Planning an ALR - Where to go?

[1D53]

Welcome to the start of the JsT 2007 All-Line Rover.

The big question is where to go?

I'm gonna try and do as much as possibly obviously with some time for photos. The plan is to try and 2 days in each section on the map returning to base every two days. The lines aren't fixed obviously! I plan to finish in Scotland on the 7th day with a sleeper run back to London, hopefully getting a cheap advance ticket back to Leeds as my rover will be finished. I hope to do this at the end of July all being well.

The big Q is, where to go? I'm sure I could plan my own crazy route and travel on some new stock and see some good lines and amazing landscapes, but it would be good if you can try and recommend some must do lines etc. I leave it open to you!

What I'd like to do:
Heart of Wales
Thurso/Wick/Oban etc.
Most mainlines.

 

[Donny Dave]

I've actually thought about this myself. My plan was someting like

Day 1 - Scunthorpe - Wick/Thurso via Aberdeen. (HST from either Doncaster or York to Aberdeen)

Day 2 - Thurso/Wick - Inverness - Kyle, then bus or ferry to Mallaig

Day 3 - Mallaig - Glasgow QS, walk to Central, Glasgow Central - Euston. Pay a supplement to use the Riviera sleeper to Penzance

Day 4 - Explore lines in Devon and Cornwall

Day 5 - Finish in Devon and Cornwall then go to Bristol. From Bristol to Weymouth. Start exploring the Southern [1]

Day 6 - Explore the Southern

Day 7 - Finish exploring Southern, then make my way to London. London - Doncaster, then back home to Scunthorpe

That is/was my plan, but it will probably never happen.

 

[theblackwatch]

It's been a long time since I did an All-Line (my last was in 1997, just before my YP blew up for the last time) - back in those days I used to combine some loco bashing with doing track in the same area as well. For example, one time after the Holyhead overnight (a 37/4!), it was over to East Anglia via London for the 37 on Norwich-Yarmouth trains, followed by a trip to Clacton to cover some new track (and a visit to the pier for an ice cream!). Obviously the railway has changed a lot since then, but I would still think it is possible to combine some 'traditional' trains (ie Sleepers/HSTs) with track, modern trains and photting. I too used to return home every 2 or 3 days for a good brush up and restock of food and drinks - if I was out 2 nights, I would have one 'on the cushions', but get a sleeping berth the second night.

Personally I wouldn't worry about doing most 'main lines', unless it's a way of getting from A to B - if you want to cover them, you'd be much better just buying cheap advance tickets. I'd go for lines which are a bit harder to cover. One thing you haven't done on your map is marked which lines you have done already. If you've not been to beyond Dawlish before, the run in Cornwall is nice, and the Cornish branches are interesting too, and if you went down on the Saturday (doing the Sleeper down from Paddington on Friday evening - perhaps after doing the Heart of Wales, then across from Swansea to Padd), you could probably go to cover a couple of the branches and go to Newquay on an HST, then get home that night too.

Personally I wouldn't want to do Oban or Wick/Thurso on a unit, but that's just me! In fact, I never did Oban right until 2003, and then I ended up there on 2 consecutive months, once behind 37s, and then behind Deltics.

If you give an idea of what track you need, I can probably come up with more ideas based partly on my exploits from years ago.

 

[1D53]

I too used to return home every 2 or 3 days for a good brush up and restock of food and drinks - if I was out 2 nights, I would have one 'on the cushions', but get a sleeping berth the second night.

Thats my reasoning behind it, stock up, charge batteries, clean up etc. Good to see its a proven strategy

Personally I wouldn't worry about doing most 'main lines', unless it's a way of getting from A to B .

That would be the main plan I think, plus to say I've done them.

Latest coverage is at: http://www.railforums.co.uk/showpost.php?p=107555&postcount=128. The green line to Dawlish and Edinburgh are now done, as is Brum New St to Bouremouth via Banbury/Reading and the Lymington branch.

