Diversionary routes that aren't used anymore

[50010 Monarch]

I wonder if FGW would use the diversionary route I took many years back on the night milker from Paddington to Penzance when I woke up much to my shock, stationary at Worcester SH? It appears we'd done Didcot-Oxford-Worcester and then went onto Hereford, Maindee North, Maindee East, Severn Tunnel to Bristol TM. Remember it was in a Mark 1, no loudspeaker announcements and all in the compartment asleep with the blinds down, not a care in the world as to where we were.

That is more of a night time railtour than a diversion.......!

 

[Welshman]

I doubt they do - neber heard of them going there and I doubt they sign via Bramley either.

I remember they did some years ago, and I read of someone who boarded at Bradford Interchange even though they were simply supposed to reverse there.

They also went via Bradford more recently when the River Calder flooded at Mirfield, making both the Dewsbury & Wakefield lines inaccessible.

But my whole point was they have not that option now, as TPE crews no longer sign Bradford Interchange, and if they don't sign Bradford Interchange they won't sign via Bramley either as you can't go through one without the other!!!

 

[Class 33]

One route I recall travelling over that cannot be done now (without a reversal) is that from Bath to Swindon via Bradford on Avon and Melksham.

I remember being on a London-Bristol train back in the late 1990's that had to take an unscheduled diversion after Chippenham via Melksham and Bradford-on-Avon, due to some problem on the mainline.

Also last year there were some interesting scheduled diversions in operation on one or two weekends, due to engineering work between Swindon and Didcot. Trains taking the alternate route via Newbury. Which isn't rare I know. But of particular interest were all the services between London and South Wales. In the westbound direction for example after Reading the services ran non-stop to Chippenham via Newbury, Trowbridge, and Melksham. Then onto Swindon, then reverse and the normal route to South Wales. Very interesting diversion. And whilst it may not be a scheduled diversion route that is no longer used, it does seem to be a very rare scheduled diversion route. First time I discovered these diversionary services were last year, and I've not seen them again since. Usually if the Reading-Swindon line has weekend engineering works, the South Wales services are just combined with the Bristol Temple Meads services.

 

[34D]

Out of interest, does anybody know if the Selby avoiding curve (connecting the former ECML from the south to the Selby-Leeds line to the west) has ever been used for diversions? I have never heard of any passenger trains using that route, they tend to go via Askern if the ECML is closed for work.

Presumably that ran directly between Temple Hirst and Hambleton, along the 1980s 'deviation'? That's quite a common diversionary route, and I'm sure things are booked that way. I think Max is referring to the south-to-west curve of the triangle at Selby itself, which I'm sure sees rather less use! Not sure who (on the passenger side at least) would have route knowledge that way.

Selby Canal Junction - Selby West Junction?

Indeed yes. The single line is referred to as the Canal Goods, so perhaps someone could check the Sectional Appendix to see whether it is actually passenger rated?

I would actually nominate this as one of the rarest pieces of tracks in Yorkshire, along with Engine Shed-Whitehall east in Leeds (the line from Woodlesford to Shipley or Bramley, NOT the curve to Copley Hill) and some of the greight connections in the Wakefield and Knottingley areas.

 

[kjhskj75]

Indeed yes. The single line is referred to as the Canal Goods, so perhaps someone could check the Sectional Appendix to see whether it is actually passenger rated?

It isn't.

(LN908 on p726)

 

[34D]

It isn't.

(LN908 on p726)

That's a shame. Thanks for checking.

 

[158747]

Back in 1975 I saw a 33/1 and 4TC passing Alderton, between Swindon and Bristol Parkway on a train from Portsmouth, either to Bristol Temple Meads or Cardiff Central that had been diverted via Reading.

 

[Crossover]

I remember they did some years ago, and I read of someone who boarded at Bradford Interchange even though they were simply supposed to reverse there.

They also went via Bradford more recently when the River Calder flooded at Mirfield, making both the Dewsbury & Wakefield lines inaccessible.

But my whole point was they have not that option now, as TPE crews no longer sign Bradford Interchange, and if they don't sign Bradford Interchange they won't sign via Bramley either as you can't go through one without the other!!!

