Caught 'fare dodging' Am I going to be fined or charged?

[VickiLew]

Hello, I'm pretty new to this so I'll just explain what happened...

Me and my partner caught the train to Manchester Victoria today, and went to leave via the exit near at the back, on our way out, we got stopped by a guy (with no rail uniform on) asking us for our tickets. We didn't have tickets, as we don't go to this train station very often and we assumed there'd be ticket guys at the exit where we could buy them, however, this was not the case. So, this man took our details, (and the number off of my student card) our descriptions and asked for an explanation. I told him this:

That we didn't go to this train station very often, and had assumed considering there were so many ticket men at the other end of the station that there would be some here too. We were going close to the Cathedral, and by my knowledge the way we had gone to leave the station was the fastest route. The station we had left from had no opportunity for us to buy a ticket, as there is renovations going on meaning that it isn't staffed a lot of the time, and that because it was only one stop away a ticket man on the train hadn't come round. The 'avoidance' of buying a ticket was purely accidental.

I was totally compliant with the man, and he was very polite telling me what was going to happen and everything else we needed to know.
However, I would like some sort of inclination as to what sort of penalty I would be likely to (if any) receive for this misdemeanour?

Thanks

 

[soil]

What station did you board at?

 

[Hellfire]

Just to clarify. You boarded a train without a ticket. Were there ticket machines or a ticket office where you boarded. If so, and you ignored them then you are looking at, as a minimum, a £80 charge which is Northern's standard response.

If there were no facilities to buy at your departure station did you seek out the conductor on the train?

You say that when you got off at Victoria you headed for the exit. Why didn't you go to the ticket office. Attempting to leave the station is a clear case of fare evasion. That is a criminal offence.

All you can do is wait for a letter from Northern. By all means come back to us for advice when you get it.

 

[yorkie]

As we don't know the origin station, and what facilities were available at this station at the time you boarded the train, I cannot provide any advice at this stage.

If there were no facilities to buy at your departure station did you seek out the conductor on the train?

Just for the benefit of anyone reading this who isn't sure, I'd like to clarify that if this was the case, there is no requirement to seek the conductor.

You say that when you got off at Victoria you headed for the exit. Why didn't you go to the ticket office. Attempting to leave the station is a clear case of fare evasion. That is a criminal offence.

Without knowing exactly what the station layout is, what platform the passenger arrived on, what the signs said, etc it is not really fair to judge that.

Hellfire - Let's say you board a train at Cross Gates and there's no facility to pay, what would you do when you get off the train at Garforth and are at this point, do you go up the bridge and turn left or right? Give a wrong answer and you can ask yourself the question you asked the OP.

 

[evoluzione]

Hello, I'm pretty new to this so I'll just explain what happened...

Me and my partner caught the train to Manchester Victoria today, and went to leave via the exit near at the back, on our way out, we got stopped by a guy (with no rail uniform on) asking us for our tickets. We didn't have tickets, as we don't go to this train station very often and we assumed there'd be ticket guys at the exit where we could buy them, however, this was not the case. So, this man took our details, (and the number off of my student card) our descriptions and asked for an explanation. I told him this:

That we didn't go to this train station very often, and had assumed considering there were so many ticket men at the other end of the station that there would be some here too. We were going close to the Cathedral, and by my knowledge the way we had gone to leave the station was the fastest route. The station we had left from had no opportunity for us to buy a ticket, as there is renovations going on meaning that it isn't staffed a lot of the time, and that because it was only one stop away a ticket man on the train hadn't come round. The 'avoidance' of buying a ticket was purely accidental.

I was totally compliant with the man, and he was very polite telling me what was going to happen and everything else we needed to know.
However, I would like some sort of inclination as to what sort of penalty I would be likely to (if any) receive for this misdemeanour?

Thanks

Did you bypass the very visible and obvious ticket check leading into the main station exit and try to leave at the end of platform 3?

