Buying SE High Speed supplement - including for Calais

[Nicholas43]

SE's website states

they [HS supplements] are available at ticket offices or from any self-service machine.

Er, I can't see how to get one from the self-service machines at Oxford. Do they mean at any SE station?
I know there were long thread(s) about the Calais day returns before they put NOT HS on them. Now that they have put NOT HS on the London Terminals - Calais day return, am I right in assuming that it is entirely OK to travel by HS, provided I buy a supplement? Is there any aggro if I don't buy it in advance and offer to buy it on the train?

 

[yorkie]

Yes, the supplement is just Southeastern's way of issuing a change of route excess fare. There is no penalty for obtaining this on-board.

 

[Nicholas43]

Yes, the supplement is just Southeastern's way of issuing a change of route excess fare.

Ah, thanks. But SE grippers can't calculate an excess fare for London<->Calais, can they, because, AFAIK, there is no fare London<->Calais via HS (and P&O). Or am I being too subtle?

 

[yorkie]

Ah, thanks. But SE grippers can't calculate an excess fare for London<->Calais, can they, because, AFAIK, there is no fare London<->Calais via HS (and P&O). Or am I being too subtle?

That's partly why they issue Supplements instead.

(or is it that there are no fares for that because they have supplements? .... Now which came first, the chicken or the egg? )

 

[Lrd]

I used a London - Calais a while ago and remembering purchasing a supplement from the ticket office in Dover, it was something silly like £2 extra for one way on HS.

 

[hassaanhc]

Taking their past form into account, what is the chances a PF or similar is issued instead on board? :P

 

[Nicholas43]

That's partly why they issue Supplements instead.

But for (every/most?) SE destinations Ashford and beyond (and without daring to wonder about Ebbsfleet), there are two fares, NOT HS, and PLUS HS. So the "supplement" is, as you say, technically an excess fare for change of route. For Calais, I can't find a published fare PLUS HS. So does it follow that a SE gripper's machine can't calculate the excess? Or does (s)he just need a code for "Change of route London to Ashford and beyond" which can be presumed to apply to Calais?

 

[yorkie]

They issue supplements to avoid the faff of issuing excesses.

In some cases it means people paying more than the excess would be, which some of us believe is a breach of the NRCoC. But let's not go there...

 

[CyrusWuff]

Off the top of my head (since KnowledgeBase isn't readily available outside of the railway WAN), the basic guideline for HS Supplements is that you pay for the part of the journey spent on HS1.

Logically, on a London - Calais ticket (which is issued as an Anytime Day Return), that should be the £6.10 you'd pay to "upgrade" a London - Dover ticket. Southeastern may not agree, however.

 

[user15681]

CyrusWuff, that's correct - the HS supplement is only for the part of journey spent on HS1. A London-Dover HS upgrade is the same as a London-Ashford or London-Folkestone HS upgrade. I would like to think the OP will just be charged the £6.10 to upgrade London-Calais.

Will try and check tomorrow for you Nicholas43 with a couple of OBMs (HS guards), though.

 

[Mojo]

You may struggle to get through the gateline at St Pancras [STP]/Stratford Int'l though, so probably best to factor in time to buy this from the booking office or TVMs at STP.

 

[Nicholas43]

so probably best to factor in time to buy this from the booking office or TVMs at STP.

Hmm. Which booking office at St Pancras? Maybe it's all changed, but in 2013 when I asked about a return to Calais via P&O, the Midland office told me to go to Charing Cross. I didn't try First Capital Connect. But First Capital Connect at Blackfriars, where there are those lovely stones listing lots of destinations from Calais to Istanbul, denied all knowledge of a London-Calais via P&O ticket. So I'm skeptical about buying at St Pancras a ticket which, we seem to be agreed, is technically an excess from a published NOT HS fare to a hypothetical PLUS HS fare!

 

[furlong]

Hmm. Which booking office at St Pancras?

If you ever have trouble there, try Kings Cross just over the road or use the machines. Ths is just a standard High Speed Upgrade (HUB or HUC) to Ashford (AFK) which is sold when there is no fare available for an excess.

 

[Mojo]

Hmm. Which booking office at St Pancras? Maybe it's all changed, but in 2013 when I asked about a return to Calais via P&O, the Midland office told me to go to Charing Cross. I didn't try First Capital Connect. But First Capital Connect at Blackfriars, where there are those lovely stones listing lots of destinations from Calais to Istanbul, denied all knowledge of a London-Calais via P&O ticket. So I'm skeptical about buying at St Pancras a ticket which, we seem to be agreed, is technically an excess from a published NOT HS fare to a hypothetical PLUS HS fare!

