US Presidential Election

[Butts]

Does Obama deserve another term of office ?

Has he been a great let down ???

"Yes we can" has this metamorphised into "No we can't"

I'm thinking into particular about his pre-election claims about Guantanamo Bay etc......

He has turned out to be another let down for the electorate, and does Romney deserve a chance ?

 

[SS4]

Allow me to quote Senator Romney

[They] will vote for the president no matter what. All right, there are 47% who are with him, who are dependent upon government, who believe that they are victims, who believe the government has a responsibility to care for them, who believe that they are entitled to healthcare, to food, to housing, to you-name-it. That that's an entitlement. And the government should give it to them. And they will vote for this president no matter what … These are people who pay no income tax …

"[M]y job is is not to worry about those people. I'll never convince them they should take personal responsibility and care for their lives."

Quoted from the Guardian here: http://www.guardian.co.uk/commentisfree/2012/sep/18/mitt-romney-47-unsuitable-president

Of course those 47% of Americans are the poorest in society


edit: That's not to say Obama hasn't done a spectacular job in his two years in office (I discount the latter two because a Republican majority in Congress have blocked pretty much everything Obama has tried solely because Obama is a democrat) but he's still a better choice than Romney!

 

[Butts]

Allow me to quote Senator Romney



Quoted from the Guardian here: http://www.guardian.co.uk/commentisfree/2012/sep/18/mitt-romney-47-unsuitable-president

Of course those 47% of Americans are the poorest in society

And probably don't watch the TV Debates where Romney whipped Obama

 

[SS4]

Here are some more quotes from Mr Romney:
http://politicalhumor.about.com/od/mittromney/a/Mitt-Romney-Quotes.htm

I know it may appear I've been overly harsh and hardly touched upon Obama's record but sadly despising Romney and his party is a valid reason to vote Obama in a two party State.

I'd be interested to see what Americans think of the race though, although their voting system suffers the same flaws as ours insofar that only a few States decide the entire election (Alabama for example will always be redder than a smacked arse)
--- old post above --- --- new post below ---

And probably don't watch the TV Debates where Romney whipped Obama

What do you expect from a Mor(m)on? They're salesmen and are always style over substance.

 

[Ferret]

And probably don't watch the TV Debates where Romney whipped Obama

Why did Obama not use '47%-gate' in the TV debate?! This election has always been too close to call, and Obama doesn't seem that fussed whether he wins or loses? Where is the passion he showed 4 years ago?!

It's been said that Obama could make lots more money as an ex-President. Perhaps that's an overly cynical viewpoint, perhaps not.......

 

[Oswyntail]

Neither sided seems to have the least idea about what to do with a terminally stalled economy (this in common with most of the world). What is needed is a new analysis, but, instead, we are doomed to bouncing between two failed scenarios. Perhaps, like the secret of good parenting, the slogan should be "No, you can't"

 

[Ferret]

Neither sided seems to have the least idea about what to do with a terminally stalled economy (this in common with most of the world). What is needed is a new analysis, but, instead, we are doomed to bouncing between two failed scenarios. Perhaps, like the secret of good parenting, the slogan should be "No, you can't"

Can't disagree with this - both left and right have been responsible for screwing the pooch in this country, and now neither can come up with a convincing plan to sort out the problems they created. America seems to be just the same.

 

[SS4]

Neither sided seems to have the least idea about what to do with a terminally stalled economy (this in common with most of the world). What is needed is a new analysis, but, instead, we are doomed to bouncing between two failed scenarios. Perhaps, like the secret of good parenting, the slogan should be "No, you can't"

Agreed. Both sides have been screwing with the average citizen and is set to get worse in the US because there is real hatred between parties that is thankfully largely absent here

 

[ainsworth74]

I don't know if anyone here uses reddit, but if they do they'll probably understand why I'd quite like Romney to win just to see the reaction on that website

On a more serious note, I'm not particularly convinced by Obama but he's far better than the alternative, so hopefully the US public will return him for a second term. I know we moan about our political system being broken but, compared to the US, it's in top condition...

 

[Johnuk123]

What I object to is how it is put on the news here as if anybody is really interested.

Every presidential Election is the same we have it rammed down our throats but if you asked anybody 99% would say it's boring and of little interest.

My wife's American and she can't understand why it gets so much coverage.

