FGW Bans Enthusiasts From Chetenham Spa?

[talltim]

So if i did some vandalism while pretending to be a passenger they would ban all passengers?

 

[RichmondCommu]

So the railway now coveys 'travelling customers' rather than 'passengers' eh? Even the airlines still manage to refer to passengers. I guess you could buy a return to the next station rather than a platform ticket and pretend to be a passenger... oh sorry... 'travelling customer' rather than an "enthusiast"... or "potential security breach" as FGW might prefer to call us...

Personally I would rather be referred to as a customer rather than a passenger.

 

[MCW]

Hmmm.... this policy is annoying but on the other hand some 'enthusiasts' are an absolute pain in the a***

 

[RPM]

True, but by their own admission it wasn't an enthusiast. It was someone masquerading as an enthusiast.

 

[trentside]

True, but by their own admission it wasn't an enthusiast. It was someone masquerading as an enthusiast.

Which makes this an utterly ridiculous situation - they know it wasn't a genuine enthusiast, and surely, the local staff must know their regulars anyway? It really doesn't make sense to just ban enthusiasts, but allow members of the public who wish to see off friends and relatives onto the station. It's all or nothing, otherwise you're just discriminating.

 

[edwin_m]

So how do they ban people masquerading as enthusiasts? Ask 10 detailed questions about class 47s before deciding whether to sell someone a platform ticket.

 

[ModernRailways]

The main question is though. Can we as enthusiasts actually overturn FGW's ruling or must we just wait for it to blow over?
As this is clearly just discrimination now, since they are still allowing others onto the platform what can we actually do? Could we if we so wished take them to court for being discriminatory? Or just take it to the larger national press, who would know doubt love to be able to slag off a company such as FGW! The Mail would love it

 

[transmanche]

Could we if we so wished take them to court for being discriminatory?

No, as they're not breaking any law. Being a train enthusiast is not a 'protected characteristic' under the Equality Act 2010.

 

[Goatboy]

I suppose with a station as huge as Cheltenham Spa it can be difficult to manage the hoards of spotters.

 

[tbtc]

As this is clearly just discrimination now, since they are still allowing others onto the platform what can we actually do? Could we if we so wished take them to court for being discriminatory?

It's not discrimination.

What next - someone taking a Newsagent to the European Court of Human Rights for only allowing two children in their shop at any one time?

Most other industries wouldn't encourage people to wander around workplaces taking pictures, getting in the way etc (without those people being paying customers).

True, but by their own admission it wasn't an enthusiast. It was someone masquerading as an enthusiast.

Just like everyone else contributing to this thread, I don't have a clue what has actually happened here (was it a serious offence? was this the first time? etc).

But I think that the use of the word "pretending" may be the TOC trying not to tar genuine enthusiasts with what one person has done. Serious vandalism suggests something fairly significant, so maybe they are chosing their words to suggest that (even if this person was wearing an anorak and carrying a notebook with lots of numbers written down in it) they can't have been a genuine enthusiast because no genuine enthusiast would commit serious vandalism?

 

[PHILIPE]

Personally I would rather be referred to as a customer rather than a passenger.

Have you been brainwashed as well ? If you were sitting on a station looking at trains (mot Cheltenham at the present time) and a train passed through with people in it, wouldn't it sound stupid if one was to say "there's a train of customers" I am not criticising you and accept you have your minority opinion on what terminology to use.

 

[Deerfold]

It's not discrimination.

It is discrimination - it's treating different groups of people differently (enthusiasts / people seeing off family/friends).

However it does not appear to be unlawful discrimination

 

[rebmcr]

If someone is that determined to cause vandalism, they could just as easily masquerade as a taxi driver, farewell-wisher, or even just a passenger.

 

[PHILIPE]

If FGW say that the person was masquerading as a trainspotter they seem sure that he wasn't a trainspotter, so why ban trainspotters? I don't think they have come really clean on this one.

 

[tbtc]

It is discrimination - it's treating different groups of people differently (enthusiasts / people seeing off family/friends).

However it does not appear to be unlawful discrimination

I mean "discrimination" in the legal term - of course they are treating people differently

If FGW say that the person was masquerading as a trainspotter they seem sure that he wasn't a trainspotter, so why ban trainspotters? I don't think they have come really clean on this one.

As I've tried to explain, they may be saying "pretending" to try to avoid tarring other enthusiasts with the same brush - whether this person was wearing an anorak and collecting numbers is irrelevant here.

 

[Oswyntail]

Have you been brainwashed as well ? If you were sitting on a station looking at trains (mot Cheltenham at the present time) and a train passed through with people in it, wouldn't it sound stupid if one was to say "there's a train of customers" I am not criticising you and accept you have your minority opinion on what terminology to use.

