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Nifty use of Avantix?

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HowardGWR

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On a recent journey from Carmarthen to Axminster I asked the guard about changing, whether Cardiff or Newport was best and whether via Salisbury was better than via Exeter. He gave me the information and went on. A few minutes later, he re-emerged with mini timetables printed on two blank tickets shewing the changes and arrival / departure times on each route.

I was immensely impressed. How did he do it - anyone know?
 
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TheEdge

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Using the function under Fare Enquiry, aptly named Timetable Enquiry.

Self explanatory really, put two stations in, create itinerary and print. Although it can be slightly dimwitted sometimes...
 

Mojo

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I remember when Avantix was first introduced all those years ago the itineraries were always printed on ticket stock, but when I last asked for one on Southeastern the itinerary came out on receipt roll from the credit card reader. I know that not all Tocs use the same kind of credit card machine, so guess it depends on their set up.
 

LowLevel

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You choose at the point of printing whether to use the ticket stock or the credit card roll. I'm not so fond of the credit card roll as it's easier to lose/get crunched up and unreadable so I generally use the ticket stock, however I believe the TOCs prefer it the other way round as tickets cost more.

Avantix can do all sorts of things, it's just a matter of knowing how to do them - this is one of the easiest.
 

HowardGWR

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You choose at the point of printing whether to use the ticket stock or the credit card roll. I'm not so fond of the credit card roll as it's easier to lose/get crunched up and unreadable so I generally use the ticket stock, however I believe the TOCs prefer it the other way round as tickets cost more.

Avantix can do all sorts of things, it's just a matter of knowing how to do them - this is one of the easiest.
Thanks for replies. The cardboard ticket was much preferred as it was the same size as our tickets ( :D ), so went firmly and nicely in my top shirt pocket. First class service from an Arriva guard who clearly has pride in his job.

I'm intrigued; what else can they do, is there a guide?
 

ATW Alex 101

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When I first seen one (on a London Midland 150 between WOF and SGB), I was pretty amazed by it!

Then London Midland printed them on the orange ticket stock, but now they are printed on the receipt roll. I always prefer the orange ticket ones though. :D
 

LowLevel

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Thanks for replies. The cardboard ticket was much preferred as it was the same size as our tickets ( :D ), so went firmly and nicely in my top shirt pocket. First class service from an Arriva guard who clearly has pride in his job.

I'm intrigued; what else can they do, is there a guide?

Depending on how they're set up, they can print seat reservations, CrossCountry use them to sell food off the trolley, they can do quotes for season tickets of any valid length (but can't sell for longer than a week), they can sell rovers, do supplements to tickets, they have a calculator on them, you can sell special offer tickets like Chester Zoo addons and so on.
 

ainsworth74

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I've often thought that Avantix machines are incredibly powerful pieces of kit (especially considering how old they in technological terms) but that very few people actually know how to use their full capability.
 

Be3G

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Out of interest, how does the Avantix get the timetable data; if by scheduled updates (rather than accessing it instantaneously like a smartphone) how frequent are those updates – e.g. would it know about engineering works, or even better, engineering works that'd been cancelled a few days before they were due to begin?
 

jon0844

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Do they use Windows Mobile? Despite the UI for WM being horrible, as an OS it's probably just fine to run very powerful software even today (even if the hardware might be a bit slower than a modern day smartphone or tablet).
 

LowLevel

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Out of interest, how does the Avantix get the timetable data; if by scheduled updates (rather than accessing it instantaneously like a smartphone) how frequent are those updates – e.g. would it know about engineering works, or even better, engineering works that'd been cancelled a few days before they were due to begin?

They update every day when being 'docked' - once someone has used said device, it gets docked and charges up the battery and then comes out again. The docking station is connected to the network and voila.
 

Flamingo

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We used to be able to print on a ticket or paper, but quite a while ago it changed to paper roll only.

I suppose it's cheaper, and prevents confusion.
 