 

[chris89]

I don't know if anyone here uses reddit, but if they do they'll probably understand why I'd quite like Romney to win just to see the reaction on that website

On a more serious note, I'm not particularly convinced by Obama but he's far better than the alternative, so hopefully the US public will return him for a second term. I know we moan about our political system being broken but, compared to the US, it's in top condition...

I am a redditor and it is quite comical really there reactions.

I would prefer Obama to have another term as Romney seems not to be all there (IMO) Especially after his Plane Window gaff :P

Who ever the USA gets will most likely do them over sadly and for both Parties a Social Healthcare is needed no matter what.

But seeing how many times the Republicans have blocked or tried to stall Medicare is less then hopeful.

Chris

 

[Ferret]

What I object to is how it is put on the news here as if anybody is really interested.

Every presidential Election is the same we have it rammed down our throats but if you asked anybody 99% would say it's boring and of little interest.

My wife's American and she can't understand why it gets so much coverage.

I'm interested because I spend time in the US, and because I have a few mates who live there, one who I count as a great mate, despite him living in Richmond, VA.

The reality is, that with America being a superpower, it does have relevance to our lives in the UK. Remember - the credit crunch started in the US, then spread to the UK once the powers that be realised that our economic model was oh so similar to the American version. American life has relevance to UK life, whether we like it or not, and for that reason, it will be covered by the UK press.

 

[Johnuk123]

I'm interested because I spend time in the US, and because I have a few mates who live there, one who I count as a great mate, despite him living in Richmond, VA.

The reality is, that with America being a superpower, it does have relevance to our lives in the UK. Remember - the credit crunch started in the US, then spread to the UK once the powers that be realised that our economic model was oh so similar to the American version. American life has relevance to UK life, whether we like it or not, and for that reason, it will be covered by the UK press.

I accept all that and I anticipated someone would give that reason but with all the problems we have I still think it's over done.

 

[Ivo]

I might normally be a right-winger but in the case of the US it's different.

They needed a fresh start as far as the Presidency went, and ideally a line against the former racist stance of the country (although I have often seen it suggested that the US needs a Native President, not a black President, to wipe that out for good), but - as SS4 states above - the Republican majority have made it difficult for Obama to do his job. It's not so much "No we can't" as it is "No I'm not permitted to". The Health Bill was a definite plus - will we get such initiative from the Republicans? Somehow, I doubt it.

Obama winning was good for everyone - not just the US, but the world. If he loses and Romney isn't a massive improvement on Obama - whose struggles have largely been due to the opposition, including some related to the idiot['s junior?] before him - then it will show what a farce the US system is. Here, FPTP works*. Over there, I'm not sure, given the relatively low number of swing states (most of which are lesser states from the electorate perspective anyway) - there are more red states than blue states, but the majority of the higher-value coastal states are blue.

The only other thing I would say is that if Obama loses, will the US elect a non-whtie candidate again? If any other non-white candidates should lose, will the age-old racial criticisms of the US resurface?

In short, if I was an American, I would vote Obama and thus Democrat. Not so much because I think he's done a good job, or even because he's black, but more because he has a lot of potential as he showed early on before the Republicans on Capitol Hill strangled him.

*Minimal apologies offered with a somewhat sarcastic tone to the pro-AV lot on here.

 

[Ferret]

I accept all that and I anticipated someone would give that reason but with all the problems we have I still think it's over done.

Fair enough! In fairness, I was over there in the run up to our last election, and they did provide some coverage of it on the small amount of TV I watched. I suppose we do have the option of ignoring that which doesn't interest us!

 

[Xenophon PCDGS]

The problem with the Republican Party is that politicians with the lack of required calibre and possession of doubtful integrity, such as that of Dick Cheney, can rise to great positions of power...vice-President in his case.

For those rather younger members of the forum, a little research into the political machinations of the Republican Senator Barry Goldwater and of the views espoused by him whilst wishing to obtain the highest office in America, in the world situation that was prevailing at that time, are indeed most revealing.

With regard to Mitt Romney, the fact that he espouses the Morman faith will most certainly count against him in the same way that the colour of Barack Obama will still count against him, by large swathes of the American voting public. Entrenched views unfortunately remain for generation after generation in America.

 

[Ivo]

With regard to Mitt Romney, the fact that he espouses the Morman faith will most certainly count against him in the same way that the colour of Barack Obama will still count against him, by large swathes of the American voting public. Entrenched views unfortunately remain for generation after generation in America.

