Crewe to Derby line skeleton services.

[OuterDistant]

Stone me - just seen the Derby-bound service pull into Stoke, and it's an EMT 156!

 

[tbtc]

Another thing that shows their not bothered is that they send a 158 to SWT or FGW during the Olympics and covered for it by short forming their own services

Same happened with most bus companies in the UK - it's not a vendetta

So these bus company's covered double deckers with solos did they

There are plenty examples of low floor double deckers being replaced by either smaller buses or by inaccesible older double deckers, yes. And then other routes seeing single deckers replaced by minibuses (as everything was moved around). All round the country, not just one bus company either. Life went on.

SWT needed DMUs for the Olympics - EMT loaned one 158. Not the end of the world.

 

[martinsh]

Stone me - just seen the Derby-bound service pull into Stoke, and it's an EMT 156!

Someone at EMT must have been reading this thread !

Incidentally the 1740 ex Derby is usually a 158

 

[Coolguy22468]

Someone at EMT must have been reading this thread !

Incidentally the 1740 ex Derby is usually a 158

You might be right there was a 156 on the line yesterday, will EMT keep this up until friday?

 

[MCR247]

Someone at EMT must have been reading this thread !

Some working for EMT has posted in this thread

 

[Kneedown]

Incidentally the 1740 ex Derby is usually a 158

Yep, that one's booked a 158. Three units provide the service through the day. Two 153's and a 158.
--- old post above --- --- new post below ---

Some working for EMT has posted in this thread

 

[Lewisham2221]

Quite why this diesel operated service still continues under the wires between Stoke and Crewe - ?
*snip*
Derby to Stoke, at least once an hour each way, calling all stations, would be simple to operate even if it denies some passengers a through journey to fewer places.

But connections ar Crewe is surely one of the main reasons why it terminates there. Stoke to Crewe is hardly a massive distance "under the wires". I suppose every diesel operated service should terminate at the first electrified station it serves? Besides, Stoke is hardly the most practical place to terminate anything from the South/East as you've got to mess around shunting in and out of the station to/from sidings or block a platform for the turn around. I can't really see that Derby-Stoke would be any simpler to operate than Derby-Crewe.

Why are so many people on this forum seemingly obsessed with suggesting fairly pointless extensions/rerouting/changes to service patterns etc? The vast majority seem to have little or no benefit to all but a few people. Extending this service beyond Crewe might seem like a good idea, given that lots of passengers make connections at Crewe, but where do you extend too? Shrewsbury/mid-Wales? Chester/North Wales? Liverpool? Manchester Airport? Somewhere on the WCML? It has to terminate somewhere so leave it at Crewe. It's a managable length, practical for interchange and doesn't interfere much, if at all, with other movements through the station and surrounding area. If it were to be extended, the logical extension in my eyes would be at the other end, to Nottingham, as the connections at Derby seem fairly poor these days. Of course, if the connections were improved slightly then extending the service wouldn't be necessary.

The main problems with the line, for me, are the rolling stock and timetable. The 153's aren't far short of horrendous in terms of comfort, performance and capacity. Yes, every journey may not be full and standing (more than once in CT days I had a carriage all to myself, on a 3 car 170) but there are quite clearly issues which need addressing. Timetable wise, the service simply ends too early and, on Sundays, starts far too late in the day.

 

[Robert Taggart]

Why are so many people on this forum seemingly obsessed with suggesting fairly pointless extensions/rerouting/changes to service patterns etc? The vast majority seem to have little or no benefit to all but a few people. Extending this service beyond Crewe might seem like a good idea, given that lots of passengers make connections at Crewe, but where do you extend too? Shrewsbury/mid-Wales? Chester/North Wales? Liverpool? Manchester Airport? Somewhere on the WCML?

Suggesting costs nothing !

Just a suggestion !... extend the service to Llandudno - calling at the other North Wales coast 'resorts' on the way.
Why ? Because these remain the first choice for a day at the seaside for the majority of Potteries people.

 

[D6975]

Suggesting costs nothing !

Just a suggestion !... extend the service to Llandudno - calling at the other North Wales coast 'resorts' on the way.
Why ? Because these remain the first choice for a day at the seaside for the majority of Potteries people.

