FGW Bans Enthusiasts From Chetenham Spa?

[ralphchadkirk]

Surely it depends on the context; "There's a queue full of customers at the ticket window"....... "There are many passengers on board that train"

Quite. But sometimes it's more fun to have a pointless argument about it!

 

[Bob Ames]

I would say a passenger is a sub-type of customer. A fare-dodger, on the other hand, is a passenger but not a customer.

 

[455driver]

You are a customer at the station and a passenger on the train.

 

[Muzer]

I would say a passenger is a sub-type of customer. A fare-dodger, on the other hand, is a passenger but not a customer.

Ah, so the reason they say "Due to a short platform at Clapham Junction, customers for this station should join the front 6 coaches" is because they want fare dodgers to get in the wrong part of the train and so miss their stop?

 

[BestWestern]

I remember once a few years ago talking to a member of staff at Cheltenham after getting some journey information. I forget how it came up in conversation now but I got the impression station management was not keen on enthusiasts even then, so it seems an excuse has now been found to achieve something I guess was wanted for a while.

To be fair, FGW station managers are changed on regular basis and are only likely to be adhering to the current company policies; they are unlikely to be running a few individual stations 'their own way' if it doesn't fit with the corporate ethos. Cheltenham has a steady band of regulars and I don't think I've ever passed through without seeing a few of them scattered about the place. You very much get the impression that it's a second home for some of them, it certainly doesn't look like a spotter-hostile place.

I'm also rather baffled at what has supposedly taken place. Chelty is a small and very open plan station, you can stand in one spot on either platform and see pretty much everything. I'm perplexed as to where exactly somebody could hide away and cause serious vandalism without being seen, or indeed why anybody would go to all the hassle when there are endless other stations you could just stroll into in the small hours. I wonder whether somebody was 'souvenir hunting' perhaps?! Could such an 'anti-railway' act make them not a real enthusiast, whilst also constituting this charge of serious vandalism? I honestly can't imagine what else might have happened here.

 

[12CSVT]

A fare-dodger, on the other hand, is a passenger but not a customer.

A fare-dodger is the railway equivalent of a shoplifter.

 

[pinguini]

I saw a small group of 3 rail enthusiasts (although they looked more like homeless guys) stood by the railings of Cheltenham Spa station car park this evening gazing down onto the tracks. That must be their new hang-out.

 

[Tomnick]

a small group of 3 rail enthusiasts

Fans of the electrification on the Southern region?

 

[Qwerty133]

From Facebook

They banned all 'enthusiasts' as the person who committed this criminal damage had regularly used the station as an "enthusiast", become good friends with a member of staff and later abused that friendship to use the staff only area (the member of staff is on "reduced duties" for telling someone the door code to the staff only area). This is why the criminal damage isn't obvious.

That is for information only and isn't an opinion.

If this is true, the ban is understandable but surely common sense would tell staff not to tell anyone codes?

 

[Goatboy]

Why dont they just pop up the road to Aschurch where they can see the same trains with nobody to bother them or ban them?

 

[PHILIPE]

You won't see Swindon, Paddington or Maesteg to Cheltenhams at Ashchurch

 

[BrownE]

From Facebook
If this is true, the ban is understandable but surely common sense would tell staff not to tell anyone codes?

That's fact. I posted it (and have subsequently deleted it to avoid my Facebook account receiving a lot of train related friend requests (which I'd decline anyway)).

The point being this 'enthusiast' has made a point of repeatedly using the station, building a rapport with the member of staff and subsequently abusing that.

 

[starrymarkb]

I think it'll blow over given time, there are bad eggs in the enthusiast community* and it is going to be a case of regaining the local management's trust.

*like the kid with the Stolen Advantix doing First Class ALRs for £100 from his bag...

 

[RPM]

I wonder how the new policy at CNM actually defines enthusiasts? I'm not an enthusiast, I'm an off duty railwayman who enjoys photographing railways (not just trains). Am I allowed onto the platforms? (Rhetorical question, because my TOC pass would get me through barriers, but what if I worked for a TOC/FOC/owning group that doesn't serve CNM?)

 

[tbtc]

I wonder how the new policy at CNM actually defines enthusiasts? I'm not an enthusiast, I'm an off duty railwayman who enjoys photographing railways (not just trains). Am I allowed onto the platforms? (Rhetorical question, because my TOC pass would get me through barriers, but what if I worked for a TOC/FOC/owning group that doesn't serve CNM?)

Dunno.

But probably something along the lines of "people at the station who don't have a railway ticket and aren't specifically there to meet someone off their train" (rather than any sartorial argument about colours of anoraks).

If the story about someone getting access to the "secure" staff area and commiting criminal damage are correct then I can understand why they don't want people hanging around the station who don't need to be there.

