Quiet zones

[TOCDriver]

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/art...rain.html?offset=200&max=100#comment-55014292

Made in Chelsea star Jamie Laing arrested after he refused to stop using his mobile phone in the quiet carriage of train

• Made in Chelsea star arrested on train from Leeds to London
• Jamie Laing, 25, refused to turn his phone off in 'quiet' carriage
• Taken off the train by British Transport Police and later cautioned

It is the curse of modern train travel – the passenger with the loud voice and mobile phone who’s oblivious to the sign that says ‘quiet carriage’

On this occasion, however, it wasn’t just any passenger. It was Jamie Laing, millionaire heir to the McVitie’s biscuit empire and reality TV star.

Perhaps he thought the railway bylaws did not apply to him. But the train guard and the British Transport Police did not share his view and the Made in Chelsea star was arrested before he’d even finished his journey....

There are a lot of silly people who think you can be prosecuted for using a mobile phone in a quite zone on a train when we all know the quiet zone is merely a request by the TOC and there isn't a thing they can do about people making noise. There are no by-laws I certainly know of saying you should be quiet in such zones

 

[DarloRich]

The TOC might not be able to do anything but an angry looking northern bloke suggesting rather bluntly that you cease and desist with your mobile based telephony often does the trick

 

[SPADTrap]

Should have just moved out the quiet coach surely! I'm more surprised that the DM seems to be taking the railways side! If that was a "norma/ordinary passenger" I think it would read very very differently.

 

[Domh245]

The fact it is reported as a bylaw offence, when there isn't a bylaw regarding quiet zones implies that there may have been something else at play.

 

[jopsuk]

I reckon it's pretty simple- he was asked to be quiet, and got abusive, (doesn't even have to be physical), raising it to a byelaw offence

 

[CyrusWuff]

The fact it is reported as a bylaw offence, when there isn't a bylaw regarding quiet zones implies that there may have been something else at play.

At a push, it could come under "Wilfully molesting or interfering with the comfort or convenience of any person on the railway"...though I'm going to hazard a guess that swearing may have been involved, which is also a byelaw offence.

 

[IanXC]

I'm not sure I agree that (if the case is as reported) there are no potential byelaw offences:

6 (2) No person shall behave in a disorderly, indecent or offensive manner on the railway.

6 (8) No person shall molest or willfully interfere with the comfort or convenience of any person on the railway.

 

[yorkie]

He isn't in trouble for simply ignoring the Quiet Coach rules, but for repeatedly ignoring them and refusing to comply with staff requests. I agree with IanXC; it does indeed look like he did commit Byelaw offences.

 

[overtonchris]

Should have just moved out the quiet coach surely! I'm more surprised that the DM seems to be taking the railways side! If that was a "norma/ordinary passenger" I think it would read very very differently.

...You're deffo correct with that one!!!! - p'raps the DM have got a less ranty anti-railways edit team?.....I'll now come back out of cloud-cuckoo land and wait for their next "train-related article"......

 

[Tim R-T-C]

You forget, Celeb bashing beats railway bashing any day in the DM offices.

Now if it was a poor commuter in the Guardian who only has twenty seconds to change trains at Leeds and could never be expected to know where she has boarded a train service, then of course that would be the railways' fault...

At least British papers are still free of the Mom nomenclature that besots every American news report.

 

[swt_passenger]

He isn't in trouble for simply ignoring the Quiet Coach rules, but for repeatedly ignoring them and refusing to comply with staff requests. I agree with IanXC; it does indeed look like he did commit Byelaw offences.

...When asked for his name and address I wonder if he tried 'Don't you know who I am?'. I'd definitely have replied 'no idea'...

 

[Tetchytyke]

...When asked for his name and address I wonder if he tried 'Don't you know who I am?'.

"Well if you're suffering from amnesia we'd better take you to into custody for your safety".

