Have just read all 6 pages & am bewildered at some of the responses given its one train on a Friday for one months trial. Mrs B & myself actually travelled on it from Dundee to Newcastle some months ago being reserved into the quiet coach. A large group of sober young females were standing next to us on the platform at Dundee & went into the next coach. During the journey I caught glimpses of them from our seats as the journey progressed as well as hear the racket they were making. It was obvious that as the drink began to be consumed they were becoming louder & louder. Several passengers moved out of that coach into ours as a result to escape them. Upon arrival at Newcastle these young women were falling about drunk & joining other groups of noisy young people spilling out from the other coaches. What other passengers thought after having to endure that bedlam is anyones guess but if the dry train trial curtails it then all the better.
-
Our new ticketing site is now live! Using either this or the original site (both powered by TrainSplit) helps support the running of the forum with every ticket purchase! Find out more and ask any questions/give us feedback in this thread!
East Coast dry train trial
- Thread starter Furrball
- Start date
- Status
Sponsor Post - registered members do not see these adverts; click here to register, or click here to log in
R
RailUK Forums
brompton rail
Member
They often serve Alcohol as soon as The All Day Menu Starts , I have imbibed shortly after boarding the HC in Falkirk. (ie 11am)
If you've paid £13 for a First Class Single from Falkirk to Newcastle, joining the affected service in Edinburgh and are subjected to these restrictions I find it outrageous
The 09.52 Aberdeen to Newcastle (& Kings Cross) doesn't call at Falkirk.
transmanche
Established Member
- Joined
- 27 Feb 2011
- Messages
- 6,021
They often serve Alcohol as soon as The All Day Menu Starts , I have imbibed shortly after boarding the HC in Falkirk. (ie 11am)
If you've paid £13 for a First Class Single from Falkirk to Newcastle, joining the affected service in Edinburgh and are subjected to these restrictions I find it outrageous
Er, you might want to re-read Butts's post...
So you are encouraging me. to break the law I take it then I can break other railway bywlaws
As you claim it affects you and your unopened bottle of whisky, wouldn't it be better to contact East Coast directly with your problem? Or is being pedantic and whining on here much more likely to solve your issue?
Nope, I'm encouraging you to stop being so over dramatic and making a mountain out of a molehill just to try and have a moan about something.
It is clear that this is to stop drinking aboard. They couldn't care less if you have 6 crates of larger in your suitcase as long as you don't open it on that train.
In all honesty this thread is one of the most ridiculous on this forum. EC have identified a problem and are fixing it. This is a trial do if it dosnt work they will try something else. Get a grip-there are bigger things to worry about than this.
Butts
Veteran Member
Thats why I stated I join it in Edinburgh
--- old post above --- --- new post below ---
Indeed, thanks
I think we all agree that consumption of alcohol on this service is not necessarily anti-social or threatening.
I have travelled many times on long distance train journeys and having a drink is a part of that for me, often local beers in Germany, Slovenia. If I were going through North Scotland, I'd like a dram of whisky, regardless of the time.
The alcohol is not the issue. It's the behaviour of those abusing it. How about getting those BTP resources and target trouble makers instead of making assumptions and slapping on a crude ban?
I have travelled many times on long distance train journeys and having a drink is a part of that for me, often local beers in Germany, Slovenia. If I were going through North Scotland, I'd like a dram of whisky, regardless of the time.
The alcohol is not the issue. It's the behaviour of those abusing it. How about getting those BTP resources and target trouble makers instead of making assumptions and slapping on a crude ban?
My point exactly, surely thats what BTP exist for?
There is anti social behaviour in most towns on a Saturday night but the police deal with it, they don't try and ban alcohol
No, we don't-and not dies east coast which is why they are trying this. Or else they wouldn't bother. They are going to loose more than anyone else by doing this as they will loose revenue in the buffet. They arnt doing it to be awkward or to upset those of you who apparently have to pour beer down your necks at 11am as soon as you get on a train but are doing it to address a problem. At a guess this is based on research and passenger feedback.