Hyphen

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Do they use Windows Mobile? Despite the UI for WM being horrible, as an OS it's probably just fine to run very powerful software even today (even if the hardware might be a bit slower than a modern day smartphone or tablet).

I understand they use WM 5.0 (not WinPhone), in a heavily locked down configuration. I was told there was no user access to the 'Start' menu or any of the Control Panel items.

It'd be interesting to see what the next generation of Avantix machines will pick as an underlying OS - in my experience none of the current generation of popular mobile OSes are quite as easy to lock down/secure as WinMo was.
 

jon0844

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Samsung is attempting to add a high level of security to its (Android) devices to protect businesses, seeing a market that they can steal from BlackBerry (a company on borrowed time). Others are also doing, or about to do, the same as the business market must be a profitable route given how saturated the consumer market is becoming.

I think Microsoft also has various security elements coming in Windows Phone to try and make it more appealing to business users, but given there's no backward compatibility there's no need for any developer to remain loyal to Microsoft.

Apple has also claimed to offer security for enterprise users, although I suspect that issuing iPhones would be a rather expensive process and perhaps somewhat over the top.

I am not sure where things stand now, but long after Windows Phone had launched to consumers, there were still many companies building Windows Mobile (6) devices for industry. It's still probably considered a perfectly good OS and quite tried and tested. Restricting access to the Start menu or any other apps is a good thing, as it would then introduce all sorts of problems as staff accidentally mess the thing up!

All that's probably required is a newer device that has a higher resolution screen, a better chipset that would be both faster but also more energy efficient, thus increasing battery life. You'd also expect a capacitive touchscreen to make selecting things easier, and if it was, say, a Samsung made device it might even have S-Pen support to allow people to still electronically sign things.

As such, RPIs could be given these devices to electronically capture data that might be used for prosecutions, with the passenger able to sign as they would a notebook today. Obviously the software would then ensure the file was saved and encrypted with no way to make subsequent edits later.

Perhaps that's going a bit too far, but I am sure it will happen one day. You might even have the system capturing interviews and converting speech to text in real time to make things even quicker (while saving the audio of the conversation simultaneously).

Oh, and the next gen kit would have its own connectivity to get real time updates and send back data without having to be docked. This would then make it easier to validate e/m-tickets.
 
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tsr

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Just one thing... the smartcards. You forgot the smartcards! ;)

Now, the key and I believe other cards, except the non-ITSO Oyster cards, are able to be read by NFC chips in some phones. I can't see a reason why opportunities to both read and sell to smartcards wouldn't be a good thing.

At the moment, for example, some stations with key availability do not have TVMs, and as such you cannot purchase tickets explicitly named to/from those stations, and only break journeys. An example is Betchworth. Now, if the guard on the train could sell a ticket to the key, there would be no problem in allowing passengers to use such a scheme - rather than paper tickets from an Avantix which may not work barriers. Etc. etc.
 

jon0844

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Just one thing... the smartcards. You forgot the smartcards! ;)

Oops. And what a stupid error for someone who is always preaching about smartcards as the future. :oops:

So, yes, the means to read and write to smartcards is another must!
 

185

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Love it or hate it.

Avantix is a perfect size to fit in the microwave at York Mess Room. I was once told by the Avantix Helpline to 'dock' the machine whilst 170 miles from my home depot. I offered a choice of two handy docking places, the King George V or the Victoria dock.

*runs for cover*
 

sarahj

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The advantix can read the key smart card. When the Key first came out it was what we were supposed to do. However the selection would jam the machine and after reading one card you were unable to do anything else with the advantix for 2-4 mins, ie sell tickets. So we just stopped checking keys and just going 'thats fine' when someone showed us one. In the end southern relented and got us handy readers.
On the advantix we were supposed to be able to do things like 'tap' in a key and mark it as checked.

