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west somerset railway mainline connection

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simon.exd

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Anyone enlighten me on why the West Somerset seem to have little or no interest in running into Taunton station? Surely that would make perfect sense, any railway with a decent mainline connection has to see a massive increase in visitor numbers..

As far as I know there would be no need to run on the mainline as there is still space for an independent track to be laid parallel to the big railway.. and isnt the bay platform at the south end of Taunton station big enough to take 5 carriages?

Bishops Lydeard is a lovely little station but not a great place to get to, Norton Fitzwarren can hardly compare to Taunton..

Please extend to Taunton, in the name of progress and easier accessibility.. please!!!
 
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RailUK Forums

60163

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Um, one of the reasons I was able to go to the June mixed traction gala was because they laid on a DMU shuttle between Bishops Lydeard and....Taunton. :D


No. 88 and 150265, Bishops Lydeard by JH Stokes, on Flickr
--- old post above --- --- new post below ---
Oh, and

150265, Bishops Lydeard by JH Stokes, on Flickr

I hope they do it more often, made it pretty straightforward to get there from Birmingham!
 

jnjkerbin

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My understanding is that since the removal of the Up relief line, the tracks were slewed to allow a faster line speed. This means there is no room.

Taunton station is very busy; it isn't like running trains from Grosmont to Whitby. I believe that the WSR want a mainline TOC to run trains to Bishops Lydeard on a permanent/Summer only basis. However, as you can imagine, TOCs are about as willing to introduce a new service as the Bluebell Railway is to have a diesel gala!
 

Greenback

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We have had a thread on this topic previously, where it was explained that the costs of running into Taunton would be far in excess of any potential revenue increase for the WSR. Therefore running into the main line station is not viable financially. IIRC, new track would have to be laid as there would be insufficient capacity without it.

As much as I personally would like to be able to connect at Taunton rather than take a bus (which is one reason why I haven't visited the line for many years), I'd rather the railway continued to run than for it to go bankrupt as a result of an expensive extension.
 

Bedpan

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Wasn't it originally (that is, at the time that the extension to Bishops Lydeard was opened) planned that the WSR trains would run to Taunton, but this never happened due to union hostility?
 

DaveHarries

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Wasn't it originally (that is, at the time that the extension to Bishops Lydeard was opened) planned that the WSR trains would run to Taunton, but this never happened due to union hostility?

"It was in the middle of 1976 that the Taunton branch of the National Union of Railwaymen decided to operate a policy of non-co-operation towards the WSR. The NUR members in question were actually bus drivers, whose allegiance derived from the days when they replaced train drivers on the Taunton - Minehead route."

[from "Portrait of the West Somerset Railway" by Allan Stanistreet, 1996]

HTIOI,
Dave
 

broadgage

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I would like to see through running between the WSR and the national network, but fear that regular through running is unlikely for the reasons given of expense and a heavily used main line.

With the present track arrangement, through running means running on the mainline, with the requirement for mainline certification of staff and stock.

An additional track would be very expensive.

I suspect that eventually this will happen.
Taunton is an increasingly popular destination for both commuters and leisure, it might prove possible to extend to Bishops Lydeard a few services that at present terminate at Taunton.
In the holiday season, FGW services to the West are frequently overcrowded, and it might be worth running the odd service Paddington to Taunton and Bishops Lydeard, and then omitting the Taunton stop on the next Plymouth or Penzance service.
This would slightly accelerate the service to the far West, and provide a useful service to Taunton, and onwards to Minehead with only one change.
 

simon.exd

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There was something online the other day about the WSR having a 10 year plan and running back into Taunton is part of that..
We had a cracking day on the WSR today... I was reading in the latest journal about parking problems at Lydeard, and how the railway is anticipating increased passenger numbers in the future...
I thought that there was still room to put an independent line in beside the mainline, someone told me that the new flyover at Silkmills at been built with that in mind!

Good luck to the WSR, if they keep doing what they are doing we will keep visiting!
 

455driver

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They could have had the connection in years ago but didnt want it at the time (there was also 'issues' with the buses running to Minehead).

I dont there is enough room now because the mainlines have been slewed across and the old Cider factory area has been built on further narrowing the land available.

It probably can be done but will cost much more (in real terms) than it would have done back in the 1980s/1990s.
 

Hardcastle

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There was a trial service about a decade ago from Bristol to Minehead direct at summer weekends I don't know what happened to it though or if it was successful I think it was hauled by a class 31.
 

Crawley Ben

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There was a trial service about a decade ago from Bristol to Minehead direct at summer weekends I don't know what happened to it though or if it was successful I think it was hauled by a class 31.