And its not practicle for BTP to keep an eye on one particular train, their resources are already over stretched. They can't just keep officers on one train every day and if you have to call them out to a station to meet the train it causes delays whilst you wait for them.
Town centers are very different to a train aswell and an awful lot of money is spent on policing town centres on Friday and Saturday nights.
And many town centres do ban drink actually-many towns have no drink policies on the street-you can only drink in bars or restaraunts. The reason for that? Not councils being awkward or 'abuse of privilege' (one of my favourite quotes in this forum so far!) but as a response to anti social behaviour and complaints from other users of the streets.
Your language is very emotive "pouring beer down your neck at 11am". I am not in any race. To be honest, 11am would be too early for beer but I'd definitely take whisky in my porridge, champagne breakfast or a baileys coffee at 11 or earlier.
As a first effort, they need to tackle the behaviour, not the alcohol. We'll start to see vodka in Evian bottles, the issue only becoming apparent when the idiots get rowdy, while the guy who wants a single beer with his lunch is stigmatised.
I often pick up a can of Stella at McColl's beside Temple Meads for the 3pm to Paddington and I love it. I remain within the legal limit to drive a car, have never had any confrontation and would be saddened if anyone labelled my actions as problematic.
transmanche
Established Member
- Joined
- 27 Feb 2011
- Messages
- 6,021
Well your language is equally emotive. You'd think this is the first time that any TOC has banned alcohol on a train.
It's not new. It's not unprecedented. It happens regularly where the TOC and BTP feel its necessary. It is NOT the thin end of the wedge.
route:oxford
Established Member
- Joined
- 1 Nov 2008
- Messages
- 4,949
It's nothing new...
Back in the late 90s when I worked in Glasgow, the 17.25 service to Aberdeen on a Friday night was usually "dry".
Back in the late 90s when I worked in Glasgow, the 17.25 service to Aberdeen on a Friday night was usually "dry".
Can't believe this is still rumbling on as has been stated many times it is a non event and most complainers about the ban are only complaining because somebody might be trying to restrict them from doing something.
I could understand it if a ban was put in place on all trains that Butts travelled on
I could understand it if a ban was put in place on all trains that Butts travelled on
Well what is the problem then? It does seem that alcohol is the problem?
Or is the real issue just that you don't like being told what to do and believe that you are above that kind of thing...?
Please do tell us what the problem is.
D1009
Established Member
I don't like being told what to do, particularly if I've paid for the privilege. The problem is that because of the antics of some mindless drunken morons at one end of the train, people at the other end of the train who can pay £444 for a return ticket from Aberdeen to Kings Cross can't have a glass of wine with their (complimentary) lunch. An appalling situation, but if there was another way round it, I'm sure East Coast and BTP would have found one. But to say it's a non-issue is wrong.
If you don't like being told what to do then don't take the train. If you buy a train ticket you agree to tearms and conditions.
I don't see why some people feel they are above authority.
And there are other trains you can travel on which will serve drink so catch one of them instead.
If someone wants to travel by train between Aberdeen and Newcastle, there is still plenty of choice.
Either
a) choose the 0952 and refrain from drinking alocohol on board; or
b) choose another train and drink alcohol
If particular trains are known to have problems due to people drinking too much, I think it is very reasonable to take steps to reduce the magnitidue of the problem.
Either
a) choose the 0952 and refrain from drinking alocohol on board; or
b) choose another train and drink alcohol
If particular trains are known to have problems due to people drinking too much, I think it is very reasonable to take steps to reduce the magnitidue of the problem.
Bloated sense of entitlement much?!
Doesn't matter how much you pay for a train ticket, I don't see why you think you deserve free alcohol. You're still getting a free meal for goodness sake.
The following hashtag seems appropriate...
