speeded up a little really. Renumed in the X series and become either limited stop between the bus station and Patchway(Gloucester Road) OR a on a set down only and pick-up only basis along that stretch of the route. For instance on northbound journeys all stops as far as Patchway(Gloucester Road) are pick-up only. And on southbound journeys all stops after Patchway(Gloucester) are set down only stops.

And I think within the next few years an additional city service between the Centre and somewhere around the Patchway, Bradley Stoke, etc area would really be required. Especially when the new housing estate on the former Filton Airfield is open. Would ideally need a bus service diverted off Gloucester Road and into that new estate! Maybe perhaps a slow service 79 to Thornbury?

 

[South Westerly]

Yes that's right. These four Darts are the best of those earmarked for replacement rather than DDA a conversion. They are on the 21 shorts for now, but if yet more Tridents become available after the Commonwealth Games, they will probably be replaced on the shorts by low capacity Tridents, and move on within BoS initially to replace other Darts. The priority is to try and get rid of the East Lancs, Marshall, and old Plaxton Dart.

 

[Rich McLean]

No. The 81/81a still runs across the ferry and Torpoint depot isn't closing. It's just one of the vagaries of VOSA registration descriptions.

Thought that could be the case

 

[THarris123]

What's happened with the 60*** range in Taunton/Bridgwater now. How many are left??

Also, what out of the below list is now left in Taunton/Bridgwater?
34064
34174
34178
34179
34188
34189
34190
41134
42634
42825
42830
42832
42833
42834
42835
53001
53013
53014

I've taken this list out of Steve White's spreadsheet from March, with a few updates. As far as I can tell the majority of all this is still there. Which depot is each now? It's rather confusing!
--- old post above --- --- new post below ---
Also, does anyone know whether all the Marshalls are still at Weston? What services do they do? What will they be replaced by? Streetlites?

I've been assuming for the last couple of years that Streetlites are replacing all the Step down darts and Marshalls. Am I right in thinking this??
--- old post above --- --- new post below ---
Not sure whether anyone has seen, but I've added a new thread for anything about the smaller operators around the Avon/Somerset area - Webberbus included. Feel free to post to this!

 

[Class 33]

And I think within the next few years an additional city service between the Centre and somewhere around the Patchway, Bradley Stoke, etc area would really be required. Especially when the new housing estate on the former Filton Airfield is open. Would ideally need a bus service diverted off Gloucester Road and into that new estate! Maybe perhaps a slow service 79 to Thornbury?

Also once this new estate opens up there would be road access opened up via Charlton Road as well. So there could be a new service running that route.

Just some imaginary ideas for fun...

Service 3: Centre-(whatever the name of this new housing estate is to be called!) via Whiteladies Road, Westbury, Greystoke Avenue, Pen Park Road, and Charlton Road. EDIT: Oh wait a minute it couldn't be numbered serivce 3 as just remembered there is currently a service 3 via a different route operated by Wessex Connect!

Service 4: Centre-Cribbs Causeway. Via Whiteladies Road, Henleaze, Southmead Road, Gloucester Road, (whatever the name of this new housing estate is to be called), and Charlton Hayes.

Could even be a new service numbered in the upper 70 series which goes via Gloucester Road, Monks Park Avenue, Southmead Road and onto this new estate and Charlton Hayes.

My idea for service 4 reminds me that the eastern side of Southmead Road hasn't had a direct bus link to Centre and Broadmead for over 25 years now! Since the old short lived service 3 Broomhill-Filton Church was axed. Previously for many years there was the old 87 California Farm-Filton Church(or Polytechnic) service that served this stretch of Southmead Road.

 

[freetoview33]

Also once this new estate opens up there would be road access opened up via Charlton Road as well. So there could be a new service running that route.

Yeah a bus only road!

 

[TheGrandWazoo]

What's happened with the 60*** range in Taunton/Bridgwater now. How many are left??

Also, what out of the below list is now left in Taunton/Bridgwater?
34064
34174
34178
34179
34188
34189
34190
41134
42634
42825
42830
42832
42833
42834
42835
53001
53013
53014

I've taken this list out of Steve White's spreadsheet from March, with a few updates. As far as I can tell the majority of all this is still there. Which depot is each now? It's rather confusing!
--- old post above --- --- new post below ---
Also, does anyone know whether all the Marshalls are still at Weston? What services do they do? What will they be replaced by? Streetlites?