 

[185]

If Northern Rail again failed to provide a booking office at the station where the customer boarded during listed opening hours, the company want to be careful, especially in cases where a customer 'went there to pay but it was shut as a result of Northern'.

Does anything excuse the passenger leaving via the back of Victoria? No. But does their leaving via the back of the station excuse another closed Northern Rail booking office? Even bigger no.

Could the origin have been Salford Crescent?

 

[6Gman]

Does anything excuse the passenger leaving via the back of Victoria? No.

But surely if passengers aren't supposed to use that exit then it should be closed off?

Why provide an exit which people aren't to use?

 

[silencio]

Manchester Victoria's gating/staffing situation is bizarre. Regardless of what platform you get off on (except for the 2 parallel to the tram lines) all you need to do is walk up the stairs towards McDonalds and then down the main set of stairs from the MEN entrance and you seemingly avoid all staff. Not something im advocating doing but something I noticed the other night on my way home. I had a valid ticket however.

 

[MidnightFlyer]

The only time I've exited that way I was asked at the foot of the stairs for a valid ticket by G4S. I'd arrived by train and visited the McDonalds so I had one, don't know what someone who'd just been there for brekkie would have needed to say / prove however!

 

[VickiLew]

Could the origin have been Salford Crescent?

Yes, it was Salford Crescent, for the benefit of everyone else (as I realise now I forgot to write this down) Salford Crescent is undergoing MAJOR works, which means 99% of the time now it's un-manned. This meant that on this occasion I had no chance to buy a ticket on the leaving station, as it was only 2 stops from SLD to MCV, there was no conductor to find, so there was no way of me buying a ticket before I was stopped on the platform. (I hadn't actually left the station i'll add) the ticket itself is only £2.50 return, not something i'd go out of my way to avoid.
Also, I collect train tickets, so it seems to me silly that I would avoid paying, if I get a letter, should I mention this in my explanation? I have over 500 tickets from 2009 onwards.

 

[bb21]

Also, I collect train tickets, so it seems to me silly that I would avoid paying, if I get a letter, should I mention this in my explanation? I have over 500 tickets from 2009 onwards.

In short, no. It is irrelevant and you need to stick only to relevant facts.

What conversation took place exactly?

 

[island]

Were you asked a question such as "if I had not stopped you today, would you have purchased a ticket?" If so, how did you reply?

 

[Stigy]

Just for the benefit of anyone reading this who isn't sure, I'd like to clarify that if this was the case, there is no requirement to seek the conductor.

Not specific requirement, however can form part of the Train Company's case if they wish to prosecute for a 5(3)a, as not approaching the Guard when their destination station is unmanned etc, could be seen as attempting to avoid payment.

 

[island]

The usual outcome in the situation described seems to be that the passengers receive an administrative penalty of £80 plus the fare avoided, assuming they have not come to the attention of the company's revenue protection team before.

 

[ValleyLines142]

Manchester Victoria's gating/staffing situation is bizarre. Regardless of what platform you get off on (except for the 2 parallel to the tram lines) all you need to do is walk up the stairs towards McDonalds and then down the main set of stairs from the MEN entrance and you seemingly avoid all staff. Not something im advocating doing but something I noticed the other night on my way home. I had a valid ticket however.

This is actually very true, I've experienced this myself; although this wasn't the case on Friday with the passengers on this thread.

 

[silencio]

Be prepared for a long wait. Took me 6 weeks to be issued with my first letter. Since disputing their fee it has now been 2 months since I last heard from them. I was told by them on the phone it'd probably be about 2-3 weeks (for them to respond to my letter).

 

[Stigy]

Be prepared for a long wait. Took me 6 weeks to be issued with my first letter. Since disputing their fee it has now been 2 months since I last heard from them. I was told by them on the phone it'd probably be about 2-3 weeks (for them to respond to my letter).

It's not uncommon to be 8-weeks at the least...Some of these Prosecutions Teams are so busy, and staff numbers don't usually reflect this!