The difference being that at least he is theoretically capable of doing something about it, whereas Obama realistically can't. I'm not suggesting Romney does such a thing for one moment; this is merely a matter of perspective.

 

[Temple Meads]

As a pretty dyed-in-the-wool left winger (sorry Ivo :P ), I naturally lean towards the Democrats, and when the republican candidate is as slippery and out of touch as Romney, there is really only one way my support can go, so yes Obama FTW :P

 

[Butts]

Perhaps it's time to give Ross Perot a shot - he can't be much worse than the other two "clowns" in this contest

 

[Xenophon PCDGS]

The difference being that at least he is theoretically capable of doing something about it, whereas Obama realistically can't. I'm not suggesting Romney does such a thing for one moment; this is merely a matter of perspective.

I cannot see him making an example of revoking his Morman beliefs just for the sake of political expediency, as if this were to happen, it would be seized upon by those who would claim if he were to be fluid in his belief with regard to that matter, he would also be assumed to be also ready to change his stance on numerous Republican rocks of political belief that he currently espouses.

 

[SS4]

I cannot see him making an example of revoking his Morman beliefs just for the sake of political expediency, as if this were to happen, it would be seized upon by those who would claim if he were to be fluid in his belief with regard to that matter, he would also be assumed to be also ready to change his stance on numerous Republican rocks of political belief that he currently espouses.

Too late unless he flip flops by dressing it up as State autonomy. Reading his record as governor would make you think he's a democrat.

 

[12CSVT]

One of Obama's main objectives while in power was to bring healthcare provision into the 21st century. The reason why he found it almost impossible to succeed was because the Republicans (no doubt influenced by vested interests) threw every obstacle in the way.

 

[yorksrob]

I don't consider it my place to comment on another democratic nation's politics, however:

If a leader of a political party over here had been caught on tape writing off almost half of the population as not worth bothering with (for not paying income tax - not tax in general you understand - they would of course have been paying plenty of other taxes), it's hard to see how they could ever be taken seriously at all.

 

[SS4]

I don't consider it my place to comment on another democratic nation's politics, however:

If a leader of a political party over here had been caught on tape writing off almost half of the population as not worth bothering with (for not paying income tax - not tax in general you understand - they would of course have been paying plenty of other taxes), it's hard to see how they could ever be taken seriously at all.

Romney could call all Californians potheads who do nothing but smoke and drink and because CA is staunchly democrat he is no worse position than previously

 

[yorksrob]

Romney could call all Californians potheads who do nothing but smoke and drink and because CA is staunchly democrat he is no worse position than previously

Are all these supposed non-tax payers all Californian democrats though ? (One wonders whether a proportion of working class Republicans are caught up in this demographic).

 

[SS4]

Are all these supposed non-tax payers all Californian democrats though ? (One wonders whether a proportion of working class Republicans are caught up in this demographic).

There are some tables here although they're a couple of years out of date now.

It's my understanding (although I can't find proof with a cursory search so take the customary pinch of salt) that Republican states have more people on welfare than Democrat states. Typically though these people live smack in the bible belt and will vote Republican because of their religious beliefs. IMO if the Republican Party hadn't hijacked Christianity for their purposes it'd essentially be a permanent democrat government.

 

[Ivo]

IMO if the Republican Party hadn't hijacked Christianity for their purposes it'd essentially be a permanent democrat government.

Just another reason to vote Democrat then :roll:

 

[ainsworth74]

IMO if the Republican Party hadn't hijacked Christianity for their purposes it'd essentially be a permanent democrat government.

Huh I've always had it as the Christian right hijacking the Republican Party not the other way around.

 

[yorksrob]

There are some tables here although they're a couple of years out of date now.

It's my understanding (although I can't find proof with a cursory search so take the customary pinch of salt) that Republican states have more people on welfare than Democrat states. Typically though these people live smack in the bible belt and will vote Republican because of their religious beliefs. IMO if the Republican Party hadn't hijacked Christianity for their purposes it'd essentially be a permanent democrat government.

Sounds pretty plausable to me. That said, we can't say much, what with our own electoral system.

 

[SS4]

Huh I've always had it as the Christian right hijacking the Republican Party not the other way around.

Could be a mutually beneficial one?