I just picked up somebody else's tickets

[calc7]

When in a rush to pick up some tickets I had purchased for imminent travel, I accidentally transposed the last two digits of the ToD reference. This printed out somebody else's journey in late November.

Thankfully there was staff on the platform to whom I handed the misclaimed tickets.

Is this a common occurence? One would guess they were set to "any card collection"

 

[yorkie]

Very rare I'd say! And yes, must have been set to "any card" e.g. a business account.

 

[SS4]

Well the chance of randomly guessing a sequence is (1/36)^8 [I think it's alphanumeric (36 choices) and 8 characters long (8)]

If you assume the first six digits were right and only the last two were transposed it would be (1/36)^2 [1 in 36 chance on the 7th number and 1 in 36 to match on the last number].
For reference the chance of winning the lottery jackpot is 1 in 49C6 = 1 in 49!/(43!*6!) which is about 7.15*10^-8

(1/36)^2 = 7.72*10^-4 
(1/36)^8 = 3.54*10^-13

 

[transportphoto]

Well the chance of randomly guessing a sequence is (1/36)^8 [I think it's alphanumeric (36 choices) and 8 characters long (8)]

If you assume the first six digits were right and only the last two were transposed it would be (1/36)^2 [1 in 36 chance on the 7th number and 1 in 36 to match on the last number].
For reference the chance of winning the lottery jackpot is 1 in 49C6 = 1 in 49!/(43!*6!) which is about 7.15*10^-8

(1/36)^2 = 7.72*10^-4 
(1/36)^8 = 3.54*10^-13

Too much maths for me tonight...

Its not something I've heard of before calc7, only you can manage that! Well done! I agree it must be an any card collection booking.

TP

 

[Eagle]

If websites assign TOD reference numbers sequentially or quasi-sequentially, and bearing in mind it was the last two characters that you transposed, then it's not as slight a chance as the maths would suggest (and it'll be someone who booked from the same website at around the same time).

 

[tony_mac]

Which, of course, they should not do - it's a huge security risk!

It's not as if they don't have enough digits to make it secure.
Digit transposition is one of the most likely input errors; I think that any competent person would have taken this into account when assigning the code numbers.

 

[calc7]

Which, of course, they should not do - it's a huge security risk!

It's not as if they don't have enough digits to make it secure.
Digit transposition is one of the most likely input errors; I think that any competent person would have taken this into account when assigning the code numbers.

Quite! But can we trust ATOS?

I hope they manage to contact the poor lady whose tickets I collected.

 

[bb21]

Which, of course, they should not do - it's a huge security risk!

It's not as if they don't have enough digits to make it secure.
Digit transposition is one of the most likely input errors; I think that any competent person would have taken this into account when assigning the code numbers.

That was the impression I was under. Obviously I was wrong.

 

[DaveNewcastle]

Not all combinations of characters are valid - some characters can never appear in some of the 8 positions.

(It would be unwise to clarify any further).

 

[yorkie]

...I think that any competent person....

Do Atos have many competent persons working for them?

 

[34D]

Quite! But can we trust ATOS?

I hope they manage to contact the poor lady whose tickets I collected.

Does that suggest that you know her name? If so, then 'the railway authority' has broken at least one of the data protection principles.

I wouldn't like to guess which specific company(ies) may be culpable, after all there is the TOC who fronts the website used, the technical provider of the website used, the company who is responsible for the booking database, the tvm operator....

 

[calc7]

Does that suggest that you know her name? If so, then 'the railway authority' has broken at least one of the data protection principles.

I wouldn't like to guess which specific company(ies) may be culpable, after all there is the TOC who fronts the website used, the technical provider of the website used, the company who is responsible for the booking database, the tvm operator....

Her name, in the form MRS J BLOGGS, was printed on the bottom orange strip.

 

[DaveNewcastle]

Do Atos have many competent persons working for them?

One wonders!
They do seem to be quite good at recuiting software staff, or perhaps I should say that they appear to be very active in recruiting software staff.
They certainly need some, because even their own 'careers' website has a magnificent bug somewhere, which obstructs anyone using their recruitment system searching for opportunities from retracing their steps back through their web page history!
[using MS IE 8]

They need all the help they can get!
So lets all try to persuade our government to give them some more contracts, eh?

