Trans Pennine Real Ale clampdown

[D1009]

What do you reckon? Do you think the 'ban' is aimed at people who drink that - or the people who drink copious quantities Fosters/Carling/Stella/Kronenbourg/etc, followed by a Jägerbomb or two?

This thread really has prompted some rather daft responses...

Where do you draw the line though? There are also some quality imported lagers such as Budweiser Budvar. If you have a ban there has to be some clarity about what is banned and what isn't.

 

[transmanche]

If you have a ban there has to be some clarity about what is banned and what isn't.

Why? It's up to each pub to decide what it will and won't sell.

And if that causes you concern, then it's up to you (as the customer) to ask the pub what they will and won't sell you.

It's clearly obvious who they're trying to dissuade from 'doing the trail'. Yet some people here really are trying to make a mountain out of a non-existent molehill. :roll:

 

[asylumxl]

I personally think this is a good move and it's particularly pleasing to see it coming from the establishments themselves.

Having said that, I do see the points people are making about a blanket ban. There's absolutely nothing stopping these people getting ****ed on something else is there?

 

[richw]

Is the clue not in the name "Real Ale Trail" what they will be serving on the Trail? If you don't like Real Ale you dont do a "Real Ale Trail". Simple really.

I expect this is a deterrent to be honest. Old John who has been going to his local (which happens to be on the ale trail) for 50 years on a saturday afternoon for half a lager will still be served his Lager.

 

[transmanche]

There's absolutely nothing stopping these people getting ****ed on something else is there?

Yes they could - but they won't. Unless you think the average lager drinker is likely to switch to a pint of Radgie Gadgie.

The pubs know what kind of drinker is causing the problem (lager/shot drinking hen & stag parties) and are trying to dissuade them from 'doing the trail'. Simple.

Nothing else to see here... move along now... :roll:

 

[Buspilot]

Unless you think the average lager drinker is likely to switch to a pint of Radgie Gadgie.

Oh yes they will!

These idiots are not going to wait for the next train, whilst their mates drink are they? They will drink one of the beers on sale. Once they get off the train you have them in the vicinity of that station/pub, until the next train.

 

[RichmondCommu]

It was surely inevitable that Hen and Stag parties would interpret a Real Ale Trail as a booze cruise so in reality they only had themselves to blame. In fact it was a Stag do paradise; loads of pubs, cheap and frequent public transport and members of the opposite sex in abundance.

As for the pubs, it’s a brave landlord that refuses to sell lager no matter what the time of day. I've been a paid up member of CAMRA for many years but in reality four pints of Fosters has the same effect on the body as four pints of Timothy Taylor Landlord. The only difference being that Landlord tastes much nicer! The important campaign for CAMRA at the moment is to save pubs from closure and the duty paid on beer; what people choose to drink is far less important.

 

[transmanche]

Oh yes they will!

These idiots are not going to wait for the next train, whilst their mates drink are they?

Haha! Most youngsters wouldn't touch real ale with a bargepole!And you forget that none of their mates will will be drinking either... they're all drinking lager and shots!

But the big point is that (once the message gets across) they won't even be there. No lager, no shots, no stag/hen parties = no reason to go.

 

[RPI]

Simple, drink a proper drink (real ale).

 

[tbtc]

Maybe the question could be "if the Huddersfield line has seen such huge popularity for pub crawls, why aren't other lines trying to market themselves better to tap into the same market"?

 

[Zoidberg]

Maybe the question could be "if the Huddersfield line has seen such huge popularity for pub crawls, why aren't other lines trying to market themselves better to tap into the same market"?

I see what you did there

 

[yorksrob]

The only difference being that Landlord tastes much nicer! The important campaign for CAMRA at the moment is to save pubs from closure and the duty paid on beer; what people choose to drink is far less important.

Never a truer word said !

 

[HowardGWR]

snipped I've been a paid up member of CAMRA for many years but in reality four pints of Fosters has the same effect on the body as four pints of Timothy Taylor Landlord. The only difference being that Landlord tastes much nicer! The important campaign for CAMRA at the moment is to save pubs from closure and the duty paid on beer; what people choose to drink is far less important.