#firstworldproblems
I take it the poster who said that has never bought an airline ticket then-flying is a ultimate 'pay for the privilege of being told what to do' with security, customs, onboard seatbelt signs, not allowed to take certain things onboard etc.
Not being allowed to drink alcohol for a few hours in the morning on a particular train is nothing compared to that.
Some people are just too self important.
Given that they aren't supposed* to serve alcohol until after lunch, this case means they aren't allowed for less than a couple of hours. Obviously the end of the world.
* I know Butts has already said they often serve at 11am, but that is what their terms state.
Butts
Veteran Member
Can't believe this is still rumbling on as has been stated many times it is a non event and most complainers about the ban are only complaining because somebody might be trying to restrict them from doing something.
I could understand it if a ban was put in place on all trains that Butts travelled on
Hey Spock - I'll don a pair of false ears and impersonate a Vulcan
Seriously all joking aside, as had been said by many, I'd just avoid the 0952 from Aberdeen and join another service.
If the ban were to be extended to other services then that might be another matter.
--- old post above --- --- new post below ---
From my experience the reason this happens is that they go straight from The Breakfast Menu to The All Day Menu missing out the Mid Morning Menu.
Flamingo
Established Member
- Joined
- 26 Apr 2010
- Messages
- 6,806
Isn't it time to lock this thread?
D1009
Established Member
It's not a case of deserving it, that is what the TOC's publicity says you should get. There is already an interminable thread criticising East Coast's First Class service. If you start removing elements of the service on a premium product, then people will stop using it and East Coast will lose a valuable source of income. In my previous posting I admitted that there was no other way around this particular problem however.
--- old post above --- --- new post below ---
I have and I don't like it. Nowhere did I say I was placing myself above authority.
Which proves my original point-east coast arnt doing this for fun, they are doing it to try and fix a problem. They have more to loose out on than you do.
Sorry, but I think you need to get over yourself with the attitude of not wanting to be told what to do. If everyone took this attitude then nothing would work! Its exactly the same attitude that causes delays in the rush hour when train crews and platform staff call for people to move back so that they can see to dispatch a train and no one moves-they won't be told what to do by some railway employee.
Its rather pathetic to be that anti authority really.
I can see the point in prohibiting the drinking of alcohol and the carrying of open containers of alcohol on some trains in response to problems.
My concern would be the prohibition on the carrying of sealed bottles intended for gifts, rather than en-route consumption.
I appreciate that the police are most unlikely to search every item of luggage for drink, but they might carry out a spot check, and carrying drink in defiance of the ban would presumably be an offence ?
Likewise I have observed police officers asking "have you got alcohol with you ?" I would presume that lying to a police officer is a serious offence.
At the very least, if caught trying to illegally take a sealed bottle of drink on board, I would expect that the taking of statements etc would result in missing the train, and perhaps being "fined" hundreds of pounds if ones ticket was valid only on that service.
My concern would be the prohibition on the carrying of sealed bottles intended for gifts, rather than en-route consumption.
I appreciate that the police are most unlikely to search every item of luggage for drink, but they might carry out a spot check, and carrying drink in defiance of the ban would presumably be an offence ?
Likewise I have observed police officers asking "have you got alcohol with you ?" I would presume that lying to a police officer is a serious offence.
At the very least, if caught trying to illegally take a sealed bottle of drink on board, I would expect that the taking of statements etc would result in missing the train, and perhaps being "fined" hundreds of pounds if ones ticket was valid only on that service.
Sorry but that's rubbish. The point of the ban is to stop alcohol being drink onboard. They won't stop you carrying stuff in your luggage-the police have better things to do for a start.
I think this has been taken out of context. Perhaps east coasts statement has just been badly worded but asking as its not drink on board they won't have an issue with people carrying alcohol in their luggage same as it won't be a problem with people jumping on that train on their way home from doing the shopping with alcohol I'm bags.
- Status