Dawlish sea wall collapse

[HowardGWR]

First time I've heard of a "linear" monument!

The new website for the line http://therivieraline.com/appears to have left it out too!

Hadrian's wall is another example.

I notice they are clearing up the huge hole behind the new concrete 'cage' that the track runs on.

See https://www.networkrail.co.uk/timetables-and-travel/storm-damage/dawlish/

I just wondered who is paying for restitution of the roadway. May I assume that DevCC are picking up that tab?

 

[eastdyke]

First time I've heard of a "linear" monument!

The new website for the line http://therivieraline.com/appears to have left it out too!

Sorry, I was a bit short on the detail.

The South Devon Railway is listed on English Heritage PastScape here:

http://www.pastscape.org.uk/hob.aspx?hob_id=1359294#aRm

I have been unable to establish any detailed listing of the 'Brunel' sea wall but that does not mean it is not listed!

I have been able to establish that Dawlish Station is Listed Grade II:

http://www.pastscape.org.uk/hob.aspx?hob_id=497384.

I would welcome more detail from those who have researched further.

Best Regards.

 

[LateThanNever]

Hadrian's wall is another example.

At least it's Roman - and look, no trains!

I just wondered who is paying for restitution of the roadway. May I assume that DevCC are picking up that tab?

Cannot believe it'd be anyone else..

 

[Graiser]

Hadrian's wall is another example.

I notice they are clearing up the huge hole behind the new concrete 'cage' that the track runs on.

See https://www.networkrail.co.uk/timetables-and-travel/storm-damage/dawlish/

I just wondered who is paying for restitution of the roadway. May I assume that DevCC are picking up that tab?

I believe they are as NWR would not accept any subsequent liabilities for the road reinstatement

 

[sbatts43]

Can anyone help me? I have noticed since the trains started running again at Dawlish after the engineering works, Real Time Trains has not been working properly. Most of the trains have N/R next to them, unless they have approaching next to them, when they report normally. Then approaching Is not taken off. This seems to be getting worse. Anybody got any Ideas why this Is happening as before storms It was working perfectly well.

 

[Temple Meads]

Can anyone help me? I have noticed since the trains started running again at Dawlish after the engineering works, Real Time Trains has not been working properly. Most of the trains have N/R next to them, unless they have approaching next to them, when they report normally. Then approaching Is not taken off. This seems to be getting worse. Anybody got any Ideas why this Is happening as before storms It was working perfectly well.

Probably to do with the fact that the signalling isn't fully functioning yet, the short closure at the end of the month should sort it out.

 

[455driver]

What Temple Meads said, RTT is fed from the tack circuits and as the train is recorded on that track circuit it is reported, because the track circuits (and hence signalling) is not working there wont be any reports to feed into RTT.

All should be back to normal after the closure at the end of the month.

 

[ModernRailways]

What Temple Meads said, RTT is fed from the tack circuits and as the train is recorded on that track circuit it is reported, because the track circuits (and hence signalling) is not working there wont be any reports to feed into RTT.

All should be back to normal after the closure at the end of the month.

Potentially stupid question, but if this is the case how are Network Rail controlling the trains? I was of the view that Network Rail signalling centres used track circuits to locate the train which is why when a track circuit is faulty it can cause massive delays.

 

[TEW]

A number of the signals between Dawlish Warren and Teignmouth are out of use, with the section between Dawlish Warren and Teignmouth currently being operated as one long signalling section. I imagine train detection is being achieved by temporary axle counters.

 

[jopsuk]

Presumably those will be reporting to the signal boxes concerned, but won't (for all sorts of reasons) be communicating with the national systems.

 

[TEW]

I imagine at the moment as it is just one long section the signalbox will simply be aware that the train is in the long section but not where within it. It all depends on how many track circuits/axle counters are set up. Realtime Trains normally uses the Train Describer feeds which provide much more accurate location information, but I doubt that is available in the affected section at the moment.

 

[sbatts43]

Thanks everybody for the answers. I am much wiser now. Thanks again.

 

[Freightmaster]

A number of the signals between Dawlish Warren and Teignmouth are out of use, with the section between Dawlish Warren and Teignmouth currently being operated as one long signalling section...

...which ironically is exactly what used to happen most of the time
before the line was resignalled (IIRC, the box at Dawlish was only
'switched in' on Summer Saturdays).

MARK

 

[Bald Rick]

It will be because the train reporting works off specific track circuit berths. If those track circuits are not working, or in this case, temporarily not in the signalling system at all, then the train reporting system won't pick up a report.

 

[infobleep]

I take it they are still able to run a normal timetable over it despite these issues?

Sent from my Nexus 5 using Tapatalk

 

[TEW]

The timetable being run is normal as far as I know but services might experience minor delays in the area. Much of the area is subject to temporary speed restrictions and because of the long signalling sections services can't follow as closely as normal.