I wonder how many years you have been a member? I can remember when CAMRA was founded, before which the situation was dire. One could go for miles before finding a pub with one real beer let alone a choice. It's one of the best campaigns that was ever mounted. I say 'cheers' to CAMRA, mentally, every time I take a first sip. So well done RC, for being a member and let's not ever forget how we customers were almost sold down the river by the mega-breweries. Keg Red Barrel and 'E' - ugh, nat's pee!

What a pity about the louts, they were shewn on the TV series recently. Pity the guards.

 

[61653 HTAFC]

As a local to the vague area of the rail ale trail (though not directly thanks to the 'good doctor' closing the stations!), I certainly welcome this decision. I haven't taken part in the trail due to living part-way along the route but have witnessed the (sometimes hilarious, sometimes rather frightening!) carnage taking place in neighbouring villages. Of course it's not an exact science but based on my own observations it's not too difficult to tell who the troublemakers are!:roll:

Problem is, a move like this needs reasonable coverage to have any real effect- Though I'm not sure how many Waynes and Chantelles planning their stag/hen parties will bother to visit the Huddersfield Examiner website beforehand!

 

[dcsprior]

There are some excellent cask conditioned lagers such as Harviestoun Schiehallion served from hand pumps, will these be banned?

I've never seen someone drink Schiehallion (which is nice for a lager, but not as nice as their Bitter & Twisted) until they become unruly, so we have to assume that common sense will prevail.

 

[noddingdonkey]

This is nothing more than a publicity stunt which hasn't been thought through and seems to have been misrepresented by the Examiner (quelle surprise).

At least one of the pubs they name have stated on their Facebook page to the effect that it's business as usual on Saturdays but if things get out of hand in that pub (which has never happened) they'll stop serving lager.

But let's believe for a moment that this plan was put into action and pubs refuse to serve hen/stag groups. What happens then? Assuming they have calmly left the premises rather than kicking off, you now have a group of "merry" people at a loose end for an hour until the next train. Assuming they can't find a pub to serve them (which is unlikely) they'll go to the co-op and get a crate of tins to consume either on the station or sitting on somebody's garden wall. And won't have access to any toilet facilities, so will end up improvising. The police haven't got the resources to do anything - if they do have to arrest anybody that takes the officer involved out of the loop for the rest of the afternoon doing paperwork. This just hasn't been thought through.

I attended a public meeting, held in Slaithwaite, a few months ago which was attended by the police (West Yorkshire and BTP), local councillors, the local MP and a representative of Northern who didn't do himself any favours - he turned up late and proceeded to be more interested in his laptop than listening to questions that were put to him, and even less interested in any suggestion that involved Northern doing something.

It was notable that almost all of the public who were present were from Marsden. My perception as somebody from Slaithwaite's neighbouring village who spends quite a lot of time there is that the Ale Trail is generally good natured within the village. Most in Slaithwaite (with the notable exception of a couple of NIMBYs who bought a property near the station without doing their research properly, and got a shock on the Saturday after they moved in) appreciate the extra trade that comes into the village and aren't really inconvenienced by it.

However I do appreciate that in Marsden it's different. For those from West Yorkshire it's the end of the line if they have a Day Rover or don't want to pay the ridiculous fare to continue towards Manchester. So people are likely to spend longer in Marsden before turning back, so there are several train loads there at once.

The aforementioned Northern rep at the public meeting flatly dismissed suggestions that sorting out the infamous Marsden-Greenfield fare anomaly might be a good way of encouraging people to continue through to Stalybridge where, any trouble could be confined to the station and thus inconvenience fewer people. It would also be appreciated by many of the locals and might generate some goodwill.

And that is where I see the solution to this problem. As much as the residents of Marsden might like to think otherwise, you can't put the genie back in the bottle, the Ale Trail is here to stay. So their efforts would be better used in campaigning for infrastructure to be upgraded to cope with the numbers of visitors. Let's have more litter bins, let's have toilets and better waiting facilities at Marsden and Slaithwaite stations. Surely the footfall Marsden is getting justifies sorting out the accessibility issues on the Huddersfield platform? Fix these things to cope with the Ale Trail and the facilities are there for the locals to use in the week.

