Govia get Thameslink Franchise

[jon0844]

More likely to have been the DfT.

First Great Western wanted to extend Oyster card acceptance from the Greater London boundary station of West Drayton to stations further west that were likely to be used for sailing events at the 2012 Olympics - but DfT said no.

I doubt it was Herts County Council as Cheshunt and Broxbourne got Oyster. But I do recall a fuss about St Albans, and that would be Hertsmere Council. Maybe that was it?

The gates at Hatfield are all equipped for smartcards whenever it can be sorted.

 

[Saint66]

More likely to have been the DfT.

First Great Western wanted to extend Oyster card acceptance from the Greater London boundary station of West Drayton to stations further west that were likely to be used for sailing events at the 2012 Olympics - but DfT said no.

You are correct, it was DFT:

http://www.stalbansreview.co.uk/new...Oyster_card_scheme_to_St_Albans_are_rejected/

 

[Class377/5]

Some points I've picked up on (as I'm late in seeing this thread) but did anyone else notice the comments over reducing the 455 usage and more 10 car metro services from 2018. The latter would suggest 8 car 377/2 replacing the 377/7.

Interesting the DfT is allowing Oyster to Gatwick and WG City when it blocked First from doing so.

 

[physics34]

Some points I've picked up on (as I'm late in seeing this thread) but did anyone else notice the comments over reducing the 455 usage and more 10 car metro services from 2018. The latter would suggest 8 car 377/2 replacing the 377/7.

Interesting the DfT is allowing Oyster to Gatwick and WG City when it blocked First from doing so.

i have been surprised that their hasnt been any mention of 455 replacement until now. I suppose the 455s will be 37 years old by 2018, so makes sense to start withdrawing them, as there will be a surplus of 377 when the 700s come in

I assume there will be more 377/3s avaliable (to make more 3+3+4s) when the 700s replace the peak time London Bridge to East Grinsteads.

 

[Class377/5]

i have been surprised that their hasnt been any mention of 455 replacement until now. I suppose the 455s will be 37 years old by 2018, so makes sense to start withdrawing them, as there will be a surplus of 377 when the 700s come in

I assume there will be more 377/3s avaliable (to make more 3+3+4s) when the 700s replace the peak time London Bridge to East Grinsteads.

Guessing the next franchise will have to replace the final 313 and the 455 fleet.

Id forgot about the 377/3 on the East Grinstead's.

 

[Aictos]

Regards the eventual replacement of the 455s from SN routes, would we be able to see 10 car operation across the metro area covering all current Class 455 services?

 

[infobleep]

More likely to have been the DfT.

First Great Western wanted to extend Oyster card acceptance from the Greater London boundary station of West Drayton to stations further west that were likely to be used for sailing events at the 2012 Olympics - but DfT said no.

Does anyone know why the DfT were anti Oyster cards in terms of extending but now suddenly they are not?

I think it would be good extend Oyster south of Surbiton. The K3 runs into Claygate from memory and I think that is covered by Oyster. Of course whether DfT are interested in extending south of Surbiton is another matter.

 

[GatwickDepress]

Ticket machine (sic) to be introduced at Newhaven Harbour, Normans
Bay, Ore, Pevensey Bay, Southease, Three Oaks and Winchelsea

A ticket machine at Ore, finally!

 

[physics34]

Regards the eventual replacement of the 455s from SN routes, would we be able to see 10 car operation across the metro area covering all current Class 455 services?

No news about stations via Peckham becoming 10 car platforms so , no !

 

[Via Bank]

Does anyone know why the DfT were anti Oyster cards in terms of extending but now suddenly they are not?

Presumably because ITSO on Prestige is now working!

 

[otomous]

No news about stations via Peckham becoming 10 car platforms so , no !

 

[Bald Rick]

One question for Bald Rick, Class 377/5 and SWT Passenger though as The Key/Oyster is being extended from September 2015 is there a franchise commitment to introduce smartcard passes for employees as Scotrail have done?

