Liverpool to Lincoln Central 18.52

[xtradj]

The 18.52 former lime st to nottm now continues partly to Lincoln central today Tuesday. Is this a one off or now regular as timetable does not show this
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Looked closer and it seems it stays at nottm for 53 mins before leaving for Lincoln hense seems silly to class it as a same service?

 

[sonic2009]

I would think that it's a 4 car 158 that splits to 2 x 2 car 158, which runs 1 x 2 car runs to Lincoln.

 

[xtradj]

I would think that it's a 4 car 158 that splits to 2 x 2 car 158, which runs 1 x 2 car runs to Lincoln.

I would agree. Just puzzled as to why its classed as same service as it waits at nottm for 53mins. I would class these as two seperate services even though same train part being used

 

[Xenophon PCDGS]

Are there many other "direct" services where a similar wait after 53 minutes after being split is said to be the norm ?

 

[ushawk]

http://www.realtimetrains.co.uk/train/C61252/2013/12/10/advanced

Rather interestingly, the Lincoln service passes Newark F.C. 3 times as it serves Newark Castle, then reverses and serves North Gate, then reverses again to carry on to Lincoln.

Do any other services do this ?

 

[MidnightFlyer]

Are there many other "direct" services where a similar wait after 53 minutes after being split is said to be the norm ?

Not an example from Britain granted, but I'm sure on Monday mornings the 0455 Tralee-Cork service in the Irish Republic waits at Mallow for about 70 minutes before continuing to Cork. The service in reality acts as a Dublin service from Co. Kerry (cross-platform interchange at Mallow), so I doubt many do it through to Cork (there might even be another service before it whilst it waits in the station!), but it's shown in the timetable nonetheless.

NB - On Tuesdays-Fridays the service runs at 0555, so the wait is only roughly 10 minutes.

http://www.realtimetrains.co.uk/train/C61252/2013/12/10/advanced

Rather interestingly, the Lincoln service passes Newark F.C. 3 times as it serves Newark Castle, then reverses and serves North Gate, then reverses again to carry on to Lincoln.

Do any other services do this ?

Would it cross the flat three times? There's a connection from the Lincoln line to the ECML which avoids the flat crossing, surely it uses that? Nonetheless, it's done a good few times on Sundays.

 

[ushawk]

Would it cross the flat three times? There's a connection from the Lincoln line to the ECML which avoids the flat crossing, surely it uses that? Nonetheless, it's done a good few times on Sundays.

It does use the "avoiding" line but its timing point is the crossing.

 

[dzug2]

Cross Country trains have been waiting something around half an hour southbound at Bristol Temple Meads during recent engineering work on Sundays

 

[Tomnick]

Have I missed something? Is it advertised as a direct service anywhere? Looks like two separate services, albeit with the association shown in RTT.

One or two services do reverse east of Newark Crossing to serve Northgate en route to/from Nottingham - mainly Sundays and at either end of the weekday service, I think. Used to happen more frequently in years gone by though.

 

[yorkie]

Listen very carefully: it crosses only once

But it passes the timing point 3 times.
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Looked closer and it seems it stays at nottm for 53 mins before leaving for Lincoln hense seems silly to class it as a same service?

I agree it seems silly if anyone is classing it as the same service. Who is doing that?

 

[PHILIPE]

Cross Country trains have been waiting something around half an hour southbound at Bristol Temple Meads during recent engineering work on Sundays

That is because of diversions with subsequent later arrival at Bristol TM, XC are retimed to take the path of the next train an hour later working on a clockface timetable

 

[YorkshireRider]

The 1359 Leeds to London St Panc EMT service, on Sunday, waited at Sheffield for 50 mins and was advertised as a through service.

 

[David Barrett]

It does use the "avoiding" line

Newark Curve.

 

[Boothby97]

http://www.realtimetrains.co.uk/train/C61252/2013/12/10/advanced

Rather interestingly, the Lincoln service passes Newark F.C. 3 times as it serves Newark Castle, then reverses and serves North Gate, then reverses again to carry on to Lincoln.

Do any other services do this ?

Well, it crosses the flat crossing once, but passes Newark Crossing East Jn three times (including a reversal). The other weekday service that serves both North Gate and Castle is this,
2L50 0526 Lincoln-Nottingham - http://www.realtimetrains.co.uk/train/C61161/2013/12/10/advanced

There are four services on Sunday
2L50 1500 Lincoln-Nottingham - http://www.realtimetrains.co.uk/train/C61160/2013/12/15/advanced
2L81 1836 Nottingham-Lincoln - http://www.realtimetrains.co.uk/train/C61226/2013/12/15/advanced
2L74 2100 Lincoln-Nottingham - http://www.realtimetrains.co.uk/train/C61209/2013/12/15/advanced
2L91 2228 Nottingham-Lincoln - http://www.realtimetrains.co.uk/train/C61251/2013/12/15/advanced

 

[louis97]

Have I missed something? Is it advertised as a direct service anywhere? Looks like two separate services, albeit with the association shown in RTT.

Its just how the data from the feed is interpreted when a service has a forming service mid journey, whether there is a long wait or not. LDB on National Rail does it too. There is also a Liverpool to Norwich/Derby service that is advertised too.

Here: http://www.realtimetrains.co.uk/train/C60677/2013/12/10/advanced

 

[trentside]

LI agree it seems silly if anyone is classing it as the same service. Who is doing that?

I'd also be interested to know that, as it appears to be correctly displaying on Real Time Trains as being two separate services (with separate headcodes), just formed by the same unit. 2L91 has been formed of a 158 for quite awhile now, as the unit drops onto a Lincoln - Leicester diagram the next day, but I'm not sure whether it always came from Liverpool?

 

[Darren R]

It's not a through service. It's the 1852 EMT Liverpool Lime Street to Nottingham, as described on the RTT page. The 2226 EMT service from Nottingham to Lincoln is a seperate service - it just happens to be formed from the same stock. In areas controlled by IECCs like Nottingham the next trip in the booked diagram is listed at the terminus, in areas controlled by PSBs they do not. (On RTT look at Leeds terminators - the next service is shown, whereas at Sheffield they do not.)

 

[Tom]

In areas controlled by IECCs like Nottingham the next trip in the booked diagram is listed at the terminus, in areas controlled by PSBs they do not.

Dependent on the presence of ARS/ACI, to be precise.

 

[Darren R]

Dependent on the presence of ARS/ACI, to be precise.

Ah - so that's what makes the difference! I had wondered from time-to-time!

Incidentally, what's ACI? I know what ARS is, but never heard of ACI.

 

[Tom]

Automatic Code Insertion.

 

[Darren R]

Oh yes - I could have worked that one out for myself...

 

[xtradj]

The lime street departure boards show nottm and Lincoln Central and also norwich and derby. That's the confusion