 

[RichmondCommu]

I wonder how many years you have been a member? I can remember when CAMRA was founded, before which the situation was dire. One could go for miles before finding a pub with one real beer let alone a choice. It's one of the best campaigns that was ever mounted. I say 'cheers' to CAMRA, mentally, every time I take a first sip. So well done RC, for being a member and let's not ever forget how we customers were almost sold down the river by the mega-breweries. Keg Red Barrel and 'E' - ugh, nat's pee!

What a pity about the louts, they were shewn on the TV series recently. Pity the guards.

I've been a member for 20 years and I'm now 46. I do get involved with my local group but because of various commitments don't do as much as I would like. Sign up at the GBBF and you get lots of free goodies hint hint

I also happen to think that Tim Wetherspoon has done a lot to champion Real Ale and when I worked near Billingsgate would often have a pint in the Crosse Keys. It's like being a kid in a sweet shop!

 

[pinguini]

As the Hobgoblin says "What's the matter lagerboy, afraid you might taste something?"

 

[RichmondCommu]

Haha! Most youngsters wouldn't touch real ale with a bargepole!And you forget that none of their mates will will be drinking either... they're all drinking lager and shots!

But the big point is that (once the message gets across) they won't even be there. No lager, no shots, no stag/hen parties = no reason to go.

I have to say that you are somewhat ill-informed with your comments. In terms of of young people drinking real ale the tide is turning with the lighter ales and IPA's; Whim Ales being an excellent example. Go to a beer festival and you will see plenty of young drinkers thanks to lots of hard work from CAMRA.

My 19 year old twins (one being a girl) are both at Nottingham Uni and are regulars in the many real ale pubs in Beeston and Nottingham supping pints of JHB and Harvest Pale. Now whilst their Facebook accounts do demonstrate drunken stupidity on student nights as a result of drinks promotions ("your turn on my face" :roll, in their defence Oceana don't sell real ale! Don't write the kids off just yet!

 

[Gareth]

I know quite a few younger people who drink real ale, myself included (CAMRA member here too).

That said, transmanche isn't entirely wrong with what he says. I've got plenty of friends or acquaintances who won't even contemplate it as an option. A big reason for this is that they grow up with Carling, Carlsberg etc via advertising and so when they first manage to get served in a pub and they know bugger all about alcohol, that's what they go for. Indeed, I think I was the same in those early days. I mean, there's this guy I know, who's 21 but mentally about 12 and he drinks Corrs Lights. Free country, of course, but I know for a fact that he only drinks that (which tastes like carbonated water to me) because of that daft Jean-Claude Van Damn advert.

Also, most young people drink alcohol to get smashed. Real ale suggests that the drinker may actually like ale and that's the reason they go out, rather than get smashed and hopefully wake up next to someone who you'd wan't to wake up with.

In the end, real ale still instills to impression of seriousness and old people. This is like what garlic is to a vampire when it comes to the 'lets get smashed, puke on the pavement, whilst exposing our panties to the world' contingent that you get. And that's the whole point of participating pubs refusing to sell lager and shots on this trail.

 

[Cliveblackpool]

I try not to criticize what people like to drink. If a National advertized brand of 'beer' which has been brewed superbland to suit many popular palates is their tipple, that's fair enough!!
But imo they are losing out on the myriad of flavours good old British beer has to offer. Hoppy, malty etc etc. Ask for a sample.
Shots, yes gets you ****ed quicker, a rip off for your wallet, and really the last thing a drinker needs is the room spinning!! Very unsociable!
Spirits - works out double the price per unit of alcohol.
In general we are too susceptible to big brand advertising.
Eg English apples are way the best!! Forget 'le crunch.'

 

[Stonesourscotty]

Dear RichmondCommu no student places sell real ale we have the same horrible scene up north albeit i was drinking there 5 years ago i swear student unions are trying to drive into weatherspoons or make us lagerlouts. the issue we have today is where a Cider is either a Strongbow or a Brothers (Dutch Chemical urine) a Lager is a Fosters or carsberg and a Vodka is Smirnoff no wonder pubs are dieing when all they sell is horrible tripe. i live in wigan a town that upto recently had a record for most pubs within a certain distance yet also they have one of the best beer festivals around 35+ ciders Hundreds of real ales and a good foreign beer selection the only problem is the pubs that sponsor the events never sell the decent stuff we drink at the beer festivals and there closing quite quickly... theres a pub near me the delph that sponsored a beer and cider festival but hasnt had a real cider on in the time ive visited the pub (9 years) i worry for the uk pubs the way there run.