No idea I'm afraid.

 

[JonathanH]

Suspect the layout at Tulse Hill (hemmed in by junctions and bridges) makes it too tricky to run more than 8 cars on stoppers going this way. I've always thought a regular 2tph from London Bridge to Epsom via Hackbridge could be a useful way of increasing overall capacity. Then all the Vic-Dorkings could go Clapham Sutton Epsom then all stations all day (esp Sundays).

10-377/6 has run via Peckham and Tulse Hill including intermediate stops when there has been weekend engineering work diverting Dorking trains to London Bridge instead of Victoria. However, I suspect that it would be too problematic to run trains using selective door opening at main stations in peak time.
--- old post above --- --- new post below ---

i have been surprised that their hasnt been any mention of 455 replacement until now. I suppose the 455s will be 37 years old by 2018, so makes sense to start withdrawing them, as there will be a surplus of 377 when the 700s come in

I assume there will be more 377/3s avaliable (to make more 3+3+4s) when the 700s replace the peak time London Bridge to East Grinsteads.

Eight of the 28 377/3s are used in each peak for 12-car trains to / from East Grinstead and Horsham (1759 London Bridge to Horsham, 1816 London Bridge to East Grinstead) so that is four additional 10-car trains that could be formed up.

 

[AM9]

I doubt it was Herts County Council as Cheshunt and Broxbourne got Oyster. But I do recall a fuss about St Albans, and that would be Hertsmere Council. Maybe that was it?

Hertsmere, I am (on behalf of all St Albanians) insulted! We are a city with our own (pretty dismal) council. Don't get us mixed up with that Borehamwood lot.

 

[Class 170101]

As regards Oyster to Hertford North wasn't there a dispute between FCC, NX/AGA and the DfT when ADA/NX wanted to extend Oyster out to Hertford East so in the end neither got Oyster?

 

[jon0844]

Sorry!

At least you don't have THREE councils like Hatfield (Hatfield Town Council, Welwyn Hatfield Borough Council and Hertfordshire County Council).

I don't really know what the first one does. I think it cuts the grass in our local park and sometimes organises things in the town centre.

 

[Fincra5]

A ticket machine at Ore, finally!

Not sure its even needed... people that buy a ticket find the conductor at ORE anyways, as we sit there for a few mins. Pax who don't want them wont start using the machine haha.

I suppose for booked tickets its good.

 

[physics34]

10-377/6 has run via Peckham and Tulse Hill including intermediate stops when there has been weekend engineering work diverting Dorking trains to London Bridge instead of Victoria. However, I suspect that it would be too problematic to run trains using selective door opening at main stations in peak time.
--- old post above --- --- new post below ---


Eight of the 28 377/3s are used in each peak for 12-car trains to / from East Grinstead and Horsham (1759 London Bridge to Horsham, 1816 London Bridge to East Grinstead) so that is four additional 10-car trains that could be formed up.

ah ok well that makes sense then, itll just be a case of how many 455s will be withdrawn

 

[Class377/5]

ah ok well that makes sense then, itll just be a case of how many 455s will be withdrawn

Who said anything about being withdrawn. The wording from Govia was "with some reduction in the use of the older 455s by 2018". Doesn't suggest anything other than Govia believing the units will be less depandable as they start to reach withdrawal age.

 

[GatwickDepress]

Not sure its even needed... people that buy a ticket find the conductor at ORE anyways, as we sit there for a few mins. Pax who don't want them wont start using the machine haha.

I suppose for booked tickets its good.

If the train's there, I'll still probably buy my ticket from the conductor regardless of machine, as it's really nice to have a quick natter with you lads and ladies. If I tried that on Northern, I'd end up with a penalty fare before you could say "TVM".

The ticket machine means I can collect my tickets in half the time it usually takes to walk down to Hastings station, so I'm one person who's happy about it!

 

[Minstral25]

In the presentation meetings with Govia to our local Rail Users group the 455's and 313's were brought up. They stated 455's will stay through this franchise as will the 313's on the South Coast.