I've been assuming for the last couple of years that Streetlites are replacing all the Step down darts and Marshalls. Am I right in thinking this??
--- old post above --- --- new post below ---
Not sure whether anyone has seen, but I've added a new thread for anything about the smaller operators around the Avon/Somerset area - Webberbus included. Feel free to post to this!

The Weston Marshalls tend to operate the 5 to Uphill. They appear to be in better nick than the ex Welsh ones and the one at WS. However, I doubt that Streetlites will replace them at WM....

I'd imagine that the Streetlites will replace (via cascade or directly) the SPDs, the oldest Marshalls, 46264/603 and some sundry MPDs.

 

[matt_splat]

next week could be a intresting time to visit Wells

service 173 for 4 weeks will divert via the A39 and Green Ore due to roadworks

meanwhile Service 376 will be running Wells - Bristol only

service 29 will run to Mendip Hospital only

meanwhile services x75, 377 and 375 will run as follows

via the wells bypass Shepton mallet and pilton a long diversion

 

[freetoview33]

Was just looking on traveline and it seems like they have no info regarding new timetables quite yet as a lot of services are missing from the departures after end of August.

 

[Class 33]

Was just looking on traveline and it seems like they have no info regarding new timetables quite yet as a lot of services are missing from the departures after end of August.

Well there's new timetables on there for the 5, 48, 49, 50, 51, 90, X6, 178 & 379 to name a few.

 

[ValleyLines142]

There is.... It's the 14. The fact is that Wessex are in the dominant position on the UWE corridor and have replaced all the former First services such as the X84 and 99.

I literally HATE Wessex. I want all their buses to burst into flames. They are constantly late, their customer services are shocking and they are insincere to the point of nausea.

First, although not perfect themselves, THOROUGHLY deserve the 14, and the whole of the UWE bus network for that matter.

I want all UWE buses to run at least ten minutes with First Enviro 400s like the ones Manchester have for the 184 and 409.

 

[TheGrandWazoo]

I literally HATE Wessex. I want all their buses to burst into flames. They are constantly late, their customer services are shocking and they are insincere to the point of nausea.

First, although not perfect themselves, THOROUGHLY deserve the 14, and the whole of the UWE bus network for that matter.

I want all UWE buses to run at least ten minutes with First Enviro 400s like the ones Manchester have for the 184 and 409.

I think you need to take more water with it......

Fact is that Wessex won a contract. There are service criteria within that and UWE will have the ability to terminate should service be below the agreed KPIs, not withstanding a likely break clause after x number of years.

I am beginning to think there's no service that doesn't deserve e400s at this rate. Perhaps not the 5/265....

 

[matt_splat]

well the changes to the 178 that I thought was going to happen have not instead the 177 is being ditched and replaced by a ever 90 mins 178 service Bath - Bristol

the 38 will also run every 90 mins

 

[Private Baxter]

next week could be a intresting time to visit Wells

service 173 for 4 weeks will divert via the A39 and Green Ore due to roadworks

meanwhile Service 376 will be running Wells - Bristol only

service 29 will run to Mendip Hospital only

meanwhile services x75, 377 and 375 will run as follows

via the wells bypass Shepton mallet and pilton a long diversion

Wow, eastern and western Wells are both going to be completely without a bus service for a while. I think the Coxley closure should only last a week. Nonetheless their PVR will drop for those few days.

 

[matt_splat]

not sure on a PVR drop apparently theres going to be a shuttle bus from coxley to Glastonbury I could see that being hourly and covered by the 29 depending on what happens

I would say the 375 x75 and 377 will see a good 20 odd mins added to the journey time.

webberbus won't be running to wells they plan to terminate at Glastonbury and suggest that passengers travel on service 67 if they want to get to wells via either Bridgwater or taunton

I think the inspectors at wells are going to have fun juggling things about to keep things going

 

[freetoview33]

Wessex seem to not mind loosing quite a lot of services around and about, I do really wonder how much longer they will last around here.