 

[455driver]

As long as all the trains run near enough to time then it works fine, the problem is if a train is delayed then it will delay the one behind it while it clears the (very long) section which in turn will delay the one behind it etc etc. There isnt much margin for error and it could take a while to recover the service.

Some info forwarded to me-

On the down only one signal is bagged which is DM206 on the end of Dawlish platform so the section is basically from Langstone Rock to just after the tunnels.
But on the up there are 3 bagged UM207 (before Parsons tunnel) , UM208 (in between a couple of the tunnels) and E17 (just after Dawlish platform) so the section is from just after Teignmouth station all the way to just after Langstone Rock.

A couple of signals have had their aspects restricted to conform with the (nearly) normal signalling rules as well, on the down E72 is red green only, (then the bagged DM206), DM207 has no red aspect so is a distant for DM208 which is normal.
On the UP, UM208 is red/green only (then the 3 bagged ones), then E19 has no red aspect and is a distant for E21 (just before Dawlish Warren) which is normal.

 

[patstonuk]

Most 'Up' Class 1 services seemed delayed by a consistent six minutes by the time they arrived at EXD yesterday.

 

[irish_rail]

Most 'Up' Class 1 services seemed delayed by a consistent six minutes by the time they arrived at EXD yesterday.

I managed to arrive into Exeter 1 early yesterday!

 

[ModernRailways]

As long as all the trains run near enough to time then it works fine, the problem is if a train is delayed then it will delay the one behind it while it clears the (very long) section which in turn will delay the one behind it etc etc. There isnt much margin for error and it could take a while to recover the service.

Some info forwarded to me-

On the down only one signal is bagged which is DM206 on the end of Dawlish platform so the section is basically from Langstone Rock to just after the tunnels.
But on the up there are 3 bagged UM207 (before Parsons tunnel) , UM208 (in between a couple of the tunnels) and E17 (just after Dawlish platform) so the section is from just after Teignmouth station all the way to just after Langstone Rock.

A couple of signals have had their aspects restricted to conform with the (nearly) normal signalling rules as well, on the down E72 is red green only, (then the bagged DM206), DM207 has no red aspect so is a distant for DM208 which is normal.
On the UP, UM208 is red/green only (then the 3 bagged ones), then E19 has no red aspect and is a distant for E21 (just before Dawlish Warren) which is normal.

Thanks for the info - and to everyone else too!

So it's seems like it's more of a hope everything goes alright and if it goes to pot then it's a case of scrap the timetable and get services moving as much as possible before trying to get the timetable back!

How long will it take for the signals to be back? May it not have been better/easier for Network Rail to close the line for an extra 2 days or so, so that the signalling etc. could have been implemented and ready instead of closing the line later on in the year for a few days? I'm aware they wanted it back as soon as possible, but those 2 days extra in the grand scheme of things would have been better surely? Unless, of course when the line is closed later for signals to be replaced they will be doing other track/embankment maintenance?

 

[TEW]

There will be a possession at the end of the month, 26th-27th April when full signalling will be restored. I expect if it was just a simple 2 day job then it would have been completed before reopening but I expect there is still work to be done before the possession to allow the signalling to be restored.

 

[infobleep]

Fascinating reading. Thanks for informing us people.

Sent from my Nexus 5 using Tapatalk

 

[D1009]

It was mentioned earlier in the thread that the axle counters had been damaged beyond repair as a result of the work in restoring the railway, and my understanding is that it has proved difficult to procure replacements. At least he temporary arrangements aren't as bad as those at Bridgwater, where all trains in both directions had to be stopped and talked by. However full signalling at Bridgwater was restored last Tuesday night, which caught me out on Wednesday when the train I was expecting to be late at Temple Meads was on time!

 

[Rapidash]

Had my first commute on the route since the smoting. Two coach 142, full and standing, had brats kicking my seat, delayed by the ever-delayed PAD service. Still only took an hour to get to the bay, halving the time the bus has been taking. Felt good to be back

 

[plymothian]

Those in the South West, BBC1 has a feature on this now.

 

[PHILIPE]

Had my first commute on the route since the smoting. Two coach 142, full and standing, had brats kicking my seat, delayed by the ever-delayed PAD service. Still only took an hour to get to the bay, halving the time the bus has been taking. Felt good to be back

You wouldn't have gone through Dawlish on a 142. Those that were down there left in December 2011.

 

[Rapidash]

Bloomin` kindle keyboard and pudgy fingers, never a good combo

 

[455driver]

May it not have been better/easier for Network Rail to close the line for an extra 2 days or so, so that the signalling etc. could have been implemented and ready instead of closing the line later on in the year for a few days?

If they had the bits it would have been, but they didnt have the parts available at the time.

 

[yorksrob]

Well, it was certainly nice to see such exotic destinations as Lostwithiel, Par and St Erth back on the destination boards at Leeds again.

 

[Xenophon PCDGS]

You wouldn't have gone through Dawlish on a 142. Those that were down there left in December 2011.

Let us know where these Class 142 monstrosities went to, as if we did not already know