Northern Rail Short Fare - Advice?

[asleepycompany]

Good Morning All!

I am looking for some guidance/input/advice from your good and knowledgeable selves, regarding an incident that i was questioned for a little earlier in the week.

I made a terrible mistake in which i was caught out claiming i came from a closer station to my destination to the one had actually traveled from on the way to work. It was a local train and the distance covered was 5 calling points. I have since seen that this is referred to as short faring. I believe that there was some kind of extra ticket or voucher given to passengers from this location on this particular morning.

I was questioned by the Revenue Prosecutions Officer at my destination, and supplied my details. I was asked the nature of journey, where i had actually travelled from , and to sign the notepad which had my details on. I did not deviate from questions and answered in minimal detail courteously (under caution).

I was very curious to learn of any potential outcomes of the event but the officer wouldn't go into any potential outcomes and expressed that "they didn't know". I was advised that the information would be passed onto the prosecutions team and i would likely hear from them in the coming weeks.

Of course each of these cases are different and all of us have mitigating circumstances but not excuses, though i am currently preparing for a worst case scenario. Needless to say and shamefully so, i was ignorant to the severity of my actions before and beside myself with anxiety at the moment. A prosecution could not only destroy my immediate career (like many i need an empty enhanced CRB) but marriage plans too (Better half is a non EU citizen, abroad)

As an inexperienced rail user and limited knowledge on law If anyone could offer any advice on what happens next, and how i should proceed, i would be very grateful.

Thank you all for your input.

 

[bb21]

If you have admitted to asking for a short fare (correct me if I am wrong) then there is not a lot we can say. Do you have any mitigating circumstances (leaving home late is not one)?

You can offer to settle out of court by offering a sincere apology, a promise that you have learnt your lesson and that you won't make the same mistake again. They don't have an obligation to accept an out-of-court settlement however.

If you are taken to court under the Railway Byelaws, then conviction should not result in a criminal record, just a lighter wallet. On the other hand, if conviction is under the Regulation of Railways Act, then you will receive a criminal record on conviction. Unfortunately asking for a short fare is pretty good proof that you intended to avoid paying the correct fare so the crucial element of intent can be reasonably easily established, for an RoRA prosecution.

If this is your first offence, there is a good chance that the matter will not end up in court, as an out-of-court settlement can be more cost effective for the rail company. That said, there is no guarantee as Northern holds all the cards at the moment. You will need to wait for the letter from the prosecution department to arrive which is likely to be one asking you for your version of the events. (Write down what happened on a piece of paper in the meantime. Nothing is worse than contradicting yourself.)

 

[asleepycompany]

Hi bb21, Thank you for taking the time to respond, I am very grateful.

After reading so many of the posts on the forum i was prepared for such a response. Would it be fair to assume that each case is treated on an individual basis or would you (from your knowledge and experience) that the Operator would already have decided on their intentions before reviewing a further statement from the offender?

You are correct in as much that i did admit to traveling from another station, though i was not asked by the officer for any reasoning or circumstance. Though in hindsight i probably should have given more information at the time?

With regards to your question about circumstances, If this can be classed as a mitigating circumstance, there is one Embarrassingly, although i technically had the means to pay the full journey, (Credit Card) the cards pin number is something i do not know. I believed i had my debit card with me, i didn't. And not have enough cash for the journey, hence the situation.

From the advice i have read on this site i shall wait nervously for the correspondence from Northern Rail and as you suggest i have written down my version of events in as much detail as possible without personal feeling or excuse.

As for the apology letter which. how indepth would be sufficient and what if anything aside from a humbling apology would i need to include?

Many Thanks Again for your assistance.

 

[bb21]

After reading so many of the posts on the forum i was prepared for such a response. Would it be fair to assume that each case is treated on an individual basis or would you (from your knowledge and experience) that the Operator would already have decided on their intentions before reviewing a further statement from the offender?

AFAIK each case would be treated on its own merit. If a train company has enough evidence to succeed in a prosecution, they might well proceed regardless. However as I mentioned, it is usually not cost effective for them to prosecute for a first offence, compared to an out-of-court settlement.

The vast majority of people who come here for advice for a first offence managed to settle so although I cannot guarantee anything, there is a good chance that it is how your case would likely end up.

