Most Successful UK Locomotive Design

[Manchester77]

Well yeah... the mark IIIs in a HST set don't go on their own. The 43s go on their own and can operate without being attached to the coaches so doesn't that make it a loco?

 

[yorksrob]

The 43s go on their own and can operate without being attached to the coaches so doesn't that make it a loco?

Well, you could say the same about a Motor Luggage Van and that's not a loco ! I tend to think of them more as Power Cars - admittedly without passenger accommodation, but the Guards van could still be used as revenue earning space.

 

[6Gman]

Black 5s Surely? The 'Go anywhere, do anything' locos

Seconded.

But then, I'm an LMS sort of guy!

 

[Eng274]

IMO the classes 43 and 86 get my vote, the former for revolutionising passenger travel, and latterly for being almost 50 years old and still running well, if depleted in numbers compared to the late 60s. Defining success purely on versatility is not ideal, however like 37s and 47s also nominated, it is remarkable that the 86's mixed traffic capability (less so nowadays admittedly) throughout its life has prolonged their existence.

 

[TDK]

Freight Loco - Class 66
Steam - Jinty or Black 5
passenger Loco - Class 90
DMU - Class 150
Emu - Southern slam door stock

 

[ash39]

Surprised nobody has suggested Class 58?

 

[Joseph.bevan96]

Well have to say Class 86, but then I'm an AC geek so my answer might be a bit biased

 

[D365]

Surprised nobody has suggested Class 58?

The build-to-export plan didn't fare too well... 59? Very powerful and reliable with 59003 exported to Germany. 08, 20, 37, 47 and even 86/87 have lasted quite well. Several batches of various diesels and electrics have found themselves overseas.

 

[ash39]

I was being ironic as it only lasted about 15-20 years! I forgot about the exports to be fair though.

 

[oddiesjack]

Surely JG Robinson's Class 8K (later LNER O4) must be in the running for a successful design - first produced in 1911, adopted by the military in WW1, the last ones being retired in 1990 in China!

And lets not forget that the LMS and the GWR also ran some ex-ROD ones, too.

 

[Kali]

47s had to be derated pretty fast and stayed that way, not exactly a roaring success of initial design. The HST if we're not splitting hairs for sure though, and the 37 which has done everything, pretty successfully.

Steam, hard to choose given the proliferation and lineage - you can trace the Black 5 fairly directly back to Churchward on the GWR, so who do you pick? GWR Halls - direct equivalent - were still being built by BR too. Still, the B5 is probably the best combination of evolution and distribution. I like the 9F suggestion, but too little & too late to be a success story.

Outside choice would be Churchward's 45xx, the ultimate small branch line engine.

 

[Teaboy1]

I would argue that the Bayer-Peacock Garrett's were the "most successful UK locomotive design", they were a UK locomotive, designed in UK and were successful. Now if you cannot accept that then I would nominate the Gresley A4's, V2's etc AFTER Swindon inspired mods. However my backing goes to those Garretts !!

 

[43074]

I would nominate the Class 43 HST. In 30 years only 3 power cars have been scrapped.

 

[12CSVT]

The build-to-export plan didn't fare too well..

To be fair most of the 58s have been active abroad since they were withdrawn prematurely in this country.

Classes I would nominate
08/09 - are still doing the job the were built for over 60 years after they were introduced.
20 - still doing what they were designed for, having spent many years successfully doing a job they weren't origionally desingned for (ie hauling heavy MGR trains in pairs)
37 - still a 'go anywhere, do anything' loco
43 (HST) - how many other classes have managed over 98% of the fleet still in traffic more than 30 years after the last ones entered service ?
73 - the fact that three quarters of the class still survive and some are about to be completely rebuilt by their owners speaks for itself
86 - capable of any sort of work, with some still giving reliable service for Freightliner almost 50 years after being introduced

 

[D6975]

Does successful have reliable as a prerequisite?

If so, then I must look at how often classes of loco have failed on me in my many years doing thousands of miles around the network.

Classes 86 and 87 top the list, having never failed on me.
20s and 37s come next with just one failure apiece.

47s come in the middle with 4 failures, but the relatively high mileage behind 47s must be taken into account here, about double that for 37s.

43s sadly come bottom of the list. I’ve lost count of the number of times a power car has blown up on me. Power cars with a liberal coating of black were all too common in the days when they were paxman powered. On the plus side, two PCs per train meant that you could at least limp forward on half power and weren’t completely stranded, just late.

 

[desmo]

31's anyone? Cant be many duties i've not seen them on

 

[Buttsy]

Cromptons (33s), surely as successful as Growlers but not see as often 'oop north' as home was the Southern. Also had ETH from the outset so no boiler to go wrong either...