 

[telstarbox]

Not all combinations of characters are valid - some characters can never appear in some of the 8 positions.

(It would be unwise to clarify any further).

Am I right in thinking that not all 26 letters of the alphabet are used in collection codes, despite appearing on the TVM 'keyboard'? J and K seem to come up frequently when I collect tickets.

 

[maniacmartin]

I'm not sure if ToD codes do it, but also many other systems that generate codes for humans to enter will avoid lookalike letters (O and 0, 1 and l, etc)

 

[GodAtum]

Thats why there is card verification, so its only a security risk if you dont opt for that.

 

[IanD]

Am I right in thinking that not all 26 letters of the alphabet are used in collection codes, despite appearing on the TVM 'keyboard'? J and K seem to come up frequently when I collect tickets.

You can use TVMs to buy tickets as well as collect so it is quite useful to have all letters available when trying to type the name of a station. There must be a station for each letter somewhere.

 

[jon0844]

I don't think anyone was suggesting removing the letters from the keyboard.

Another cool idea would be to have NFC readers on TVMs. Then you could tap your phone against the machine to send the code and have your tickets printed out without having to worry about doing anything on the touchscreen (besides possibly entering a PIN or selecting the tickets you want to print right now).

Many phones sold this year (bar the iPhone) have NFC and next year I'd expect all smartphones beside the very cheapest entry-level models, to have it. In 2-3 years, it will likely be everything.

TVMs with Oyster readers would presumably need very little upgrade work; they have the hardware in them already and would just need the software.

 

[34D]

You can use TVMs to buy tickets as well as collect so it is quite useful to have all letters available when trying to type the name of a station. There must be a station for each letter somewhere.

Zebra Central?

 

[Oswyntail]

Do Atos have many competent persons working for them?

The real trouble is that none of their competitors are any better. Outsourcing and service industries have a slightly lower concept of quality than Poundland.

 

[Eagle]

I don't think anyone was suggesting removing the letters from the keyboard.

Although someone should tell SWT to use a QWERTY keyboard on theirs, not an alphabet one which just confuses the hell out of me.

 

[SickyNicky]

Although someone should tell SWT to use a QWERTY keyboard on theirs, not an alphabet one which just confuses the hell out of me.

Oh, yes please. I collect tickets almost daily and the ATW machines are a real pain - it slows the queue down immensely since everyone is used to QWERTY and has to search the ABCDEF order for each character.

 

[Roverman]

Barclays still use an ABC keyboard at the counter!

 

[hairyhandedfool]

You can use TVMs to buy tickets as well as collect so it is quite useful to have all letters available when trying to type the name of a station. There must be a station for each letter somewhere.

Not as the first letter, but there are stations with the more obscure ones very early in the spelling. The more obscure letters, imo, would be Q (Queenstown Road), J (Jewellery Quarter), V (Valley), X (Oxford), Y (Yeovil) and Z (Fazakerley).

 

[route:oxford]

Personally, for speed, I prefer a DVORAK keyboard. It does seem to cause colleagues a great deal of distress if I forget to switch back when I'm finished with a PC though.

 

[Roverman]

Not as the first letter, but there are stations with the more obscure ones very early in the spelling. The more obscure letters, imo, would be Q (Queenstown Road), J (Jewellery Quarter), V (Valley), X (Oxford), Y (Yeovil) and Z (Fazakerley).

What would be good is if they implemented the same 'intelligent' system they have on the NR website where it tries to guess your station as you type it in.

 

[34D]

Personally, for speed, I prefer a DVORAK keyboard. It does seem to cause colleagues a great deal of distress if I forget to switch back when I'm finished with a PC though.

A what?

 

[Eagle]

A Dvorak keyboard.

Research suggests it's actually no faster than a QWERTY keyboard, and it's just a case of what you're used to.

 

[ainsworth74]

A what?

One of these

 

[Welshman]

A what?

I thought it was something to do with the Concerto for Piano and Orchestra by a certain Czech composer. Hey ho!