 

[theblackwatch]

Latest coverage is at: http://www.railforums.co.uk/showpost.php?p=107555&postcount=128. The green line to Dawlish and Edinburgh are now done, as is Brum New St to Bouremouth via Banbury/Reading and the Lymington branch.

There's definately a lot for you to go at there! I'd definately do Scotland and Cornwall, which would include trips on the Sleepers, enabling you to get in extra mileage/track in the 7 days. One trip which used to be possible (and may still be) was to go Euston to Fort William on the sleeper, then up to Mallaig, then a ferry/bus move to Kyle and in to Inverness for the early evening in order to pick up the Sleeper back south from there to London.

There are lots of other similar trips - one one all line, I did a day trip from Leeds to Pembroke Dock and Milford Haven, getting in both branches, with a taxi between the two destinations. Think I caught the 06.05 ex Leeds and was back around midnight.

 

[Coxster]

There's definately a lot for you to go at there! I'd definately do Scotland and Cornwall, which would include trips on the Sleepers, enabling you to get in extra mileage/track in the 7 days. One trip which used to be possible (and may still be) was to go Euston to Fort William on the sleeper, then up to Mallaig, then a ferry/bus move to Kyle and in to Inverness for the early evening in order to pick up the Sleeper back south from there to London.

There was also a trip that we did a while back London-Aberdeen-Inverness-Kyle-Bus&Ferry-Mallaig-Fort Bill. That includes more milage and covers both Forth and Tay bridges, although admittedly the former is not done during daylight hours. Like you say it would be quite "something" to do a return trip to Wick/Thurso on a unit, which is why I'm making the most of a ticket on the SRPS 40+55 tour I've been offered - looking forward to that!

 

[1D53]

This is probably what day two will look like ;s

Day 1 is Leeds - Aberdeen - Glasgow - London then on the beds down to St Erth


0800 First Great West St Erth St Ives 0811
0818 First Great West St Ives Penzance 0839
0845 First Great West Penzance Truro 0925
0945 First Great West Truro Falmouth D. 1008
1011 First Great West Falmouth D. Truro 1035
1042 First Great West Truro Par 1106
1124 First Great West Par Newquay 1214
1242 First Great West Newquay Par 1330
1344 First Great West Par Liskeard 1409
1515 First Great West Liskeard Looe 1543
1549 First Great West Looe Liskeard 1615
1620 First Great West Liskeard Plymouth 1655
1700 First Great West Plymouth Exeter St. Davids 1800
1818 First Great West Exeter St Davids Exmouth 1818
1820 First Great West Exmouth Exeter Central 1847
1914 South West Trains Exeter Central Clapham Junc 2248
2259 Southern Clapham Junc East Croydon 2309
Travellodge Overnight Croydon Central £29

 

[theblackwatch]

Sorry to say it JsT, but I think a good chunk of your first day is a bit of a waste - you go all the way up to Aberdeen and come back via the same route, leaving it necessary to go there again in order to cover the line 'across the top' to Inverness. A trip like Coxster did going up to Aberdeen/Inverness/Kyle/Mallaig/Fort William then back would be much more advantageous to you IMO assuming the train/bus/ferry times are the same - I hadn't realised that was possible.

 

[1D53]

Sorry to say it JsT, but I think a good chunk of your first day is a bit of a waste - you go all the way up to Aberdeen and come back via the same route

I've always hoped to be able to do the 0710 Leeds - Aberdeen run which is the main reason it is there at the moment, before back to Glasgow and down to Euston. Obviously if I can put the 0710 in for another day I shall but I'm happy with it at the moment.

 

[Coxster]

A trip like Coxster did going up to Aberdeen/Inverness/Kyle/Mallaig/Fort William then back would be much more advantageous to you IMO assuming the train/bus/ferry times are the same - I hadn't realised that was possible.

Having looked at the timetables it is no longer possible, with onward trains departing before your train arrives. It was done by a few of us almost two years back now which might explain it I suppose.

