Southern's "the key" extended to London

[GodAtum]

Make sure you get one with a photo on it, as you need a photo if you want to put a season on the Key.

Oh too late i will contact them and change. Although all it says it in the FAQs is

No, you wont need a photocard when travelling on a Southern service, however if travelling on another operator they may request to a photocard or another form of personal identification may also be requested when travelling on other Train Operators as per the National Rail Conditions of Carriage. Relevant photo identification will also be required to support some discounted tickets e.g.16-25 Railcard.

 

[radamfi]

Oh too late i will contact them and change. Although all it says it in the FAQs is

Oh, maybe this has changed. I'm sure when I applied some time ago you had to get a photo for a season.

This post from December implies that you needed a photo for a season longer than a week.

http://www.railforums.co.uk/showpost.php?p=1308709&postcount=1

 

[Muzer]

You need a photo for a child season at least.

 

[Deerfold]

No, you wont need a photocard when travelling on a Southern service, however if travelling on another operator they may request to a photocard or another form of personal identification may also be requested when travelling on other Train Operators as per the National Rail Conditions of Carriage.

Wow - the standard of English in that sentence is dreadful.

 

[Stats]

I intend to convert my Crawley to Victoria season to the Key from next month and we'll see if I have any problems when I change at Gatwick on the Express! I actually normally travel from Three Bridges and only buy the ticket to Crawley because the fare is the same. The paper ticket is accepted at the Three Bridges barriers (and also at East Croydon and Redhill) so I wonder whether the Key season will work those barriers as well?

It should do!

Can I break my journey with my key Season ticket?

You can break your journey at any station where the key is accepted along your Season ticket route.

My question is are you allowed to combine a smartcard with a paper ticket? I know Condition 19 of the NRCoC allows a combination of tickets, but does a smartcard have a special exemption from this condition? If one didn't touch in could they be liable for a penalty fare as suggested by Southern?

Does everyone need to touch in and out?

Yes, for all journeys you should touch in and touch out at a gate of a free standing validator. By touching in, you are starting your journey. Customers who fail to touch in, could be liable for a penalty fare.

What happens if I don’t touch in and out?

You are required to always touch in and touch out on every journey as per the conditions of use. If you do not touch in and touch out we reserve the right to disable your key.

 

[Muzer]

I would say "no" - it's the same on Oyster. You can't split with an Oyster ticket without touching in/out as necessary because that would go against the Oyster Ts & Cs.

 

[Tom]

Given that you can't touch in and out when breaking your journey due to system limitations, condition 19 is totally legal to use. The line becomes blurred if you have a single/return ticket as, really, it should be validated (revenue/guards should be able to do this if they have the appropriate equipment issued). For seasons, your card holds a valid product and the requirement to touch in/out simply isn't workable at most locations in practice.

Bear in mind that with an Oyster season you can make use of condition 19...

 

[radamfi]

There were flyers on the seats on my Gatwick Express this morning (0744 from Brighton), advertising the Key.

 

[GodAtum]

So I got my key Do I just buy a ticket (East Croydon - London monthly) online as I usually would and then touch in to load?

 

[andrewkeith5]

So I got my key Do I just buy a ticket (East Croydon - London monthly) online as I usually would and then touch in to load?

Largely, though with some differences. Firstly, make sure you select a "Smart" ticket e.g. "Smart 7-day Season", secondly you have to be sure to select Key Card as a delivery method (the website should display the details of the key linked to your account, if it doesn't you need to login via www.southernrailway.co.uk/thekey ) and make sure you select the right station - unlike FastTicket, you have to collect the ticket from the station you choose.

 

[GodAtum]

Thanks I cannot seem to find any tickets for ECR-London monthly with the smartcard option ticked?

 

[radamfi]

Thanks I cannot seem to find any tickets for ECR-London monthly with the smartcard option ticked?

You need to select East Croydon to London Victoria.

 

[GodAtum]

Ah Ok. the Key might not be for me. Instead of buying a paper 1st class ECR-London z1-5 (which I always have to replace once a month!). It looks like i can only buy to Victoria.

 

[JonathanH]

Is Redhill the black sheep of The Southern Network? I once stayed there for a couple of nights as The Travelodge is very handy for the station and was very perplexed to find out that none of Southern's £5 advance singles to Southampton/Eastbourne are available from Redhill yet are possible from London, Croydon and even East Grinstead!! I'd be a bit annoyed if I lived there. Therefore it doesn't surprise me that The Key isn't usable there yet.

Quite - yet they still put up posters advertising £5 advance fares at Redhill-area stations and the quotas prevent certain long distance advance tickets being booked even though there might be availability on the long-distance train.

 

[johnnycache]

Quite - yet they still put up posters advertising £5 advance fares at Redhill-area stations and the quotas prevent certain long distance advance tickets being booked even though there might be availability on the long-distance train.