It would have been good to see the 455's go and replaced with more 377/6's as that would mean a more uniform fleet in the Metro area. Having said that the 455's do a great job and are fit for the passenger journeys they do

 

[IanXC]

In the presentation meetings with Govia to our local Rail Users group the 455's and 313's were brought up. They stated 455's will stay through this franchise as will the 313's on the South Coast.

Am I right in recalling people speculating that the 3 car 377s would go to the Coast? If that's not to happen, does it add them to the list of units to be cascaded? As that could well provide some different answers to other problems elsewhere?

 

[Class377/5]

Am I right in recalling people speculating that the 3 car 377s would go to the Coast? If that's not to happen, does it add them to the list of units to be cascaded? As that could well provide some different answers to other problems elsewhere?

Not within the lifetime of GTR, they have said the costal 313 are staying until franchise ends. the 377/3 will be used to help lengthen other others as stock is moved around compared to today.

 

[infobleep]

Presumably because ITSO on Prestige is now working!

If that's the case then no reason not to now extended Oyster to West Drayton and other places, e. g Claygate. In fact why not include every area that gets a London bus service covered by Oyster. I'm assuming there are a few stations not on Oyster where the buses are.

 

[Deerfold]

If that's the case then no reason not to now extended Oyster to West Drayton and other places, e. g Claygate. In fact why not include every area that gets a London bus service covered by Oyster. I'm assuming there are a few stations not on Oyster where the buses are.

Oyster reached West Drayton some years ago.

There are a limited number of Zones available for Oyster - presumably there'd have to be agreement with every franchise holder to accept them unless they're in a franchise specification.

There's not that many places beyond the zones served by buses but not Oyster on rail - Slough, Potters Bar, Cuffley, Dartford and Bluewater, Redhill, Epsom. I've probably missed a couple.

 

[hassaanhc]

Oyster reached West Drayton some years ago.

There are a limited number of Zones available for Oyster - presumably there'd have to be agreement with every franchise holder to accept them unless they're in a franchise specification.

There's not that many places beyond the zones served by buses but not Oyster on rail - Slough, Potters Bar, Cuffley, Dartford and Bluewater, Redhill, Epsom. I've probably missed a couple.

The 405 to Redhill is via Merstham, where again Oyster is not valid. There used to be Brentwood and Lakeside but that is no longer the case. Although I don't see why the Caterham and Tattenham Corner branches justify Zone 6 treatment :?

 

[AM9]

Oyster reached West Drayton some years ago.

There are a limited number of Zones available for Oyster - presumably there'd have to be agreement with every franchise holder to accept them unless they're in a franchise specification.

There's not that many places beyond the zones served by buses but not Oyster on rail - Slough, Potters Bar, Cuffley, Dartford and Bluewater, Redhill, Epsom. I've probably missed a couple.

St. Albans?

 

[Deerfold]

The 405 to Redhill is via Merstham. There used to be Brentwood and Lakeside but that is no longer the case. Although I don't see why the Caterham and Tattenham Corner branches justify Zone 6 treatment :?

Oh yes - 370 still goes to Lakeside.

Oyster does go beyond Zone 6 already.

St. Albans?

St Albans isn't served by any TfL services. Metroline run the commercial route 84 into Greater London from St Albans.

 

[jon0844]

Potters Bar becoming part of zone 6 or zone 7 would make sense, but I wonder if Hatfield and WGC (and indeed St Albans) would become part of the zones?

If not, they're going to end up being special zones, like Broxbourne, which then gives a problem as they're running out of zones/letters.

 

[KX03HZY]

The 405 to Redhill is via Merstham, where again Oyster is not valid. There used to be Brentwood and Lakeside but that is no longer the case. Although I don't see why the Caterham and Tattenham Corner branches justify Zone 6 treatment :?

Oysters, Travelcards, Contactless are all accepted on the full length of the 405 route