Now if it was a poor commuter in the Guardian who only has twenty seconds to change trains at Leeds and could never be expected to know where she has boarded a train service, then of course that would be the railways' fault...

Eh?

Prosecuting someone for a fare mistake is- rightly- seen as draconian.

Prosecuting someone for anti-social behaviour is- rightly- seen as correct.

 

[Greenback]

Is this man (I have no idea who he is or what Made in Chelsea is) going to be prosecuted?

My guess is that after a bit of a cooling off period he'll simply be warned about his future conduct and be on his way.

I agree with those who have said he was arrested for persistently refusing to comply with the instructions of staff, rather than because he used his phone in a quiet carriage.

 

[ainsworth74]

...When asked for his name and address I wonder if he tried 'Don't you know who I am?'. I'd definitely have replied 'no idea'...

I don't know about you but that reply from me would have been completely truthful as well

 

[Tibbs]

Is this man (I have no idea who he is or what Made in Chelsea is) going to be prosecuted?

My guess is that after a bit of a cooling off period he'll simply be warned about his future conduct and be on his way.

I agree with those who have said he was arrested for persistently refusing to comply with the instructions of staff, rather than because he used his phone in a quiet carriage.

It says he was cautioned, but not whether it was formal or informal.

 

[thenorthern]

What constitutes as Noise in the quiet zone? I personally find moaning kids and chatty women annoying but that maybe just me.

 

[Greenback]

What constitutes as Noise in the quiet zone? I personally find moaning kids and chatty women annoying but that maybe just me.

So do I! Basically, conversation should be kept low enough not to disturb others.

 

[krus_aragon]

Following on from this, are there any trains that have both quiet zones and a trolley service? If so, does the trolley sneak/squeak through the quiet zone, or just come as far as the door and whisper "hello"?

 

[AM9]

What would happen to somebody who had a persistent loud sneezing fit?

 

[higthomas]

From my experience Quiet zones tend to be ignored by many. I've been on trains with babies in there, although it was pretty empty at the time.
Also on SWT the trolley attendant seems to speak just as loudly in the quiet zone as elsewhere.
I don't really mind these things, but I guess many people do and so it would be nice if people actually took note of them.

 

[ainsworth74]

Following on from this, are there any trains that have both quiet zones and a trolley service? If so, does the trolley sneak/squeak through the quiet zone, or just come as far as the door and whisper "hello"?

East Coast do and in my experience the trolley person brings it through the carriage and asks people if they want anything. They don't shout and seeing as it's the quiet coach not the silent coach it's not really an issue.

First class the same applies. Staff come through taking orders and serving food/drinks but they just do it at a normal volume.

 

[ECML180]

If so, does the trolley sneak/squeak through the quiet zone, or just come as far as the door and whisper "hello"?

Also on SWT the trolley attendant seems to speak just as loudly in the quiet zone as elsewhere.

It may just be me but I'm sure trolley people (probably 'Mobile Retail Attendants' or similar) seem to be making less noise these days! I remember them walking down the carriage listing what they've got in stock but these days they just seem to wander through without much of a smile and just the occasional 'Tea or Coffee?' when someone looks interested. May well be that no-one would notice them in the quiet zone anyway!

 

[Hadders]

I think quiet zones on longer distance trains is a good thing, and I often use the quiet coaches on Virgin, East Coast and First Great Western as there is generally a better ambiance if you want to concentrate on some work. Also, because the quiet coaches on these operators are at the country end of the train they tend to be less busy as well.

 

[overtonchris]

What would happen to somebody who had a persistent loud sneezing fit?

Well nothing, I'd hope - except to perhaps give them a tissue!

I think the thread was possibly more relating to people who yak away in quiet areas on mobile phones etc. , annoying their fellow passengers and totally ignoring the train signs that in my experience are pretty well displayed...

 

[Bill Stanier]

The most common annoyance for me from other passengers, quiet coach or not, is 'personal' stereos which are not. Those cheap white earphones that come as standard with Apple products seem to be the worst offenders. Not only do they leak sound like a sieve, their sound quality for the user is awful.

