Person clipped by train & incident apparently not reported immediately

[alan1962]

Hopefully theres someone on here who can answer my query. A train driver entering a station clipped a passenger who was too close to the edge of the platform. The driver knew they'd hit them but after picking up their passengers just drove off. Further down the line the driver decided to report it (about 40mins after incident). The company they worked for sacked the driver for failing to carry out duty of care to the passenger. What I'd like to know is, can the driver face a criminal prosecution for a hit and run the same as you would if they'd been driving a car? Thanks in advance

 

[Lrd]

How did the driver hit the passenger? Surely the passenger was to close to the edge of the platform and got hit by the train?

 

[DaveNewcastle]

"Hit and Run" is a common and colloquial term used to discuss the motoring Offence of failing to stop and report an accident. It does not equate to an otherwise comparable incident on the railways - the lack of a steering wheel might be indicative of the differences!

It would remain possible for an aggrieved passenger to launch a civil Claim against one of the Railway Companies involved (the train operator or station operator), or even to try to persuade the Police to investigate a criminal incident. Both appropaches would be difficult, but a Civil claim might, just might, be settled without costs escalating into stratospheric proportions; I'd expect that if the Police were willing to take an interest, that it wouldn't last long enough for the CPS to consider pursuing it. These would be claims against the Company, not against the driver.

In my opinion, a claim against the driver would be difficult, unlikely to suceed and disproportionately expensive.

What losses did the passenger incur? Loss of mobility, unable to continue a trade or profession, trauma, disfigurement, anything that has been quantified as the basis of a Claim?

 

[NSEFAN]

I'd be surprised if a driver would fail to report such an incident for so long. The railway is heavily monitored now so failing to report things is pretty much asking for a sacking! Even if it's a minor issue and the passenger wasn't seriously injured, it can't take long to get on the phone to control just to inform them of what's happened, can it?

 

[alan1962]

How did the driver hit the passenger? Surely the passenger was to close to the edge of the platform and got hit by the train?

you're knit picking lewisrday, the passenger was kneeling down on the edged of the platform and when he stood up his upper body was over the edge and he was struck by the train.
--- old post above --- --- new post below ---

"Hit and Run" is a common and colloquial term used to discuss the motoring Offence of failing to stop and report an accident. It does not equate to an otherwise comparable incident on the railways - the lack of a steering wheel might be indicative of the differences!

It would remain possible for an aggrieved passenger to launch a civil Claim against one of the Railway Companies involved (the train operator or station operator), or even to try to persuade the Police to investigate a criminal incident. Both appropaches would be difficult, but a Civil claim might, just might, be settled without costs escalating into stratospheric proportions; I'd expect that if the Police were willing to take an interest, that it wouldn't last long enough for the CPS to consider pursuing it. These would be claims against the Company, not against the driver.

In my opinion, a claim against the driver would be difficult, unlikely to suceed and disproportionately expensive.

What losses did the passenger incur? Loss of mobility, unable to continue a trade or profession, trauma, disfigurement, anything that has been quantified as the basis of a Claim?

Thanks for that, there was minor injuries to the passenger. I'm not sticking up for the driver i reckon they got what they deserved I was just curious to whether the passenger could push for a criminal conviction over it.

 

[GB]

you're knit picking lewisrday, the passenger was kneeling down on the edged of the platform and when he stood up his upper body was over the edge and he was struck by the train.
--- old post above --- --- new post below ---

Thanks for that, there was minor injuries to the passenger. I'm not sticking up for the driver i reckon they got what they deserved I was just curious to whether the passenger could push for a criminal conviction over it.

He's not nit picking, he's stating the facts. Also, Given it sounds like a glancing blow, how do you know the driver knew he hit the passenger and how do you know he only reported it 40 minutes later?

 

[alan1962]

He's not nit picking, he's stating the facts. Also, Given it sounds like a glancing blow, how do you know the driver knew he hit the passenger and how do you know he only reported it 40 minutes later?

Cant say how I know as the drivers appeal is still on going and I'm not sure if I'm supposed to be discussing. I'm not going to get into a petty argument over the train hitting the passenger you both know what i meant.

 

[DaveNewcastle]

. . . . the drivers appeal is still on going and I'm not sure if I'm supposed to be discussing.

Indeed.

Lets stop right here.

 

[A-driver]

To bring criminal charges you would need to prove the driver of the train was responsible for hitting the passenger, which they very clearly were not. Platforms are covered in signs and announcements telling people to stay away from the edge and obviously the train driver can't steer out the way. What's more is that they may not be able to stop in time if someone is too close to the edge, even when braking in a platform trains take a while to come to a stand and it's very hard to judge from the cab if someone is too far beyond the edge of a platform to be clipped.

