Waterloo International to be in use by 2019?

[Rational Plan]

http://www.london-se1.co.uk/news/view/7021

All five of the disused former Eurostar platforms at Waterloo Station could be used by domestic trains by 2019, under plans revealed this week.

Waterloo Station
The blueprint to deliver capacity for almost 10,000 extra peak-time passengers on the route in and out of London Waterloo by 2019 could involve a staged programme of additional, longer trains, platform extensions and re-openings, as well as signalling, track and power supply improvements.

The vision has been drawn up by the South West Trains-Network Rail Alliance working in response to the Department for Transport's rail investment strategy.

It includes improvements around Waterloo Station as well as bringing the remaining four platforms of the Waterloo International Terminal back into use.

Work is already under way to bring platform 20 of the former international terminal back into service from spring 2014.

Under proposals developed by the alliance, platforms 21 to 24 could also be brought back into passenger service.

The former Eurostar terminal has been disused since international rail services moved to St Pancras in 2007.

Plans are being developed to extend platforms 1-4 to accommodate longer trains and to carry out track and signalling improvements to maximise the benefits of the platform developments.

Transport secretary Patrick McLoughlin said: "Britain needs a strong economy if it wants to compete globally and effective transport links are absolutely key to that. This is why the Government has embarked on one of the biggest programmes of rail modernisation ever.

"It's also vital to cost effectively create additional capacity at Waterloo – the capital's busiest railway station – making the proposals from South West Trains and Network Rail doubly important."

Tim Shoveller, managing director of the South West Trains-Network Rail Alliance, said: "Our network is currently one of the busiest in Europe carrying more than 210 million passengers a year.

"We already have confirmed plans we have in place to deliver improvements in capacity over the next two years. However, the huge success of the railway in the UK means it will get significantly busier in the next two decades and beyond. There is also a need to invest in the infrastructure to improve the daily reliability for today's customers.

"The alliance between South West Trains and Network Rail means we are working more closely together, thinking big and creating plans for the long-term to deliver significant improvements for passengers.

"The blueprint we are developing in partnership with the Department for Transport is a massive programme of work and requires significant investment. These plans will greatly improve what is a key part of the country's transport infrastructure and ensure our rail network continues to support economic growth."

1South West Trains currently runs around 1,700 trains a day in and out of London Waterloo, carrying nearly 210 million passengers a year. This is forecast to increase to nearly 380 million a year by 2030

 

[anthony263]

I will believe it when I see it.

 

[swt_passenger]

I will believe it when I see it.

It's more likely to happen than most of your own fantasy projects...

 

[nlogax]

Wasn't some work on Platform 20 completed years ago well after Eurostar vacated? Specifically, platform edge / surfacing, PIS, safety rails and ramp + step access via Platform 19. What other works still need to be carried out?

 

[infobleep]

If they bring these into use, where will the extra services come from? They certainly can't pass through Earlsfield during peak rush hour because there isn't the space. If they want to run more trains either side of the peak then it will simply extend the times are which people are prohibited from alighting or boarding fast services at Clapham Junction.

Of course if they combine this change with changes around Clapham Junction and south of that then it could be really useful. Won't be cheap but I think they can recoup the costs through increasing passenger numbres.

 

[causton]

When they get longer trains (well, before, ideally! ) they will need to lengthen the suburban platforms on the opposite side. Therefore, they will need some extra platforms while the suburban local ones are closed.

 

[Eagle]

As I said in another thread, it's primarily to help platform existing trains more efficiently.

 

[Surreyman]

As I said in another thread, it's primarily to help platform existing trains more efficiently.

There seem to be a few wires getting crossed here, Modern Railways had an article recently which detailed the issues.
In order to lengthen platforms 1 - 4 (and possibly 5 & 6 as well), they needed to 'move up' everything while the new bridge etc is constructed, at the same time the entire track - crossings etc at the throat of Waterloo needs to be replaced (much of it dates from the 1930s and replacement rails/parts have to be 'Bespoke'.
Short term, the use of 21-24 allows this to happen, medium term it allows a more robust service, longer term, with re-signalling and a possible extra track used from Hampton Court, they can run an improved service.
Before anyone asks, yes I was surprised at the 'extra track' possibility too but it seems it is a serious proposal, there is space, with presumably a lot of rebuilding of platforms etc.

 

[swt_passenger]

Before anyone asks, yes I was surprised at the 'extra track' possibility too but it seems it is a serious proposal, there is space, with presumably a lot of rebuilding of platforms etc.