Speaking of which Stockport beer fest Starts tomorrow til Saturday 5 mins walk from Stockport train station. decent beer and cider ranges from what ive seen online.

 

[Hyphen]

My 19 year old twins (one being a girl) are both at Nottingham Uni and are regulars in the many real ale pubs in Beeston and Nottingham supping pints of JHB and Harvest Pale.

That's my neck of the woods (or was before I moved to Swansea uni!) - I presume they're familiar with the excellent Queen's Hotel next to (keeping it topical) Beeston station?

 

[Sapphire Blue]

Dear RichmondCommu no student places sell real ale

Having just conducted the webite survey for Huddersfield's Branch of Camra, I can assure you that Huddersfield Students Union bar has three ever changing guest ales on offer. You can't get more "studenty" than that.
I am assured that this is NOT an exception.

Many of the student bars in the town also sell ale too, including the three nearest bars to the Uni.

The reasoning goes like this.

If there is a group of, say, 8 students, going for a night out and only one or two of them want real-ale, the bars with the ale available will get their custom.
The lager and shots only drinkers will go anywhere.

 

[yorksrob]

I can also confirm that a reasonable proportion of Lancaster University's nine bars (funny how I ended up studying there ) have cask ale (Possibly more than was the case when I was there twelve years ago ).

 

[gordonthemoron]

how busy is Stalybridge Station Buffet on Sunday evening? I may stop off on way back from Leeds next Sunday

 

[Max]

Real ale is becoming ever more popular with young people. Sheffield University and the Students' Union serve ale in all of their outlets. In fact, the Interval Bar at the University won Sheffield & District CAMRA's 'Best Club' award this year. Meanwhile, the Real Ale Society at the University has begun brewing its own beers in partnership with a local brewery and an MP (see here) and, as somebody who has attended their events in the past, the society has a diverse membership in terms of sex and age and the focus is on enjoying different beers as opposed to getting completely hammered. I hear that things are going the same way at other universities too, which is great news of course.

 

[richw]

Having just conducted the webite survey for Huddersfield's Branch of Camra, I can assure you that Huddersfield Students Union bar has three ever changing guest ales on offer. You can't get more "studenty" than that.
I am assured that this is NOT an exception.

Many of the student bars in the town also sell ale too, including the three nearest bars to the Uni.

The reasoning goes like this.

If there is a group of, say, 8 students, going for a night out and only one or two of them want real-ale, the bars with the ale available will get their custom.
The lager and shots only drinkers will go anywhere.

My brother is at UWIC in Cardiff, since he started there all he will drink is real ale. Before he started he wouldnt touch it. Suggests to me its promoted at the university!

 

[Chapeltom]

I'm primarily an ale drinker (I'm 20) but have found a lot of lighter beers in particular taste the same, me and my best mate have sampled around 2500 beers between us since we turned 18 and are in agreement on that. As a result we've swung more towards craft beer when we can and foreign micro breweries where you get something different, a bit stronger (a lot of my favourite craft beers are 9% + and the flavours in some of them are unbelievable) - and if you have a few 9%+ beers, you'll still end up spending about the same as on a few pints of ale. That said, we do regular ale sessions in Manchester and Sheffield, ale is a hell of a lot cheaper than craft beer and its a rare treat now.

That said, I will drink lager and don't mind it, just prefer my ale and now my craft beers when I can afford them! A lot of people I know drink ale, as its normally cheaper and yes sometimes its John Smiths, Boddingtons etc (personally I do enjoy the latter in my local pub 100 yards away even as a CAMRA man!)

 

[Greenback]

Craft beers ar eincreasingly popular and ar ehelping to drive the increasing interest in proper beer. I see more younger people drinking the lighter and, dare I say it, more modern ales, in preference to more traditional bitter type beer.

I wonder if craft beers could possibly overtake lager in popularity with future generations?