can RPIs stop people boarding if someone is drunk

[pethadine82]

hypothetical question, but if someone has had a few to drink but is non violent and has a valid ticket, can RPIs eject or remove these people from the train or take their ticket away from them?

 

[yorkie]

If a passenger is breaking byelaws, they can of course be asked to leave the premises and/or be refused carriage.

 

[Stigy]

hypothetical question, but if someone has had a few to drink but is non violent and has a valid ticket, can RPIs eject or remove these people from the train or take their ticket away from them?

Yes.

However, they'd need to be careful as you can obviously appear drunk when suffering from hypoglycaemia or similar, in which case they'd need medical attention rather than to be booted out. It's usually a common sense thing, for example it's going to cause problems if you start turfing everybody out of a station late at night because they're a bit wobbly. Whereas one person who is clearly drunk (presenting their 3-litre bottle of white lightning as proof for example) would be easier to remove.

 

[cuccir]

In addition to general laws on public disorder, the following applies.

Railway Byelaw 4:

4. Intoxication and possession of intoxicating liquor
(1) No person shall enter or remain on the railway where such person is unfit
to enter or remain on the railway as a result of being in a state of
intoxication.
(2) Where reasonable notice is, or has been, given prohibiting intoxicating liquor
on any train service, no person shall have any intoxicating liquor with him on
it, or attempt to enter such a train with intoxicating liquor with him.
(3) Where an authorised person reasonably believes that any person is unfit to
enter or remain on the railway, or has with him intoxicating liquor contrary to
Byelaw 4(2), an authorised person may:
(i) require him to leave the railway; and
(ii) prevent him entering or remaining on the railway until an
authorised person is satisfied that he has no intoxicating liquor
with him and/or is no longer in an unfit condition.

 

[Chapeltom]

I personally think its better to let people travel if they've had a few, especially if they are going home. If you can tell someone has had a few to drink, but is not acting violent, disruptive and simply wants to be peaceful and get on with what they are doing, I don't see the problem in letting them travel. I think I'd be quite shocked if I discovered I could not get a train home after having a few pints after University, and you'd quite quickly have a lot of people refused travel, including thousands of sports fans if you refused them travel because they'd had a drink.

 

[34D]

Surely the train is _for_ the times you go out on the lash?

If not then there's no point

 

[notadriver]

As a former National Express coach driver alcohol was not permitted at all and drunk people were not allowed on. Consumption of alcohol is not permitted on PCVs and you wont be permitted to board an aircraft drunk. Why should trains allow this?

 

[pethadine82]

thats what I thought.
However imagine if they refused to let someone travel which due to the times made their ticket invalid and then subsequently issued with a penalty fare.
very harsh.

 

[maniacmartin]

thats what I thought.
However imagine if they refused to let someone travel which due to the times made their ticket invalid and then subsequently issued with a penalty fare.
very harsh.

If tickets are invalid then Penalty Fare tickets would be too surely :roll:

I don't think ticket validity and the Byelaws on alcohol are related.

 

[Haywain]

Surely the train is _for_ the times you go out on the lash?

If not then there's no point

It may be for the times when you go out on the lash, but that is still subject to behaving in a civilized manner.

 

[AlexS]

Having had a drink is one thing.

If you get wrecked and make a nuisance of yourself, then you're liable to attract the wrong kind of attention and get removed, usually by the police rather than an RPI.

Anyone from a platform supervisor/dispatcher to guard to RPI etc can enforce byelaw 4 however.

I had some lad roll up on my platform on the bank holiday morning a few weeks back, and for no reason as he walked past, obviously a bit worse for wear, called me a w****r.

I then kicked him off the station and wouldn't let him back in until he'd sobered up/missed a good few trains to his destination and been delayed for a couple of hours, as his behaviour was unacceptable, so I decided at my discretion to enforce the byelaw. I'm not remotely interested in helping drunks out at 8am.

Conversely, I had a bloke puking in the bogs, but generally being apologetic and embarrassed and apart from that being in a reasonable sort of state. On that occasion, as it was Saturday night, myself and a passing BTP officer got him a coffee, sat him down for half an hour, and made sure he got on his train safely and on his way once he started sobering up a bit.

Good natured, happy people just having a night out and not causing anyone any harm will received nothing but good humour from me in return.

 

[NeilWatson]

I'm on tonight's 23.23 ex Kings Cross, if there were no drunks the train would be very empty....

 

[Greenback]

People who have had a drink are not generally going to be prevented from joining a train, byelaws or no byelaws. Technically, a drunk person can be prevented from travelling, but again, this rarely happens unless the person or persons in questions are causing trouble, and there are suitably trained and skilel dstaff to deal with the matter.

 

[cuccir]

The Byelaws provide staff with legal backing if someone is behaving in such a way that means it would be better if they were off the train. For general drunkness then it's probably better for all if they travel, but it's also good that staff have the option if needed.

 

[plastictaffy]

I'm on tonight's 23.23 ex Kings Cross, if there were no drunks the train would be very empty....

Worked a late night 12 car train off Euston at a similar time last night, absolutely rammed with late night revellers. Had a good laugh with a good few of them. Some were blatantly hammered, but certainly gave me no trouble!!!

I think it should come down to the discretion of the RPI's, regardless of the byelaws. Yes, a punter might be absolutely mullered, and therefore being very loud, but as long as he's not making a pain in the arse of himself, I don't see it as a problem.

 

[sheff1]

I think it should come down to the discretion of the RPI's, regardless of the byelaws. Yes, a punter might be absolutely mullered, and therefore being very loud, but as long as he's not making a pain in the arse of himself, I don't see it as a problem.

But then, surely, he is not 'unfit' so no discretion needed.

 

[Stigy]

But then, surely, he is not 'unfit' so no discretion needed.

You can be unfit through drink etc, without being a pain. Some people don't say or act in an anti-social way at all, but are that wobbly that they'd be dangerous if walking along a platform unaided.

I think people need to be held accountable for their own actions more than they are already. It's the railway that gets the bad reputation for the drunkeness on a Friday/Saturday night at stations and on trains, yet these are grown-ups we're talking about! If people can't handle their drink and insist on being animals, that's their own fault and where I don't think they should be allowed to travel in that state, understand the logistics of turfing 100's of drunk passengers out of a busy hub on a Friday night, and how it's not feasible. That being the case, when it goes pear shaped, the railway and it's staff should not be to blame. Can't win really. If they're turfed out and get hit by a bus the Daily Mail will report it as the Railway's fault, and if they are allowed to travel, kick off and somebody gets killed, the Daily Mail report the railway as the Wild West....Fantastic society we live in. *Rant Over*

 

[34D]

As a former National Express coach driver alcohol was not permitted at all and drunk people were not allowed on. Consumption of alcohol is not permitted on PCVs and you wont be permitted to board an aircraft drunk. Why should trains allow this?

I have previously looked into the legalities of serving alcohol on board party buses, and am comfortable that it is legal (with the right circumstances).