Lack of 444s?

[Juniper Driver]

I worked a 9 car 450/444 combo today consisting of 450002/444014 (for only the second time in nearly 4 years of working on Desiros.)

I have heard from more than one source that they are short of 444's and spares are hard to come by as the 444's were a one off order and the 450's were not.

Also they cant bring back the 442's as they have no fitters for them.


Anybody know what's going on?

What about ordering new desiros?

cheers.

 

[Tom]

Correct...

Not enough 444s, the pairings are now daily on the Bournemouth line with the 450 generally the front portion of the Weymouth trains.

Spares for the 444s are pretty much the same as 450s in the majority of respects, as they use basically the same components. The issue lies behind the number of crash damaged 444s running around (042s DMCO (200 coach IIRC)) is currently running around in 026 if I remember rightly!

As for ordering more trains, bit difficult when SWT are trying to save money. As for the 442s, a request for fitters was put out a few weeks ago but ended to no avail.

 

[paul1609]

I believe heads of agreement are now signed on all the class 442s up to the commencement of the new "Thameslink" Franchise.
There's 7 508's in hot store at Ashford that are available now and there will be another 6 in April when Tonbridge to London Bridge via Redhill transfers to Southern from SouthEastern. Of course dont the £2m a week premium payments cut in in April?
Perils of Stagecoach overbidding by 20% for Bournemouth branch Trains I'm afraid

 

[Tom]

SWT are still getting a subsidy Paul - but not by much!!

 

[paul1609]

Oh yes £25 m subsidy this year, £40 m premium the year after.
When do we reckon BBT will throw in the keys?

 

[Tom]

Never heard of BBT.

I reckon they can keep it going - you do after all hate SWT so I'm going to just disagree with you

 

[devon_metro]

So surely the front portion goes to Weymouth, or is splitting at Bournemouth strange?

 

[Tom]

On the down, the 450 is generally on the rear and the 444 goes to Weymouth. 450 goes to siding.

On the up, 450 comes out of siding and acts as front portion of train.

 

[Juniper Driver]

Thats what I had 444 on the front and 450 on the rear.Wonder what the V.I.Ps made of that.New thing to me.Stopped on the nine board at Basingstoke yesterday but was thinking that nine board was probably really for 159's.

I still don't think bringing 442's back was a good idea anyway.They were good units in their day but at the end of their SWT lives they tended to break down more no?

 

[Tom]

I still don't think bringing 442's back was a good idea anyway.They were good units in their day but at the end of their SWT lives they tended to break down more no?

You mean, because SWT ran them into the ground from the announcement of the winner of the new franchise?

Breaking down more means bad maintenance, and it just so happens that SWT reduced the maintenance cycle on the pigs!

 

[AlexS]

442s were still near the top of the EMU performance leagues by their withdrawal in early 2007.

 

[Tom]

Indeed. Believe the class 321s beat them by a few hundred miles on a 5-minute delay per casualty rating...

 

[ChampsRacing]

450 and 444 diagrams are quiet common now, when i started operations training at Basingstoke in early november most wer 10 car 444 down to southampton, come end of my training it was mostly 450 and 444 or 12 car 444.

 

[Tom]

450 and 444 diagrams are quiet common now, when i started operations training at Basingstoke in early november most wer 10 car 444 down to southampton, come end of my training it was mostly 450 and 444 or

Got the first part of your post...

12 car 444.

What?

It's due to the crash damage as has been said many, many, many, many times before.

 

[ChampsRacing]

12 car 450 sorry lol

 

[paul1609]

Champs racing are you in the same link as Juniper Driver?

 

[ChampsRacing]

Nah for one im a guard and two im 3/4 way through my training just got my route learning left.

 

[Juniper Driver]

Lol.....

Well perhaps I was just unlucky with the 442s....I have also heard that the Desiro traction motors don't last as long as expected.

 

[ChampsRacing]

Lol.....
I have also heard that the Desiro traction motors don't last as long as expected.

Why does that not suprise me

 

[Juniper Driver]

I do like the Desiro's they've been very reliable for me (touching wood)...Bit dodgy at first as we weren't used to the brakes so we used to moan about them.I have said that all trains have different characteristics and Desiro's are no different.I remember driving the on Christmas eve 2004 and thinking are these trains suitable for the hounslow loop.Probably the wear and tear is from doing the bread and butter stuff and perhaps they would prefer to stretch their wheels on the main line.Wessies were the same when I first drove them.I didn't think they were suited to the Pompey road twists turns and gradients.

 

[ChampsRacing]

They aint to bad really ive only ever had to deal with one with a problem out of 15 months so far so touch wood i wont have to either lol.

 

[paul1609]

is that train sim (like juniper driver?) guard training or real life?

 

[Juniper Driver]

Sorry I didn't understand the question.

I have been driving desiro's in real life for almost four years though.

 

[ChampsRacing]

Real life for me spent 13 months on the platforms and im 3 months into my guards training at the moment.

 

[Juniper Driver]

Almost 26 years but I wished I had joined about ten or twenty years earlier if possible.The railways were good then.

 

[Kneedown]

It was a similar story on Central. We had a few diagrams for a pair of 158's, or a pair of 170's, but if you were lucky enough to actually get 4 coaches (rarely) they could hardly ever find a matching pair. It was almost always a 158/170 combo.
Personally i put it down to poor diagramming.