 

[theblackwatch]

I've always hoped to be able to do the 0710 Leeds - Aberdeen run which is the main reason it is there at the moment, before back to Glasgow and down to Euston. Obviously if I can put the 0710 in for another day I shall but I'm happy with it at the moment.

The run up to Aberdeen on the HST is a nice one, I’ve done it several times as a day trip out and back from York. As an alternative to coming back to Glasgow, have you considered going across to Inverness then catching the Sleeper back down from there? In July, you would get a fair chunk of the Highland Main Line in daylight, and a visit to the Lounge Car for traditional Haggis, Neeps and Tatties (at a very reasonable price- think it was about £4 last year) is a pleasant way to spend an evening!

Another trip which I think would be feasible to do one of the lines you said you want to cover would be to set off early in the morning to travel the Heart of Wales line, although it would require an 06.15 start from Huddersfield. The 09.05 ex Shrewsbury gets you to Llaneli for 12.30 or Swansea for 13.02, which would give you time to do some things in South Wales before heading across to London for one of the Sleepers. (This may tie in better with the Penzance sleeper, as you wouldn’t have to bother with any cross-London trip.)

I’ve dropped you a PM as well.

 

[compsci]

I'm considering doing a week in Scotland at some point in the summer. One thing that I have noticed is the almost ridiculously subsidised fares on the rural lines. INV - WCK is £12.10 open return with YP for example. This might make it cheaper to buy individual tickets or Freedom of Scotland rather than "spend" days from an ALR, or it might not.

 

[devon_metro]

You can get a lot more out of Devon and Cornwall too. If you do the first trains to Barnstaple, then to Exmouth, then Paignton, then off to Cornwall and get the up Beds from Penzance. Seems wasted going all the way to St Ives!

 

[theblackwatch]

You can get a lot more out of Devon and Cornwall too. If you do the first trains to Barnstaple, then to Exmouth, then Paignton, then off to Cornwall and get the up Beds from Penzance. Seems wasted going all the way to St Ives!

I think the problem here is that of time - if he did the Sleeper back north, he wouldn't be able to get the Exeter-Waterloo line in! Decisions decisions....
I would think it is probably impossible to do all the Devon & Cornwall branches in a day so something has to be left out - at least the ones being left here are those to the northern end, which means he doesn't have to trek all the way down to St Erth again just to get the St Ives branch in!

 

[devon_metro]

Fair enough, but i would get Gunnislake out of the way, it's a pig compared with every 30mins to Exmouth!

 

[Craig]

The suburban lines around Glasgow are worth a look, although it depends what you like. There's some quite nice scenery between Glasgow and Carlisle on the WCML too, so that's could be combined into one day. Arrive into Glasgow on a morning, spend the day doing the local lines then take an evening WCML service south and make your way back to Leeds.

I wouldn't worry if you can't fit it into this trip though, it can easily be done in a day from Leeds with a couple of advance purchase tickets and a day tripper or whatever it's called.

 

[theblackwatch]

Fair enough, but i would get Gunnislake out of the way, it's a pig compared with every 20mins to Exmouth!

Yes Gunnislake is probably the hardest to do - last time (in fact the only time)I went there was way back in 1989. I would maybe drop Newquay in favour of Gunnislake if that fits, as Newquay could be done much easier on a through HST in the summer from either Newcastle, Manchester or Paddington.

 

[theblackwatch]

The suburban lines around Glasgow are worth a look, although it depends what you like.

I've had a couple of 'interesting' experiences on all-lines around Glasgow. Returning from Gourock, my unit hit something which had been put on the track, damaging the brakes which left us stranded for an hour or so. Then (another time), on the Cathcart Cirle, a brick came through the window of the Class 303 at the bay of seats in front of mine. Good job nobody was sat there at the time.

Not trying to put anyone off Glasgow of course.... As Craig says, a cheap advance ticket to Glasgow, and a Daytripper (£4.50) or Roundabout (£8.50) offers excellent value.