Wasn't that something to do with the Butlins Holiday Resort at Minehead as opposed to a trial commuter service or am I dreaming that stuff up? :lol:

Ben
 

WSW

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Anyone enlighten me on why the West Somerset seem to have little or no interest in running into Taunton station? Surely that would make perfect sense, any railway with a decent mainline connection has to see a massive increase in visitor numbers..

As far as I know there would be no need to run on the mainline as there is still space for an independent track to be laid parallel to the big railway.. and isnt the bay platform at the south end of Taunton station big enough to take 5 carriages?

Bishops Lydeard is a lovely little station but not a great place to get to, Norton Fitzwarren can hardly compare to Taunton..

Please extend to Taunton, in the name of progress and easier accessibility.. please!!!

It seems so simple and many of us have often wondered why it has never happened. To find out why we need to go back in time ;)

This subject has been aired on a regular basis. Many of the replies to this thread have touched on the main issues over the years.

It is true the 1970s layout at Norton Fitzwarren, with the Minehead line continuing into the Up Relief would have allowed WSR DMUs to access Platform Six at Taunton Station. And that was the original plan of the then WSR Company. The LRO for the Minehead Branch still allows for WSR DMUs to run at max 40mph, although this has never been permitted in the WSR's Rule Book(s).

However, the plan was scuppered by the NUR who effectively blacked any WSR service on BR tracks due to the NUR's belief that a rail service between Minehead and Taunton would put NUR bus drivers jobs at risk (historically the Minehead bus service was manned by NUR members due to the GWR/Western National roots of the service). That action (or inaction) by the NUR, coupled with the WSR's own financial difficulties, led to the official laying-aside of plans to run a regular service between Taunton and Minehead. Never abandoned the idea, though.

Years later the NUR (or its successor) lifted the ban but by then it was too late for the WSR. It's own financial rebuilding was still underway under a very carefully constructed plan. And of course the Up Relief had long gone - some of the trackbed used for a realigned Up Fast - although thankfully BR had converted the last few yards of their bit of the Minehead Branch into a siding for use by Taunton Cider. And thus the connection was, just, hanging on by the width of a fishplate or two.

When further mainline upgrading was undertaken, the WSR was encouraged to secure the mainline connection by making a large financial contribution towards a better arrangement at Norton Fitzwarren Junction, with Taunton Cider now defunct. The WSR, by then in a better financial position, made that contribution which nowadays allows the regular weekday ballast trains to access the WSR.

It also allows the occasional passenger services (charters, ECS, shuttles and the trial Bristol-Minehead service which lasted one summer) and other departmental or freight trains (such as the various stone train contracts).

The WSR's Draft Ten Year Plan does indeed perpetuate the idea of improving the services to and from the WSR. Several options remain open and the WSR is actively involved in regular discussions with the authorities and TOCs. The most likely scenario will be the extending of a service currently terminating at Taunton down to Bishops Lydeard. The WSR's plans to remodel the trackwork at the southern end of Bishops Lydeard Station would allow a TOC train (up to four coaches) to terminate in Platform Three (currently no more than a siding) allowing cross-platform transfer to a WSR train. A more ambitious scenario would see a TOC train run right down to Minehead and back (but that raises path occupancy issues as the WSR still has two long, 6 mile, sections in its near 23 mile length)

It goes without saying that nothing will happen if the sums don't add up. A loss-making Taunton service will soon collapse and if we are not careful it would take the WSR with it.

The above is just my own take on things and I hope this helps a bit.

Steve
Actively working on the WSR since 1976
 

STEVIEBOY1

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Wasn't that something to do with the Butlins Holiday Resort at Minehead as opposed to a trial commuter service or am I dreaming that stuff up? :lol:

Ben

Yes, I think you are correct, it was something in connection with Butlins. I think there was also a service direct from Brum using 125s for a while to Minehead.

It would be good for the WSR to go to Taunton. I think I read, perhaps elsewhere on this forum infact, that it may be just possible build a simple platform and run around loop to the south of the mainline station so passengers would l just have to cross the road between the stations, of course some sort of footpath would have to be constructed too. This would not really therefore affect or cause conflict with the mainline services.

However for the time being, it will just have to remain taking the bus connection, or doing the odd charter trains which visit the WSR, I have done a couple of those in recent years by mainline steam or diesel from London.

(All being well UK Railtours are doing one from Waterloo in May using the 158/159 DMUS from Southwest Trains which should be good.)

The WSR is a good line and the staff there are very friendly, they have a good selection of railway modeling odds and ends for sale at Minehead too.
 

PHILIPE

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There would have to be an independent line into Taunton using a former bay as has already been pointed out. Also, as well as the track being slewed (already mentioned) there is a signal equipment cabin in the way.
 
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