The posters should not be displayed at Redhill as there are no Advance fares from
Redhill to the south coast
However the walk-up fares are low eg off-peak day return Redhill to Southampton £15

Regarding the key - there are quite a lot of stations not yet offering fares to London eg Uckfield and East Grinstead lines, Dorking-Epsom, Horley-Merstham

I think its because those stations do not have season fares specifically to Victoria

 

[radamfi]

Going back to whether you need a photocard for monthy season tickets:

http://www.southernrailway.com/tickets-and-fares/season-tickets/photocards/

Holders of Smartcards who wish to purchase monthly Smart season tickets from the Southern website must have a photo on their Smartcard. If you are purchasing a weekly Smart season, you will not require a photo on your card. During the purchase process of a Smart season ticket you will be asked to enter your name and photocard ID, please enter your name and the last 8 numbers on the front or the reverse of your card. If you have a Smartcard without a photo attached and you wish to purchase a monthly season, you will need to contact customer Services in order to have a new card sent to you. Please note that annual Smart season tickets are currently not available as the scheme is currently in a pilot.

--- old post above --- --- new post below ---
OK, so I have picked up my season ticket from Crawley to Victoria at the gates at Crawley this morning, no problem. But it didn't work at Gatwick, whereas my paper season ticket did. So I would assume that it doesn't work at intermediate stations and therefore I'll have to use the side gate most of the time as I usually travel between Three Bridges and Victoria and hardly ever go to Crawley. I only get the ticket to Crawley because the fare is the same.
--- old post above --- --- new post below ---
I just contacted Southern by Twitter and they say it should work at intermediate stations.

 

[GodAtum]

Got my key but could not put my monthly z1-5 travelcard on it. I hope they extend it soon.

 

[radamfi]

Got my key but could not put my monthly z1-5 travelcard on it. I hope they extend it soon.

Obviously most people needing zones 1 to 5 will have it on Oyster, but of course only Standard Class. Presumably it would require Oyster to be extended to include First Class to make it work, rather than Southern to enable it on the Key, as there is First Class validity on all TOCs between Zones 1 to 5.

 

[34D]

Obviously most people needing zones 1 to 5 will have it on Oyster, but of course only Standard Class. Presumably it would require Oyster to be extended to include First Class to make it work, rather than Southern to enable it on the Key, as there is First Class validity on all TOCs between Zones 1 to 5.

This is "itso on prestige" so I understand

 

[GodAtum]

But if I had a travelcard on the key i would be able to use it on the tube or bus anyway?

 

[Deerfold]

But if I had a travelcard on the key i would be able to use it on the tube or bus anyway?

There's no indication of when you'll be able to put travelcards on the Key. If and when it comes, yes.

 

[johnnycache]

I think February 2014 is the target date for Travelcards on the key

 

[radamfi]

Surprisingly, my Key worked at Three Bridges this evening.
--- old post above --- --- new post below ---
Tried the Key at Gatwick last night again. It worked on arrival but not when leaving Gatwick. This time I used the arrival barrier on the entry to the terminal so maybe that barrier line works but the one in the main station doesn't.

I had a RPI on the train this morning. She had no card reader. She asked me how well it was working and I said it didn't work at Gatwick but it did at Three Bridges. She said that the software for allowing break of journey wasn't ready yet, and Three Bridges only worked because it was 'twinned' with Crawley.

 

[maniacmartin]

Another update - received by email

Multiple ticket purchases on your key

Your key can hold up to a maximum of five tickets, so when buying tickets, the most you would be able to buy at one time is five.

However, when more than one ticket is purchased online there is a problem which affects the collection of the tickets. Therefore we advise that if you would like to buy more than one ticket at a time, you should do this at a self service ticket machine at a Southern station outside of London.

We are currently working with all rail Smart Media organisations to overcome this problem which is affecting rail smartcard schemes. We apologise for the inconvenience caused. If you have experienced any problems with the key, or have any questions or queries, or would like to share with us your feedback please email thekey@southernrailway.com.

Many thanks,

The key team

 

[andrewkeith5]

If only I could actually load a product onto my Key, and Southern could be bothered to reply to all my complaints

I STILL cannot find any smartcard fares from Crawley or Gatwick Airport to Victoria, which were both available (I used them!) before the email Southern sent about being able to use the key to Victoria...

 

[Stats]

A warning to anybody using tickets held on the Key. Southern have today confirmed to me that all tickets held on the Key are Route: Southern only. As a Any Permitted paper ticket allowing you to use FCC services costs the same there is no reason why you should purchase a ticket on the Key.

 

[Deerfold]

A warning to anybody using tickets held on the Key. Southern have today confirmed to me that all tickets held on the Key are Route: Southern only. As a Any Permitted paper ticket allowing you to use FCC services costs the same there is no reason why you should purchase a ticket on the Key.

Where they set the Any Permitted fare are they allowed to do that long term?

 

[tsr]

A warning to anybody using tickets held on the Key. Southern have today confirmed to me that all tickets held on the Key are Route: Southern only. As a Any Permitted paper ticket allowing you to use FCC services costs the same there is no reason why you should purchase a ticket on the Key.

Do you have a source, official documentation or anything like that? A search of BR Fares (admittedly not official) does not reveal this to be the case for routes such as Gatwick to Reigate (to take an example!) - source. Neither have I ever heard of any such condition from any Southern RPI or ticket office.

I have noted that their Twitter team have previously been under the impression that the medium is irrelevant and any ticket purchased is valid on any of the operators specified by the product's conditions, without any exclusivity for Southern in the way you describe, above the usual restrictions which would apply to appropriately-priced paper tickets. I'm afraid I don't have a link for that, as I saw it a few months ago. I wonder if there has been some change to pricing, but I can't think how it would be accepted.

 

[Stats]

My source is an email from Southern's The Key team

 

[maniacmartin]

Can you post the email here, redacting your details?