I remember travelling along this line behind pairs of 20s on long rakes of Mk1s on Summer Saturdays and they were very well loaded.
One of them used to run empty from Derby and formed a Blythe Bridge - Lludo IIRC.

 

[calc7]

Suggesting costs nothing !

Just a suggestion !... extend the service to Llandudno - calling at the other North Wales coast 'resorts' on the way.
Why ? Because these remain the first choice for a day at the seaside for the majority of Potteries people.

Unfortunately any suggestion which has no business market is unlikely to take off. The "cheap and cheerful" seasonal seaside jaunt will not sustain these extensions.

 

[Lewisham2221]

Suggesting costs nothing !

Just a suggestion !... extend the service to Llandudno - calling at the other North Wales coast 'resorts' on the way.
Why ? Because these remain the first choice for a day at the seaside for the majority of Potteries people.

Always preferred Blackpool myself...

Indeed, suggestions cost nothing, but I can't see enough people travelling from Longton to Rhyl on a Wednesday in February to support the service - which does cost something.

 

[Eagle]

Just a suggestion !... extend the service to Llandudno - calling at the other North Wales coast 'resorts' on the way.

Wouldn't work; you'd basically block the entire WCML by crossing over it from the Stoke line to the Chester line.

 

[Robert Taggart]

Wouldn't work; you'd basically block the entire WCML by crossing over it from the Stoke line to the Chester line.

Perhaps, but, the 'Water Closet' Main Line is not the be all and end of railway travel, anyway, at probably just two trains an hour - one each way + the same for Manchester <> Cardiff - methinks it be not beyond the wit of train planners ?

 

[dk1]

Wouldn't work; you'd basically block the entire WCML by crossing over it from the Stoke line to the Chester line.

I was thinking exactly the same. Would be too much of a performance risk.

 

[Xenophon PCDGS]

But connection at Crewe is surely one of the main reasons why it terminates there. Stoke to Crewe is hardly a massive distance "under the wires". I suppose every diesel operated service should terminate at the first electrified station it serves? Besides, Stoke is hardly the most practical place to terminate anything from the South/East as you've got to mess around shunting in and out of the station to/from sidings or block a platform for the turn around.

I must confess to be in total agreement with you, as surely the matter of available platform capacity and onward destination availability from Crewe far outweighs anything that Stoke-on-Trent is ever likely to offer.

 

[43074]

My strategy for the Derby to Crewe line:
Electrify the route so that Northern Class 323s which operate to Crewe could be used on the services. Electrification would benefit freight from the East Mids and Anglia too and its already electrified between Crewe and Stoke, and will be in Derby in the near future. Extend to Manchester Airport (and on to Picadilly) and/or Nottingham, plus transfer the route to Northern (who run to Nottingham, and one train per day through Derby anyway), and ridership will boom - it declined after the services didn't go to Nottingham or Manchester Airport.

 

[Coolguy22468]

My strategy for the Derby to Crewe line:
Electrify the route so that Northern Class 323s which operate to Crewe could be used on the services. Electrification would benefit freight from the East Mids and Anglia too and its already electrified between Crewe and Stoke, and will be in Derby in the near future. Extend to Manchester Airport (and on to Picadilly) and/or Nottingham, plus transfer the route to Northern (who run to Nottingham, and one train per day through Derby anyway), and ridership will boom - it declined after the services didn't go to Nottingham or Manchester Airport.

It would make sense but the problem is Network Rail aren't interested in the improvements of a small Midlands branch line when there is the mainlines which generate them more money.

 

[OuterDistant]

I remember travelling along this line behind pairs of 20s on long rakes of Mk1s on Summer Saturdays and they were very well loaded.
One of them used to run empty from Derby and formed a Blythe Bridge - Lludo IIRC.

Me too! A heck of a lot of Potteries folk still migrate their every summer (including me), but nearly all of them do it by road - which takes a couple of hours. I can't remember how long the train journey took.

 

[tbtc]

Me too! A heck of a lot of Potteries folk still migrate their every summer (including me), but nearly all of them do it by road - which takes a couple of hours. I can't remember how long the train journey took.