 

[yorkie]

Not trying to put anyone off Glasgow of course.... As Craig says, a cheap advance ticket to Glasgow, and a Daytripper (£4.50) or Roundabout (£8.50) offers excellent value.

Indeed. I couldn't justify it on an ALR. Last year we got £19 BBs and cheap Daytrippers, so it was about £42 for 2 berths and all travel. On an ALR you'd be paying £72 just for the berth upgrades on top.

I doubt I'll ever do an ALR, because the best way is to get cheap advance purchase tickets combined with cheap rovers/rangers.

As for doing lines like Wick and Kyle, there's no way I'd pay £300 to do them on 158s when you can do them behind proper locos.

I think the only reason I'd use an ALR is if I wanted to do travel on the spur of the moment (if you have it planned, may as well go AP), and if I did a lot of peak time travel, and if I was able to sleep on seated sleeper (which I'm not), as virtually none of these apply I can't imagine getting one. It would also only have been justifiable for me up until last Summer when you still had some booked loco haulage. It sounds cheaper to go to Europe and get a rover there.

I'm considering doing a week in Scotland at some point in the summer. One thing that I have noticed is the almost ridiculously subsidised fares on the rural lines. INV - WCK is £12.10 open return with YP for example. This might make it cheaper to buy individual tickets or Freedom of Scotland rather than "spend" days from an ALR, or it might not.

Absolutely. If someone is purely interested in line bashing, the cheapest way (IMO) is to get advance purchase to the rover area, get a rover and then stay in cheap accomodation. Then move on to another area.

One day of an ALR is £53, yet a Highland Rover is £65 for 4 in 8 days! The ALR won't get you a sleeper berth and a Bargain Berth (which is inclusive of travel) can be cheaper than the upgrade on top of an ALR.

As for Inverness-Wick, roughly every 5 years there is an enthusiast railtour using a heritage locomotive, that's the way to do it IMO.

 

[Mintona]

I'm gonna do an ALR, probably not this year but next, and cross off all of the south.

 

[Tom]

Would be cheaper to get a combination of rovers then... like a FoSW then something else, etc.

 

[Mintona]

Possibly....though possibly not....

 

[Tom]

I wouldn't pay £200 just to cover the south...

 

[Mintona]

Nah, once I've finished that, I'll head North a bit. By the south, I mean about as far north as Manchester

 

[Tom]

That's north!!1oneelevenonehundredandelevenonethousandonehundredandeleven

 

[87015]

Then (another time), on the Cathcart Cirle, a brick came through the window of the Class 303 at the bay of seats in front of mine. Good job nobody was sat there at the time.

Never a rare occurance on local lines or the Eustons.... Still those 303s were good!
Anyone tried Dublin for bricking rates, makes your Cathcarts, Wishaws and Dumbartons seem sedate hock:

Never got an all-line myself, could never justify the ching against a mid or east mids or countless days on a 'daytripper' up Brum. Although i was looking for 'quality mileage' (obviously thats down to personal preference and interpretation ) rather than doing track.

Its all about preferences - do whatever you enjoy!

 

[devon_metro]

Would be cheaper to get a combination of rovers then... like a FoSW then something else, etc.

Which you can't use till after 0900...

 

[Craig]

I've had a couple of 'interesting' experiences on all-lines around Glasgow. Returning from Gourock, my unit hit something which had been put on the track, damaging the brakes which left us stranded for an hour or so. Then (another time), on the Cathcart Cirle, a brick came through the window of the Class 303 at the bay of seats in front of mine. Good job nobody was sat there at the time.

Yeah, Glasgow's a lovely area

 

[Mintona]

That's north!!1oneelevenonehundredandelevenonethousandonehundredandeleven

I'm sorry, what????

 

[1D53]

Day one is now Leeds - Man Picc - Crewe - Holyhead - Llandudno - Blenau Ffestinog - Ffestinog down to Porthmadog, back to BNS for the 19.00 to London (should it still be 90's). Maybe a quick trip out somewhere (Heathrow possibly?) to be back for the Sleeper to Penzance.