You are correct in as much that i did admit to traveling from another station, though i was not asked by the officer for any reasoning or circumstance. Though in hindsight i probably should have given more information at the time?

Probably won't make much difference in that case. The reason behind it is not really important. The act of asking for a short fare is something that can be interpreted by the court as intent, should it get to that stage.

With regards to your question about circumstances, If this can be classed as a mitigating circumstance, there is one Embarrassingly, although i technically had the means to pay the full journey, (Credit Card) the cards pin number is something i do not know. I believed i had my debit card with me, i didn't. And not have enough cash for the journey, hence the situation.

Sorry, I can't see that giving you much of a defence.

From the advice i have read on this site i shall wait nervously for the correspondence from Northern Rail and as you suggest i have written down my version of events in as much detail as possible without personal feeling or excuse.

As for the apology letter which. how indepth would be sufficient and what if anything aside from a humbling apology would i need to include?

Many Thanks Again for your assistance.

Yes, wait for the letter to arrive for now. General advice is just be honest in the response. Show genuine remorse, and keep it to the point. If you ask nicely when you have written your response, then someone on here might be willing to proofread it for you.

 

[142094]

Open and shut case really for Northern. You've admitted what you've done, so prepared to take the hit when the letter arrives.

 

[DynamicSpirit]

Of course each of these cases are different and all of us have mitigating circumstances but not excuses, though i am currently preparing for a worst case scenario. Needless to say and shamefully so, i was ignorant to the severity of my actions before and beside myself with anxiety at the moment. A prosecution could not only destroy my immediate career (like many i need an empty enhanced CRB) but marriage plans too (Better half is a non EU citizen, abroad)

I'm not a lawyer so may be wrong, but I don't think that it would directly affect a visa application by your partner if you were prosecuted. Your partner would be the person applying for the visa, you would merely be the sponsor, and I've never heard of any rule indicating that a sponsor's criminal record is a valid grounds for rejecting a visa (My partner is also non-EU so I've spent quite a lot of time trawling through immigration rules). Obviously if your partner was prosecuted it would be a very different story. And if you lost your job, it could cause problems because of the rather onerous income requirements for spouse visas.

 

[asleepycompany]

Thank you all for your input so far, i really am very gratefull for all your input.

BB21, would it be possible for you to look over the drafted apology to see weather it would be appropriate?

DynamicSpirit, thank you kindly for your input. From what i understand it would most likley negativley affect any application from what i have read so far which only futher compounds to my idiocy. , i have messaged you as it would be very great to get some info about your visa application experience.

 

[bb21]

We are happy to help. Please let us know when you have received the letter and drafted the response.

 

[Stigy]

Can't really add much, but will say that the matter of having the wrong card on you for the full fare could strengthen their case against you should they wish to proceed to court, if it looks like you didn't have enough means (especially if you're admitting to knowing this before you boarded the train). It would only serve to complicate matters. asleepycompany, I'd not be inclined to mention this assuming you haven't already.

 

[asleepycompany]

bb21, thank you for your help and assistance, i really appriciate your input.

Stigy, thank you for your advice. I didnt mention this as it seemed irrelevant nor was i asked why by the RPI. I didnt think, just wanted to get to work (not justifying)

Syd

 

[asleepycompany]

We are happy to help. Please let us know when you have received the letter and drafted the response.

Good Evening All, I hope you are all well on this last Monday in September.

I recently recieved a fine in relation to this matter which i promptly paid... Intrestingly enough there was not an oppurtunity nor did the Train Operator ask for my version of events of an apology, the Operator was Also FGW contrary what i thought initially.

I feel i have been lucky in this case and of course have learned a valuable lifes lesson. Thank you for your input and taking the time to advise.

 

[island]

For the sake of clarity, please can you confirm whether you attended court and were issued a fine, or whether you made some payment to FGW in return for them not taking the matter to court?

 

[185]

I think FGW still do the prosecutions for another north-of-England FG company.

 

[asleepycompany]

Apologies! It was not a fine but a settlement. A letter from dye came in the post saying that a fee of xx would put the matter to bed. It was the first and only correspondence received since the incident.

Again, thank you for All the advice!