Sadly a number of places have lost their link to the seaside town that their population used to flock to (Bradford to Morcambe etc).

The politics involved in the Wales & Borders franchise is a whole other story!

 

[6Gman]

Me too! A heck of a lot of Potteries folk still migrate their every summer (including me), but nearly all of them do it by road - which takes a couple of hours. I can't remember how long the train journey took.

A couple of hours!

 

[sprinterguy]

My strategy for the Derby to Crewe line:
Electrify the route so that Northern Class 323s which operate to Crewe could be used on the services. Electrification would benefit freight from the East Mids and Anglia too and its already electrified between Crewe and Stoke, and will be in Derby in the near future. Extend to Manchester Airport (and on to Picadilly) and/or Nottingham, plus transfer the route to Northern (who run to Nottingham, and one train per day through Derby anyway), and ridership will boom - it declined after the services didn't go to Nottingham or Manchester Airport.

Unfortunately wheeling out that most oft quoted of lines of argument on this forum, but it would only be possible for any of this to happen if Northern were to gain extra 323s, or at the very least, electric units of some type for use elsewhere in Manchester to replace the existing 323s. Northern are short of electric units in the Manchester area at present to start with without adding additional or extended services.

Plus Northern still only have a minimal staff presence on this route, and no local rolling stock depot, when compared to EMT who are the dominant operator in the area.

 

[OuterDistant]

A couple of hours!

Oh yeah, we do go in low season!

In all seriousness, the road improvements at Ewloe(?) mean that we can go all the way from J15 of the M6 to Llandudno Junction without stopping. I've also done Valley level crossing to J15 non stop, too!

 

[Xenophon PCDGS]

Northern are short of electric units in the Manchester area at present to start with without adding additional or extended services.

A statement that we who suffer daily from such such deficiancies are only too aware and are in no need of such reminders.....:roll:

 

[sd0733]

A Meridian is currently booked for 1K23 17:42 Derby to Crewe and 1K26 19:07 return service on Sat 5th Jan.
Hopefully a sign of things to come for busy days if succesful

 

[MCR247]

hock:

 

[MidnightFlyer]

There's nothing on at Uttoxeter either. The only thing I could suggest it is for is getting Tranmere Rovers (based in Birkenhead) fans back to Merseyside after their FA Cup tie at Derby County - of course Pride Park is only a few mins from Derby station, and I highly doubt a 153 / 156 / 158 would be able to cope with numbers.

 

[MCR247]

Ugh Derby County

 

[Morgsie]

Something that has not been mentioned is that services are late

 

[merlodlliw]

Oh yeah, we do go in low season!

In all seriousness, the road improvements at Ewloe(?) mean that we can go all the way from J15 of the M6 to Llandudno Junction without stopping. I've also done Valley level crossing to J15 non stop, too!

The North Wales express way is, I am sorry to say a shambles, with daily queues in low season, your comment M6/M56 to Junction non stop is possible,but only in the night now.
--- old post above --- --- new post below ---

Suggesting costs nothing !

Just a suggestion !... extend the service to Llandudno - calling at the other North Wales coast 'resorts' on the way.
Why ? Because these remain the first choice for a day at the seaside for the majority of Potteries people.

I recall a direct daily service,Derby to Llandudno when the DMUs started, one was called the" Dragon Rapide" it arrived in Rhyl at about 1130a.m. then returned via Rhyl at 2.25p.m,. The service was later extended to Scarborough.
This used to be an 8 car DMU.
--- old post above --- --- new post below ---

Sadly a number of places have lost their link to the seaside town that their population used to flock to (Bradford to Morcambe etc).

The politics involved in the Wales & Borders franchise is a whole other story!

Ah yes Politics, now WG want to buy Rhoose "Failed" airport for the nation, as those in the South prefer Bristol Perhaps "Gerald" will be extended to Rhoose
so that we in the North may be tempted away from Manchester & Liverpool airports

 

[ATW Alex 101]

A Meridian is currently booked for 1K23 17:42 Derby to Crewe and 1K26 19:07 return service on Sat 5th Jan.
Hopefully a sign of things to come for busy days if succesful

Is this confirmed as I wouldn't mind seeing it