 

[TheGrandWazoo]

Wessex seem to not mind loosing quite a lot of services around and about, I do really wonder how much longer they will last around here.

Everything is underpinned by the UWE contract that they've got for a few more years yet. However, I don't know how long their BANES contracts have left and after First registered so much earlier this year, who knows what my happen to Burnett.

It does look like Wessex peaked a few years back
--- old post above --- --- new post below ---

not sure on a PVR drop apparently theres going to be a shuttle bus from coxley to Glastonbury I could see that being hourly and covered by the 29 depending on what happens

I would say the 375 x75 and 377 will see a good 20 odd mins added to the journey time.

webberbus won't be running to wells they plan to terminate at Glastonbury and suggest that passengers travel on service 67 if they want to get to wells via either Bridgwater or taunton

I think the inspectors at wells are going to have fun juggling things about to keep things going

There's three sets of TTLs already on that road!!!

 

[ValleyLines142]

I think you need to take more water with it......

Fact is that Wessex won a contract. There are service criteria within that and UWE will have the ability to terminate should service be below the agreed KPIs, not withstanding a likely break clause after x number of years.

I am beginning to think there's no service that doesn't deserve e400s at this rate. Perhaps not the 5/265....

Yes but Wessex have gone downhill ever since. Have you seen their services? They are an embarassment.

As for the Enviro 400s, that was just optimism, but I still think we need more deckers serving UWE, not just the 14 and the handful that appear on the 12 in the peaks.

Wessex seem to not mind loosing quite a lot of services around and about, I do really wonder how much longer they will last around here.

I honestly think they will be gone by September. They haven't got a clue. I think all operations will be run by First. I've reported them to the traffic commissioner for Bristol.

I for one hope they go. They can't run a bus services to save their lives, their buses are always late, their drivers have very limited English and also don't know the routes and their customer service skills are shocking. I complained about three services in a row being cancelled once last year, causing me to miss my train and delay me by nearly two hours as a result, I complained and they didn't reply to me straight away and when Bus Users UK got involved they finally replied but with a simple half-hearted 'sorry'. How utterly disgusting.

Their license will go soon!

 

[CD]

What's happened with the 60*** range in Taunton/Bridgwater now. How many are left??

Also, what out of the below list is now left in Taunton/Bridgwater?
34064
34174
34178
34179
34188
34189
34190
41134
42634
42825
42830
42832
42833
42834
42835
53001
53013
53014

I've taken this list out of Steve White's spreadsheet from March, with a few updates. As far as I can tell the majority of all this is still there. Which depot is each now? It's rather confusing!
--- old post above --- --- new post below ---
Also, does anyone know whether all the Marshalls are still at Weston? What services do they do? What will they be replaced by? Streetlites?

I've been assuming for the last couple of years that Streetlites are replacing all the Step down darts and Marshalls. Am I right in thinking this??
--- old post above --- --- new post below ---
Not sure whether anyone has seen, but I've added a new thread for anything about the smaller operators around the Avon/Somerset area - Webberbus included. Feel free to post to this!

34064. Still in service in Taunton (last Oly there).
34174. withdrawn 3 months ago, but still in the yard at Taunton depot.
34178/79/88/89/90. All still at Bridgwater together with recent arrivals from Taunton 34171/76.
41134 withdrawn some time ago and gone for scrap.
42634 in service Taunton.
42825 in service Taunton.
42830/34 in Taunton depot yard recently withdrawn.
42832/33/35 in service Taunton.
53001/9/13/14 in service Bridgwater.

Hope this helps.

 

[freetoview33]

I can mainly see Wessex going as I'm fairly sure all the services are supported in some way and as funding is slowly being withdrawn it seems like they won't last for long if the last few years are anything to go by.

 

[THarris123]

34064. Still in service in Taunton (last Oly there).
34174. withdrawn 3 months ago, but still in the yard at Taunton depot.
34178/79/88/89/90. All still at Bridgwater together with recent arrivals from Taunton 34171/76.
41134 withdrawn some time ago and gone for scrap.
42634 in service Taunton.
42825 in service Taunton.
42830/34 in Taunton depot yard recently withdrawn.
42832/33/35 in service Taunton.
53001/9/13/14 in service Bridgwater.