The extra track from Surbiton inbound (because the fifth track is already present from Hampton Court Junction to Surbiton) is fully described in the 2011 London and SE RUS, complete with track schematics.

It is also quite clearly pointed out that in the event of Crossrail 2 taking over inner suburban services from the SWT network beyond Wimbledon, that the 5th tracking would not happen.

I'd place my bet on Crossrail, to be fair...

 

[cle]

Could they invest in an over/underpass somewhere between Waterloo and Clapham to swap over the Windsor lines and the main fast lines?

Not sure where would be suitable, and would be pricey - but would be a fantastic long-term thing to do, enabling the longest services to have the longest platforms and best long-distance facilities.

Notwithstanding all the sleeper talk! But perhaps that link would need to go to facilitate a fly-over.

 

[YorkshireBear]

Of course Crossrail2 could have a large impact also by removing services from Waterloo.

 

[infobleep]

The extra track from Surbiton inbound (because the fifth track is already present from Hampton Court Junction to Surbiton) is fully described in the 2011 London and SE RUS, complete with track schematics.

It is also quite clearly pointed out that in the event of Crossrail 2 taking over inner suburban services from the SWT network beyond Wimbledon, that the 5th tracking would not happen.

I'd place my bet on Crossrail, to be fair...

If that were the case, would it mean that no passengers on South West Trains, not living near cross rail 2, would be able to join it without changing trains some distance away.

For exam please during peak morning rush hour no fast trains from Woking and beyond stop at Surbiton or Clapham Junction.

To get to Clapham Junction at 7.32 from Woking, it officially take 58 minutes. Compare that to 20 minutes off peak.

If cross rail 2 happens, they really need to make it accessible for longer distance customers. Actually they don't but I think that wouldn't be a good idea.

Sent from my HUAWEI U8815 using Tapatalk 2

 

[The Ham]

If that were the case, would it mean that no passengers on South West Trains, not living near cross rail 2, would be able to join it without changing trains some distance away.

For exam please during peak morning rush hour no fast trains from Woking and beyond stop at Surbiton or Clapham Junction.

To get to Clapham Junction at 7.32 from Woking, it officially take 58 minutes. Compare that to 20 minutes off peak.

If cross rail 2 happens, they really need to make it accessible for longer distance customers. Actually they don't but I think that wouldn't be a good idea.

Sent from my HUAWEI U8815 using Tapatalk 2

Depending on the type of scheme that Crossrail 2 takes it could well be that (assuming regional railway) there will be a whole load of trains in tunnels as they pass through Clapham Junction (and Wimbledon for that matter). This then frees up a lot more platforms which can be used by the longer distance services to call at as well as making Waterloo a less disirable station to arrive at, so as removing some of the presure on the services.

This would be very disirable as it would mean that it would be possible to unload people from the longer distance services to Crossrail 2 without them still having to go into Waterloo or taking forever to get to London from Woking. It would also allow the change of passengers back to Waterloo from Crossrail 2 services which would otherwise then be by-passing it.

 

[D365]

Depending on the type of scheme that Crossrail 2 takes it could well be that (assuming regional railway) there will be a whole load of trains in tunnels as they pass through Clapham Junction (and Wimbledon for that matter). This then frees up a lot more platforms which can be used by the longer distance services to call at as well as making Waterloo a less disirable station to arrive at, so as removing some of the presure on the services.

This would be very disirable as it would mean that it would be possible to unload people from the longer distance services to Crossrail 2 without them still having to go into Waterloo or taking forever to get to London from Woking. It would also allow the change of passengers back to Waterloo from Crossrail 2 services which would otherwise then be by-passing it.

Sorry to be picky but I think you've got your desirability mixed up Sounds like a plan though..?

 

[swt_passenger]

The London and SE RUS explains all this anyway.

If they provide a fifth track it will operate in the peak flow direction and will allow some longer distance trains to stop within the zones, eg at Surbiton or Clapham Jn.

If they build CR2 instead, with the portals west of Wimbledon, it will also mean that once the main inner suburban services are out of the way, some trains that currently run on the fasts through Surbiton and Wimbledon all the way to Waterloo will be able to weave back onto the slows for the final part of their route, and stop maybe at Wimbledon and Clapham Jn. (IMO this would likely be the Basingstoke or Alton semi-fasts, or some similar distance service.)