Letter About Northern Rail Fare Prosecution.

[Azzy118]

Hi guys, i've just signed up to this forum in seek of help.

I know, by looking around the forum you have had quite a few threads about this, but if you could help me that would be great.

Basically, I and a few mates hopped on a train at my nearest train station (LEYLAND), there is a train ticket office, but it is normal for us to just buy a ticket on the train when the conductor comes round, i know we shouldn't really do this, but until this day i was under the impression that I could do this perfectly fine, as there is nothing on the train or the station telling me other wise.

Anyway we arrived at Preston train station and walked out of the train station, where we was met with a bunch of northern rail geezers.

They told us to show them our tickets, to the response that we didn't have any but we will buy some of them. To the reply of 'put your money away lads', we was very willing to buy tickets by the way. They took our details and said they will be in touch via letter.

So i received my letter today, fare evasion basically, and if i don't write back it equals in a £100 fine and a criminal record, this is my first ever crime committed of this sort if you will.

And a person that works at northern rail, who my mate knows basically said it's wrong for them to do what they did and should have accepted our payment and that should have been the end of it.

So, can anyone tell me if the last statement is true and what would be the right thing to put in my letter back to minimize the fine, thanks in advance.

 

[bb21]

Where were you caught at Preston? Which part of the station?

 

[island]

Joining a train without purchasing a ticket when ticket selling facilities were available at the station where you started your journey is a criminal offence. Assuming you haven't come to Northern's attention before for similar issues, they will probably offer you the option to avoid prosecution on payment of the sum of £84.10.

 

[Clip]

Anyway we arrived at Preston train station and walked out of the train station, where we was met with a bunch of northern rail geezers.

So you walked out of the station,passing yet another facility to purchase tickets, and thought you had got away with it then? AFAICS they have you bang to rights.

 

[sheff1]

So you walked out of the station,passing yet another facility to purchase tickets and thought you had got away with it then?

That can only be a guess until the question in post #2 is answered. There are at least two ways out of the station where you would not pass a ticket selling facility.

The fact that they ignored the ticket office at Leyland though does make what happened at Preston rather less relevant.

 

[bb21]

I wouldn't say it makes what happened at Preston less relevant, as one could potentially result in a more serious charge, but yes, either way the OP would have a problem to deal with.

Now I just need the OP to be back and answer my question.

 

[Clip]

That can only be a guess until the question in post #2 is answered. There are at least two ways out of the station where you would not pass a ticket selling facility.

The fact that they ignored the ticket office at Leyland though does make what happened at Preston rather less relevant.

It has been a few years since I have left Preston station but as you say passing the first opportunity to buy makes it a moot point really.

 

[trc666]

The reason that Northern are going down this route is because you attempted to walk out of the station at Preston without purchasing a ticket for your journey from Leyland, it can be seen as attempting to intentionally avoid payment for the journey made. It makes the situation a bit worse as you have bypassed two ticket offices and did not speak to the guard onboard the train.

If you had not been challenged by staff at Preston would you still have purchased a ticket from the ticket office?

 

[Azzy118]

Sorry guys been logged off since last night, basically the guy wasn't in the ticket office at Leyland station, and we took the underground passage at Preston.

Now i know this looks suspicious but this is the route I and my mates take regardless of if we get the ticket.

FYI the northern rail guys was stood outside the little underground passage, presumably on there break, when they caught us.

 

[185]

outside the little underground passage, presumably on there break, when they caught us.

No, that's a usual spot for them to stand on an FTP/Exit ('Blackburn Trap') Operation.

here... http://www.nationalrail.co.uk/SME/html/NRE_PRE/images/photos/800/o2782-0000044.jpg

 

[Azzy118]

No, that's a usual spot for them to stand on an FTP/Exit ('Blackburn Trap') Operation.

here... http://www.nationalrail.co.uk/SME/html/NRE_PRE/images/photos/800/o2782-0000044.jpg

Yes, right there ahah

 

[bb21]

No, that's a usual spot for them to stand on an FTP/Exit ('Blackburn Trap') Operation.

But in the Blackburn case, the ticket office is easily missed, whereas at Preston, the ticket office is well signposted and not "hidden" in the middle of a platform so I think it is an unfair comparison.

 

[ian959]

And a person that works at northern rail, who my mate knows basically said it's wrong for them to do what they did and should have accepted our payment and that should have been the end of it.

So, can anyone tell me if the last statement is true and what would be the right thing to put in my letter back to minimize the fine, thanks in advance.

This is statement would only be true if you had not had a previous opportunity to buy a ticket. However, you chose not to buy at Leyland for whatever reason (I am not sure that 'the guy wasn't there' holds much weight if the ticket office was open) then made no attempt to buy a ticket at Preston either and were caught attempting to leave the station without paying your fare.

Accepting payment in such a case is not appropriate. Also a penalty fare is not appropriate in this case as a PF is only appropriate where a person has made an honest mistake. Your actions were quite deliberate and in contravention of the relevant laws which require a ticket to be bought before boarding a train where there is an opportunity to do so, or the first available opportunity if it is not possible before boarding the train.

Northern have you dead to rights for a fare evasion charge under the RoR Act, which would carry a criminal record.

Your best bet is in your letter to be as contrite and as apologetic as possible and hope they offer you a fixed penalty plus the cost of the fare. If they do, I would suggest you take it and don't argue, and henceforth remember to buy a ticket before you get on the train or at the very least make a beeline to the ticket office at Preston station to get one, not to the underground passage and try to get away without paying.

 

[Aldaniti]

Fare evasion between Leyland and Preston is, in theory, easy. No barriers at either station and a five minute journey. Those who say it is normal for them to want to buy their tickets onboard know the scam.

 

[Greenback]

Northern have you dead to rights for a fare evasion charge under the RoR Act, which would carry a criminal record.

Your best bet is in your letter to be as contrite and as apologetic as possible and hope they offer you a fixed penalty plus the cost of the fare. If they do, I would suggest you take it and don't argue, and henceforth remember to buy a ticket before you get on the train or at the very least make a beeline to the ticket office at Preston station to get one, not to the underground passage and try to get away without paying.

Agreed. Please note the bit about contrition and making an apology. Your posts so far suggest that you not viewing this a serious incident with potentially serious consequences, which it is.

Please remember, in future that whilst not buying a ticket before travel might not seem like a crime, ignoring facilities to buy a ticket where they exist can be.

 

[snail]

Also a penalty fare is not appropriate in this case as a PF is only appropriate where a person has made an honest mistake.

There are no penalty fare areas in the North West except Merseyrail.

 

[Azzy118]

There are no penalty fare areas in the North West except Merseyrail.

Does that mean my point stood some truthfulness, about the PF zones?

 

[ian959]

There are no penalty fare areas in the North West except Merseyrail.

Ah yes, sorry - forgot about that!

 

[34D]

There are no penalty fare areas in the North West except Merseyrail.

Lancashire (inc GM) is now one, just not an authorised one

 

[Asian Demon]

I can only say you've been caught bang to rights here. Leyland is staffed and as a conductor who works this route, we see this fare dodge on a daily basis. The problem between these two stations is huge. No sympathy whatsoever.