Hope this helps.

Thanks for this. So there's still a lot of crap left in BoS!

With regards to Wessex - the comments posted are completely right - they are total rubbish. I'd like to think they won't last long, but look at Webberbus - they're in the same league and they've been going for a while. I'd like to see First take over everything from both, but I just don't think it will happen. Shame!

 

[ryson357]

In bath today seen 66354 looking very smart in the new livery whilst 66356 looks terrible state

 

[Class 33]

Loadings I've seen on the 3 could've been accommodated with a taxi.

Seen a few 3's today. All double deckers. One northbound about 0815 going along Filton Road. Estimated I'd say to be a little over half full. Another southbound about 1720 going along Gloucester Road in Patchway, probably about 3/4 full. Though I shortly after saw two northbound 3's and they only had a few people on. The 3 seems to be mainly used by people working at Aztec West it seems. That's not to say though a new First service between the Centre, Aztec West and Bradley Stoke wouldn't be unsuccessful if such a service were to be introduced, particularly in the evenings and on Sundays when the 73 runs only ever half hour and the 73, 75, and 76 all are still busy due to the reduced service frequency of each service. Indeed I'm surprised Wessex haven't though of that themselves with the 3, extending it beyond Aztec West through to Bradley Stoke to attract more passengers onto this service.

 

[TheGrandWazoo]

Yes but Wessex have gone downhill ever since. Have you seen their services? They are an embarassment.

As for the Enviro 400s, that was just optimism, but I still think we need more deckers serving UWE, not just the 14 and the handful that appear on the 12 in the peaks.



I honestly think they will be gone by September. They haven't got a clue. I think all operations will be run by First. I've reported them to the traffic commissioner for Bristol.

I for one hope they go. They can't run a bus services to save their lives, their buses are always late, their drivers have very limited English and also don't know the routes and their customer service skills are shocking. I complained about three services in a row being cancelled once last year, causing me to miss my train and delay me by nearly two hours as a result, I complained and they didn't reply to me straight away and when Bus Users UK got involved they finally replied but with a simple half-hearted 'sorry'. How utterly disgusting.

Their license will go soon!

How much money do you want to bet that they'll still be here in October? As you like the figure, how about €400?

First of all, they've not been hauled over the coals before. Secondly, the TC will need to both undertake independent observation and then invite them to a hearing. Thirdly, unless it's a safety violation (eg maintenance and PG9s, drivers hours breaches, etc) then they are unlikely to lose their license and certainly at the first time. It certainly won't happen that soon.

The only way they'll be gone quicker is if the KPIs are breached severely and by a long enough duration (and that they've also had time to remedy the situation) and then UWE might be able to terminate for a material breach.

As regards Bristol, the UWE work underpins it all. However, the Burnett site has lost a lot of work and any further losses would clearly raise questions about it's viability? Rotala gone by September? It won't happen and don't think I like them. Eastern European drivers racing e200s like gokarts is not enjoyable!

 

[vicbury]

As regards Bristol, the UWE work underpins it all. However, the Burnett site has lost a lot of work and any further losses would clearly raise questions about it's viability? Rotala gone by September? It won't happen and don't think I like them. Eastern European drivers racing e200s like gokarts is not enjoyable!

First's eastern European drivers, particularly the Poles who have been in Bath for many years now, are generally excellent. Then again Wessex's English drivers aren't great either!

The 14 in Bath now seems to be almost exclusively operated by the 09 plate Enviro 2000s. I rally think bigger buses are needed on this route as they are often full and standing even during off peak periods. Maybe we'll see another frequency boost of Sundays - could the 14 sustain every 15 minutes? I wonder if it will get boosted on Saturdays too.

Saw one of the repainted Volvos (B7L?) in Bath today. Looks very smart, shame about the black smoke coming out of the exhaust!

 

[windnoise69]

In bath today seen 66354 looking very smart in the new livery whilst 66356 looks terrible state

I was in bath and also saw 66354 in new livery and 66353. They look very impressive especially with the large grill on the entrance side at the rear.

I took a short ride on 66356 and it's as bad on the inside as it is the out. It would be nice for these to be refurbished and maybe all put on the 319 to standardise it