BTW, down in Southern land we can print an itinery on both ticket stock and CC paper. Same for reciepts. I think a TOC not allowing them on ticket stock is just being extra stingy. After all, how much ticket stock do you see lying around depots being wasted, and if an advantix can print off a auto non issue at least 5 times a shift its happy. They do like to jam, esp at 3am when your trying to log off and go home. 'printer disconnected' aghghhhhhhhhh<(
 

6Gman

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Thanks for replies. The cardboard ticket was much preferred as it was the same size as our tickets ( :D ), so went firmly and nicely in my top shirt pocket. First class service from an Arriva guard who clearly has pride in his job.

I'm intrigued; what else can they do, is there a guide?

There will somebody along soon on the Disputes & Prosecutions forum complaining that they had thrown away their ticket by mistake thinking it was an itinerary they no longer needed! :D
 

Be3G

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They update every day when being 'docked' - once someone has used said device, it gets docked and charges up the battery and then comes out again. The docking station is connected to the network and voila.

I see! Thanks for the explanation.

Apple has also claimed to offer security for enterprise users, although I suspect that issuing iPhones would be a rather expensive process and perhaps somewhat over the top.

I can't argue about that in terms of cost, but I believe in general iOS is a very secure platform, and there're various tricks available if using Apple Configurator. There's also the little-talked-about Guided Access mode, although I don't know how well that actually works.
 

sarahj

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There will somebody along soon on the Disputes & Prosecutions forum complaining that they had thrown away their ticket by mistake thinking it was an itinerary they no longer needed! :D

It says on it many times. NOT VALID FOR TRAVEL.
 

AndyNLondon

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Nothing is idiot-proof. Fools are very ingenious. :D
Quite, as anyone who's had the "joy" of working on any kind of helpline will know, nature responds to claims of idiot-proof-ness by supplying a better quality idiot :lol:
 

Hyphen

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Quite, as anyone who's had the "joy" of working on any kind of helpline will know, nature responds to claims of idiot-proof-ness by supplying a better quality idiot :lol:

As someone who's graduated his way up to his current role (which thankfully sees very little contact with people!) from a first-line IT helldesk role, it's all very true - I can sadly recount many hundreds of 'facepalm' tales from telephone calls and emails.

(now veering dangerously off topic) That said, I had to have a rather deep helldesk-style sigh watching Pointless the other day - not something I'd done in a while... The question was 'Elements beginning with the two letters of their chemical symbol'. The answers given:
unobtainium2.png
 

TheEdge

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Xenon, Helium, Selenium.

Back to topic. We are allowed to print on either ticket stock or roll. To my eye ticket stock looks more professional rather than on just a scrap of receipt.
 

richw

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Quite, as anyone who's had the "joy" of working on any kind of helpline will know, nature responds to claims of idiot-proof-ness by supplying a better quality idiot :lol:

I have at least one a day and I'm not even on a helpline!
Engage brain before going out of your way to ask something would be a great step forward.
 

Sir_Clagalot

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We only get taught the basics, ie ticket selection with railcards etc and how to do timetables and pairing of equipment, plus there is only so much we ca actually access on the things. They are well overdue replacement as they are incredibly bulky and at times incredibly dimwitted and slow, especially on a reboot mid shift (why does it always happen when on a busy train?!). Reciepts I print on either as it depends if the Thyron is in standby or normal as to whether I print on ticket or paper. If doing a card then the reciept is printed out after the card reciept.
 

Flamingo

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No, the reboot moment usually happens when one has just a five minute argument with somebody over the validity (or rather, non-validity) of their ticket, and you just want to sell a new one to them and get out of there before somebody hits something - instead of which you now have three or four minutes to make polite conversation with them...
 
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HowardGWR

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No, the reboot moment usually happens when one has just a five minute argument with somebody over the validity (or rather, non-validity) of their ticket, and you just want to sell a new one to them and get out of there before somebody hits something - instead of which you now have three or four minutes to make polite conversation with them...

Will real wifi access change these situations dramatically (presumably with new equipment that can check the credit cards validity like they do in the shops)?
 

Fincra5

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Often i'll do a timetable ticket for little kids that wan't tickets (but don't need them)...
 
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