I'm not quite sure what you mean, but the OP only seems to want a High Speed supplement which should be a fairly standard product for the staff of either the East Midlands or the Capital Connect offices at St Pancake.

It was previously the case that the Calais ticket had no routeing printed on the ticket restricting travel on the Highspeed service, although there was a "secret restriction" contained on staff publicity that said travel on Highspeed was not permitted. It is now printed on the ticket that Highspeed is barred, so as other posters above have said, he will need a supplement.

 

[Haywain]

I'm not quite sure what you mean, but the OP only seems to want a High Speed supplement which should be a fairly standard product for the staff of either the East Midlands or the Capital Connect offices at St Pancake.

It was previously the case that the Calais ticket had no routeing printed on the ticket restricting travel on the Highspeed service, although there was a "secret restriction" contained on staff publicity that said travel on Highspeed was not permitted. It is now printed on the ticket that Highspeed is barred, so as other posters above have said, he will need a supplement.

You were replying to the OP! It isn't clear what the OP has been trying to buy at St Pancras, but he appears not be be aware that the day return to Calais and the HS upgrade (supplement) are separate items, and the latter cannot be purchased without the former. That may be why he is being told to go to Charing Cross - because he is asking for something which doesn't actually exist and insisting that it does.

 

[Nicholas43]

You were replying to the OP! It isn't clear what the OP has been trying to buy at St Pancras, but he appears not be be aware that the day return to Calais and the HS upgrade (supplement) are separate items.

Sorry, chaps, in trying to be brief, I have failed to be clear.
I do know that the London<>Calais return tickets plus the control tickets plus a possible one-way supplement/excess will be 5 bits of card.
I have, obvs, on a previous occasion easily bought the London<>Calais stuff at Charing Cross and gone by an (enjoyable) slow train.
I have also found that Midland booking office staff at St P deny all knowledge of the London<>Calais, and refuse to sell it.
My question was meant to be:
If I turn up at StP with just London<>Calais P&O NOT HS tickets, am I best advised to (a) buy the supplement before boarding, or (b) blag my way through the gates and pay on board?
And if (a) is the expert view, how and where do I buy it? Come to that, what bit(s) of card do I put in the gate? And is a London>Ashford supplement/excess really going to be enough to satisfy a SE gripper?
If I go to the Midland booking office, I would expect much tooth-sucking, and a response on the lines: How can I calculate the HS excess on these funny tickets to Calais I know nuffink about?

 

[Hadders]

The two things you need to purchase are:

- the London-Calais ticket. This is potentially tricky as some clerks will deny that they exist. There are three places you can try and get it issued, EMT booking office or the FCC one at St Pancras. Alternatively pop across the road and try EC at Kings Cross. I'd have thought that one of the three could do it. In the past I have found the FCC office decent (although to be fair I've not tried to purchase a Calais ticket from them)

- The HS upgrade. This is a fixed price upgrade, which can be purchased from a TVM, a booking office or on-board (I remember seeing them on a TVM at Kings Cross a couple of years ago). Avantix Traveller gives the price as £5.70 single or £6.10 return. I'm sure both booking offices at St Pancras are well used to issuing HS upgrades.

 

[Nicholas43]

Many thanks, Hadders.
Any views about what I put in the gate at St P? Or do I find a human and blag my way on?

 

[Hadders]

I've no idea what will work the gates but if they're in operation there'll be a gateline assistant nearby.

 

[bkhtele]

I have bought the Calais day return @ east coast Kings Cross successfully after trying all options at St Pancreas. It helps to have a picture of the ticket

 

[bb21]

The Calais ticket is an SDR "from 1072 to H426" routed "P AND O NOT HS".

Any ticket office should be able to issue it, provided that they are willing to sell any ticket requested (which the EMT ticket office at St Pancake is in my experience). I don't foresee problems on that front.

 

[paul1609]

The HS supplement ticket will work the barriers at St Pancras. I buy them quite frequently to use with my Non HS season ticket.

 

[Hadders]

We've had a number of threads on the Calais tickets over the last few years which may be of use:

http://www.railforums.co.uk/showthread.php?t=52561

http://www.railforums.co.uk/showthread.php?t=29374

http://www.railforums.co.uk/showthread.php?t=61455