Has anyone ever said "there's a train of passengers"?:roll:
I'm with tbtc on this - akin to "those who cause trouble are not genuine football fans"

 

[Peter Mugridge]

Try it this way:

a) There's a passenger train.

or

b) There's a customer train.

Passenger definitely wins, and yes I agree - if FGW know the miscreant was not an enthusiast then they have made a totally illogical decision.

 

[RichmondCommu]

Have you been brainwashed as well ? If you were sitting on a station looking at trains (mot Cheltenham at the present time) and a train passed through with people in it, wouldn't it sound stupid if one was to say "there's a train of customers" I am not criticising you and accept you have your minority opinion on what terminology to use.

No, I've not been brainwashed! If my wife or children meet me at Heathrow after a long flight I'm a passenger as they drive me home. By purchasing a season ticket I become a customer of SWT. That's no different to me walking into a pub and having a drink. Misbehave and I will quite rightly be asked to leave. If I behave myself I'm welcome to stay. And yet the pub will regard me as a customer. The vast majority of commuters (or the ones that I know) expect to be treated as customers as they are paying for a service. Why do you have a problem with this?
--- old post above --- --- new post below ---

Has anyone ever said "there's a train of passengers"?:roll:
I'm with tbtc on this - akin to "those who cause trouble are not genuine football fans"

Well exactly!

 

[Temple Meads]

I've never got the issue with being called a customer.. To me if someone pays for a service they are a customer of the provider of the service.

Either term is perfectly fine (IMO)

 

[TDK]

Why don't you guys write another letter requesting that FGW issue you with a temporary photo pass or something to allow you as a reputable enthusiast on all their stations? If you do it collectively with signatures and names and addresses surely they may compromise? Anyone without the pass and ID will be refused access? Just a thought!

 

[embers25]

Why don't you guys write another letter requesting that FGW issue you with a temporary photo pass or something to allow you as a reputable enthusiast on all their stations? If you do it collectively with signatures and names and addresses surely they may compromise? Anyone without the pass and ID will be refused access? Just a thought!

A common sense approach...that's a bit revolutionary.

 

[LNW-GW Joint]

WHat security concerns are these? Red pens full of cyanide? Kalashnikov's in camera bags?

Cheltenham is the home of GCHQ after all.
The various posts suggest this is a local social matter, but it would not be surprising if security had been increased at Cheltenham in the current climate.

 

[RPM]

Cheltenham is the home of GCHQ after all.
The various posts suggest this is a local social matter, but it would not be surprising if security had been increased at Cheltenham in the current climate.

Its nowhere near the station though. Can't see why there would be any connection.

 

[Goatboy]

I remember once a few years ago talking to a member of staff at Cheltenham after getting some journey information. I forget how it came up in conversation now but I got the impression station management was not keen on enthusiasts even then, so it seems an excuse has now been found to achieve something I guess was wanted for a while.

 

[The Barlow Boy]

Personally I would rather be referred to as a customer rather than a passenger.

If you're buying something you're a customer. If you're travelling you're a person on passage - a passenger.

 

[anthony263]

I remember once a few years ago talking to a member of staff at Cheltenham after getting some journey information. I forget how it came up in conversation now but I got the impression station management was not keen on enthusiasts even then, so it seems an excuse has now been found to achieve something I guess was wanted for a while.

I too got that impression when I visisted Cheltenham about 3 years ago.

You will find a completely different attitude towards railway enthusiasts just down the line at Gloucester and Bristol Temple Meads.

sadly we do have a few idiots in this hobby who give the rest of use a very bad name, we only have to watch some of the vidieos on youtube to see what I mean.

 

[PHILIPE]

If you're buying something you're a customer. If you're travelling you're a person on passage - a passenger.

That's theory I put forward on the Forum a while ago now. What annoys me is just changing normal English language for the sake of it and in some situations, can sound just downright odd. Jo Public and everybody else referring to people travelling say "passengers". About the time I joined the Forum in 2011, there was a thread going "Passengers or Customers" with members invited to vote on it. I think it was something like 90% in favour of "passengers"

 

[RichmondCommu]

If you're buying something you're a customer. If you're travelling you're a person on passage - a passenger.

Hang on a minute, I've bought a ticket so by your definition I'm a customer.

 

[Tomnick]

Happily the Rule Book continues to refer to passenger trains. That's good enough for me .

 

[pinguini]

Surely it depends on the context; "There's a queue full of customers at the ticket window"....... "There are many passengers on board that train"