 

[overtonchris]

The most common annoyance for me from other passengers, quiet coach or not, is 'personal' stereos which are not. Those cheap white earphones that come as standard with Apple products seem to be the worst offenders. Not only do they leak sound like a sieve, their sound quality for the user is awful.

Bill, you've just made teeth grind! "ShheeeeshDUGGA..SheeeeesshDUGGA....ad nauseam!.....Got stuck with one recently and moved seat. I don't know whether my offender was apple, peach or pear based, but it was really intrusive and jolly annoying!!

 

[Tibbs]

What would happen to somebody who had a persistent loud sneezing fit?

They should be prosecuted, obviously!

I don't sit in Quiet Coaches at all if I can. Noise doesn't really bother me since I invested in good headphones, but the fact that it's supposed to be quiet but isn't does bother me. If it's not supposed to be quiet, then it doesn't bother me at all, even if I can hear it!

 

[455driver]

The most common annoyance for me from other passengers, quiet coach or not, is 'personal' stereos which are not. Those cheap white earphones that come as standard with Apple products seem to be the worst offenders. Not only do they leak sound like a sieve, their sound quality for the user is awful.

I dont agree with you very much but you are absolutely spot on with that one.

I have taken to asking people (where-ever they are sat) if they are using Apple products and invariably the answer is "yes, why" and I just reply "because the whole carriage can hear the sound from your crappy earphones" at which point they normally apologise and turn them down, some go quite red with embarrasment as well!

Apple earphones are rubbish, I bought a cheap and nasty pair of non descript earphones (less than a fiver) and they are 10 times better than the (supposedly) superior quality Apple items!

 

[hassaanhc]

they are 10 times better than the (supposedly) superior quality Apple items!

Wouldn't that apply to the majority of their stuff though? my £10 Skullcandy earphones are really good, don't leak much noise either I think (but then I don't use them when out and about :P)

 

[DownSouth]

I dont agree with you very much but you are absolutely spot on with that one.

I have taken to asking people (where-ever they are sat) if they are using Apple products and invariably the answer is "yes, why" and I just reply "because the whole carriage can hear the sound from your crappy earphones" at which point they normally apologise and turn them down, some go quite red with embarrasment as well!

Apple earphones are rubbish, I bought a cheap and nasty pair of non descript earphones (less than a fiver) and they are 10 times better than the (supposedly) superior quality Apple items!

It's primarily because of Apple's sales strategy that this is the case - I work in a third-party retailer and service centre so I see this behind the scenes.

Providing plenty of opportunities for upgrading with third-party products (e.g. better earphones/headphones, screen protectors etc) keeps the dealers happy and also ensures a good flow of cash from 'made for iPhone/iPod/iPad' certification fees. Selling the big ticket Apple devices only does not provide a meaningful amount of income (we get less than 10% margin on a new computer, iPod or iPad) so dealers need the third party gear to make a decent profit otherwise they'll drop Apple completely.

Samsung unashamedly ape this strategy - the headset supplied with a new Galaxy phone has earphones just as bad as the Apple-supplied earphones but combined with an even worse microphone. HTC supply a reasonable earphone/headset, they are probably the only brand where I'd not dump the standard set immediately.

Apple and Samsung are also required - by agreement with the governments of numerous countries mostly in Europe - to supply open earphones (i.e. they do not block outside sound) as standard to indemnify themselves against any issues with pedestrians getting injured. They used to have some very good in-ear earphones available (I believe they were made by Harman Kardon) but the pedestrian lawsuit issue forced them to be withdrawn from sale - i.e. they sent us a box to ship back the remaining stock!

I use Bose in-ears or Sennheiser open-rear headphones in public, and a Bose dock at home - but then again I did get them at wholesale price rather than giving my employer the benefit of that higher margin I talked about!