 

[BestWestern]

If the story about someone getting access to the "secure" staff area and commiting criminal damage are correct then I can understand why they don't want people hanging around the station who don't need to be there.

A better solution, however, would be to change all door codes at the station and discipline the member of staff responsible for a significant breach of the mandatory Transec security regulations. Banning anybody who might be a 'spotter is a ham-fisted and completely unfair way of dealing with what is essentially a problem with one employee.

 

[RPM]

A better solution, however, would be to change all door codes at the station and discipline the member of staff responsible for a significant breach of the mandatory Transec security regulations. Banning anybody who might be a 'spotter is a ham-fisted and completely unfair way of dealing with what is essentially a problem with one employee.

Exactly! Spot on.

 

[158747]

Could it be that the management at Cheltenham have been wanting to ban enthusiasts from their station and are using this incident as an excuse to carry out their ban?

 

[ModernRailways]

A better solution, however, would be to change all door codes at the station and discipline the member of staff responsible for a significant breach of the mandatory Transec security regulations. Banning anybody who might be a 'spotter is a ham-fisted and completely unfair way of dealing with what is essentially a problem with one employee.

But that would be the logical solution and we can't have that at all. Better to just ban all enthusiasts from the station!

Yes, I'm being sarcastic

 

[tbtc]

A better solution, however, would be to change all door codes at the station and discipline the member of staff responsible for a significant breach of the mandatory Transec security regulations. Banning anybody who might be a 'spotter is a ham-fisted and completely unfair way of dealing with what is essentially a problem with one employee.

Its not unusual for a business or government organisation to react like this - its easier sometimes to ban "everyone" in a category rather than offending certain people.

This'll probably blow over in a month or two, but in the meantime I can understand why FGW staff don't want certain people hanging around their workplace.

 

[alex17595]

could it be possible to take down a name with ID of enthusiasts before they go on to the platform - does it have gates yet?

 

[ModernRailways]

could it be possible to take down a name with ID of enthusiasts before they go on to the platform - does it have gates yet?

Network Rail do that. Take a photo and then ask your name and a phone number so they can get in touch if need be. They then print off a sticker and you wear that so staff know you're allowed.

At Marylebone, you sign into the book, putting your name, and Phone Number down and the person there gives you a sticker to say you're allowed.

FGW could implement a similar system to that at Marylebone.

 

[edwin_m]

There's an opportunity here - publish the full list of stickers so people can tick them off when they see them. Here's to trainspotterspotting.

 

[transmanche]

Here's to trainspotterspotting.

Haha, fantastic idea. Will there be a Platform 5 book for you to tick them off in...?

 

[Searle]

There's an opportunity here - publish the full list of stickers so people can tick them off when they see them. Here's to trainspotterspotting.

I feel it's much more fun when you don't know who the trainspotters are. I went to Weymouth a few weeks back at the same time as a railtour went in, so I went trainspotterspotting on judgement alone. Great fun

 

[TDK]

I saw a small group of 3 rail enthusiasts (although they looked more like homeless guys) stood by the railings of Cheltenham Spa station car park this evening gazing down onto the tracks. That must be their new hang-out.

I saw 8 spotters at Frodsham last weekend (Sunday) all standing in the cess waiting to photograph a Steam train - now this is why I feel you enthusiasts have a problem - I even had to sound the horn to get them to stand back from the running rail.

 

[ModernRailways]

I saw 8 spotters at Frodsham last weekend (Sunday) all standing in the cess waiting to photograph a Steam train - now this is why I feel you enthusiasts have a problem - I even had to sound the horn to get them to stand back from the running rail.

And there the ones who spoil it for the rest! When there is a Steam engine at York and the platforms are crammed a lot of people use the platform ramps. The BTP come along and tell them to move and they do but as soon as the BTP disappear they are back down.

 

[BestWestern]

Its not unusual for a business or government organisation to react like this - its easier sometimes to ban "everyone" in a category rather than offending certain people.

This'll probably blow over in a month or two, but in the meantime I can understand why FGW staff don't want certain people hanging around their workplace.

I agree, but what this response completely overlooks is that the problem here was with a staff member, not a 'fake trainspotter' or whoever they were. There will be plenty of people who, for a variety of reasons, would love to be given door access codes for staff areas on stations and the like. They shouldn't need to be banned, either individually or as a demographic group en masse, because nobody should be giving them door codes, end of!

 

[43167]

And there the ones who spoil it for the rest! When there is a Steam engine at York and the platforms are crammed a lot of people use the platform ramps. The BTP come along and tell them to move and they do but as soon as the BTP disappear they are back down.

Same at Normanton and Castleford when the Scarborough Spa Express passes and some people think they have a god given right to go beyond the signs.