Not reporting an incident is serious, I don't know if it could be a crime though. It's unlikely the driver would have just ignored it and carried on before deciding to report it. Was the driver definitely aware he had hit someone? Unless he actually saw it happen (if stopping at a station you are concentrating on the stopping point, not the passengers) he may not have been aware and possibly only became aware of it when told by other passengers? At low speed it wouldn't make much of a noise really and if it happened behind the cab the driver is likely to have no idea at all unless he saw it afterwards.

Obviously if he deliberately decided not to report it for what ever reason then the company would take it very seriously. Can't see the police doing the same though as the driver won't be held responsible for actually hitting the passenger. The passenger is at fault for that, not the driver. I can't see how not reporting it is actually a crime, more a matter for internal discipline.

 

[A-driver]

Indeed.

Lets stop right here.

Apologies for my reply. I read this as a hypothetical situation. Had no idea is was real.

 

[alan1962]

Indeed.

Lets stop right here.

ok my apologys for the post i was just curious as to whether the police could be involved

 

[Ferret]

One thread for deletion?

 

[455driver]

I'm not sticking up for the driver i reckon they got what they deserved

So a passenger is on the edge of the platform to such an extent that they get hit by a train and its the drivers fault!

Deleted the rest, cant be bothered!
--- old post above --- --- new post below ---

ok my apologys for the post i was just curious as to whether the police could be involved

If they were hopefully the first question would be "why were you on the edge of the platform putting yourself in a position of danger"!

Do you think that every driver should stop the train if people are on the edge of the platform?

If yes then thats the rush hour screwed!

Why do you think there are yellow lines on 90% of the platforms?

 

[alan1962]

So a passenger is on the edge of the platform to such an extent that they get hit by a train and its the drivers fault!

Deleted the rest, cant be bothered!
--- old post above --- --- new post below ---


If they were hopefully the first question would be "why were you on the edge of the platform putting yourself in a position of danger"!

Do you think that every driver should stop the train if people are on the edge of the platform?

If yes then thats the rush hour screwed!

Why do you think there are yellow lines on 90% of the platforms?

Firstly it wasn't me that got hit by the train, secondly I never said it was the drivers fault I said he got was he deserved for not reporting it. thirdly the driver should sound his horn if someone is too close to make them move, if they don't move then yes he should stop otherwise he's not carrying out his duty of care.

 

[bb21]

I think with an appeal in progress, it would be a bit rash for us to draw any conclusions.

Firstly it wasn't me that got hit by the train, secondly I never said it was the drivers fault I said he got was he deserved for not reporting it.

But maybe that wasn't what happened. As someone has already mentioned, maybe the driver did not realise that he had clipped someone until notified by someone else and reported straight away.

I don't doubt that you genuinely believed it when you claimed in your opening post that "The driver knew" but none of us were there to experience the incident first-hand so we couldn't possibly tell whether that was true or not.

thirdly the driver should sound his horn if someone is too close to make them move, if they don't move then yes he should stop otherwise he's not carrying out his duty of care.

Both of these things will depend on how close the train is when the driver spotted that the passenger is too close to the edge. If too late, it may not be avoidable.

 

[alan1962]

I think with an appeal in progress, it would be a bit rash for us to draw any conclusions.



But maybe that wasn't what happened. As someone has already mentioned, maybe the driver did not realise that he had clipped someone until notified by someone else and reported straight away.

I don't doubt that you genuinely believed it when you claimed in your opening post that "The driver knew" but none of us were there to experience the incident first-hand so we couldn't possibly tell whether that was true or not.



Both of these things will depend on how close the train is when the driver spotted that the passenger is too close to the edge. If too late, it may not be avoidable.

I can genuinely guarantee I know the driver knew they'd clipped the passenger, it wasn't the drivers fault the passenger got hit but the driver did nothing until his consconscience kicked in

 

[bb21]

I can genuinely guarantee I know the driver knew they'd clipped the passenger, it wasn't the drivers fault the passenger got hit but the driver did nothing until his consconscience kicked in

Fair enough. I don't need to doubt what you say.

Did the driver admit to his employer that very fact?

 

[alan1962]

Fair enough. I don't need to doubt what you say.

Did the driver admit to his employer that very fact?

yes the driver admitted it, all I was trying to find out was that if they could be prosecuted as its similar to hit and run but it seems not.

 

[yorkie]

yes the driver admitted it, all I was trying to find out was that if they could be prosecuted as its similar to hit and run but it seems not.

It does not seem at all similar to me, I agree with DaveNewcastle. It's not comparable. I think that A-Driver's post #9 of this thread sums up the situation.

Perhaps we should leave it there, until any further information comes to light, especially if a case is ongoing.