 

[Kali]

31's anyone? Cant be many duties i've not seen them on

If you ignore the entire class having to have new engines...

Thinking about the basic EE shunter design, there's probably similarily successful independent constructor's designs for industrial use, but I know little about those.

I have had maybe 5 HST powercars fail on me ( and a brake issue which was much more disruptive ) and I'm just old enough to remember their introduction. Not too bad, I think.

 

[Smudger105e]

I stand by my shunter nomination, but have the following been considered?

55
71
74

and with steam locos

Q1
A1x

 

[D6975]

Cromptons (33s), surely as successful as Growlers but not see as often 'oop north' as home was the Southern. Also had ETH from the outset so no boiler to go wrong either...

Cromptons were pretty good locos, however they have failed on me 5 times.
Perhaps it's a little unfair though as 33057 went through a period of chronic unreliability and was responsible for 3 of these.

 

[D365]

To be fair most of the 58s have been active abroad since they were withdrawn prematurely in this country.

That's what I meant by my later statement. However, there were none destined for export from new. 58s only went abroad after they found themselves 'useless' in Britain.

Several batches of various diesels and electrics have found themselves overseas.

Classes I would nominate
08/09 - are still doing the job the were built for over 60 years after they were introduced.
20 - still doing what they were designed for, having spent many years successfully doing a job they weren't origionally desingned for (ie hauling heavy MGR trains in pairs)
37 - still a 'go anywhere, do anything' loco
43 (HST) - how many other classes have managed over 98% of the fleet still in traffic more than 30 years after the last ones entered service ?
73 - the fact that three quarters of the class still survive and some are about to be completely rebuilt by their owners speaks for itself
86 - capable of any sort of work, with some still giving reliable service for Freightliner almost 50 years after being introduced

I can agree with you on all counts and would perhaps even add 47/57. Even though the reliability of some locomotive types has been patchy, many have done well for themselves.

 

[Manchester77]

Class 77 anyone?
Hauled heavy passenger and freight along the woodhead and then went over the the Neatherlands

 

[fgwrich]

Cromptons (33s), surely as successful as Growlers but not see as often 'oop north' as home was the Southern. Also had ETH from the outset so no boiler to go wrong either...

True, a rather sucessfull and underated class i think!

31's anyone? Cant be many duties i've not seen them on

Urgh no. Awful locos with some pretty poor build quality. The last time i worked with a NR PED, if you hit / thumped the side panels, it had the sound of a loose box of Meccano. The cab doors on Peds are also notoriously bad for sticking, cabs are draughty, engine room is cramped - unless your 4 foot tall and very flexible and they're not known for PEDs for nothing...As in 'There speed is very Pedestrian'. Hardly the best start in the history of the class either, i wouldnt say there very sucessfull in the same ranks as the 47.

 

[TheEdge]

I must say I stand by my original GWR Pannier but agree with the sentiment with the 47 and 08.

 

[Michael.Y]

The Class 37. Did, does, will do everything. Coal, steel, passengers, nuclear waste, specials, commuter lines, InterCity, Railhead, Network Rail test trains.... In terms of a single locomotive, it has served all the needs called upon of it and more. Its longevity, reliability, resilience and distinctive appearance and noise make it a truly special beast.

 

[theageofthetra]

I do agree with the great service given by 08, 37 Black 5s & Panniers but what about the Southern electrics? I know they are not locomotives but some of the designs lasted virtually unchanged for 50 years in service. Other unsung heroes worth considering are Austerity tanks, Q1's Adams radial and A1x.

 

[LE Greys]

I must say I stand by my original GWR Pannier but agree with the sentiment with the 47 and 08.

I'll back that up, and add the O4s and 8Fs (built nationwide during both World Wars because they were the most effective heavy goods engines of the time).

In terms of a general design, take GWR № 100 William Dean. This was the prototype for the Saint class, upon which almost all GWR 2-cylinder locomotives were based (and influenced the Star class, so the 4-cylinder types as well), and by extension most LMS 2-cylinder locomotives from when Stanier took over (and all the rest of his designs, a Princess Royal is basically a King with a pony truck after all), and every single BR Standard. Essentially, William Dean was a revolutionary design that changed the face of railways in Britain almost as dramatically as Rocket.

 

[Yew]

What about 56's despite 66-isation they are a few being reactivated. And they definately have an impressive sound.

 

[ainsworth74]

Personally I think it takes more than a good sound to make a locomotive amongst the 'most successful'

 

[ash39]

...and if that were the case it would have to be the european Taurus electric, think that's what they call them anyway. The one that plays the piano when accelerating !!

** even though it's not UK, have you heard one of them??