The knowledge must have expired pretty recently then if TPE diverted that way recently (though I may be thinking revent as in when we had the huge amount of rain back in May/June, whereas you be thinking recent as in a few years ago!)

It isn't.

(LN908 on p726)

It may have been asked a few times before, but what makes a line available for passenger use?

Was a bit miffed to find that the line that Michael Portillo flew over a few years ago near Saltburn that goes along the cliff edge was freight only, for example

 

[sprinterguy]

Was a bit miffed to find that the line that Michael Portillo flew over a few years ago near Saltburn that goes along the cliff edge was freight only, for example

The Boulby branch does get the occasional railtour though if you really wanted to travel over it. And the cliff top walk from Saltburn alongside the line is easy enough.

 

[flymo]

One of my favourite pastimes during the 80's was heading into Newcastle Central on a weekday to see the upcoming diversions for the weekend. this was when the ECML electrification thing was ongoing and the diversions were posted on a board with the appropriate bits coloured in. The more diversions the better for me, particularly the Leamside as mentioned above but also the Stockton line from Ferryhill. I used to love those lines, not sure why.

One time we had to wait at Ferryhill Jn for around 45 minutes for a driver who signed the road to Stockton. All part of the fun....

The other way, heading up north saw the occasional use of the Blyth and Tyne between Benton and Morpeth.

Happy days...

 

[DarloRich]

The Boulby branch does get the occasional railtour though if you really wanted to travel over it. And the cliff top walk from Saltburn alongside the line is easy enough.

I went down there on a Pacer (2x142) on some kind of Saltburn 150 anniversary spectacular thingy.

 

[ainsworth74]

The Boulby branch does get the occasional railtour though if you really wanted to travel over it. And the cliff top walk from Saltburn alongside the line is easy enough.

Indeed and there's one scheduled to do it on October 27th (which I'll hopefully be on).

 

[Welshman]

The knowledge must have expired pretty recently then if TPE diverted that way recently (though I may be thinking revent as in when we had the huge amount of rain back in May/June, whereas you be thinking recent as in a few years ago!)

When you reach my age, "recent" is anything up to 10 years ago.
Back in May/June is "yesterday"

Bear in mind - growing old is when you can remember events long ago as clear as a bell, but can't for the life of you recall what you had for dinner yesterday!

 

[Tomnick]

It may have been asked a few times before, but what makes a line available for passenger use?

The definitive answer as to whether a given line is a passenger line or not is given in the Sectional Appendix (which, as suggested earlier, shows the line in question at Selby as being a goods line). There are plenty of factors that can contribute to this; just for starters (on a typical goods line), there might be insufficient (or no) overlaps, or no trap point protection from adjacent sidings.

 

[Martin_1981]

Bristol to Exeter via Bath, Yeovil and Honiton was also a diversionary route for some Cross Country trains in past years when the Taunton-Exeter section was blocked. It was mainly the ones to and from Penzance which used this route. I traversed this diversionary route on a Newcastle-Penzance HST in May 1991 when the line was closed at Taunton due to a derailment. A very lengthy diversion taking over three hours. Think the last time this diversion was used was around 2001-2.
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Another diversion which I don't think has been mentioned is Birmingham-Reading via WCML, Acton and the GWML. I believe this is one which hasn't been used since around 2002. Instead it is bus between Oxford and Reading/Basingstoke when the usual Thames Valley route is closed.

 

[bicbasher]

London Charing Cross to Hastings via the Sydenham fast, East Croydon, Purley, Redhill then along the Redhill to Tonbridge line to line of route.

 

[Eagle]

London Charing Cross to Hastings via the Sydenham fast, East Croydon, Purley, Redhill then along the Redhill to Tonbridge line to line of route.

I'm sure that was used for some SE services a couple of weeks ago (might have been Dover rather than Hastings services though).

 

[bicbasher]

I'm sure that was used for some SE services a couple of weeks ago (might have been Dover rather than Hastings services though).

I thought as much, although missed that occasion.

 

[83G/84D]

Not really a diversion however I recall being on a railtour in the 1980's that was routed via the long since closed Taunton station avoider line!

 

[tsr]

I'm sure that was used for some SE services a couple of weeks ago (might have been Dover rather than Hastings services though).

You are entirely correct that this diversion occurred - this happened on Sunday, 8 July, for example.

I think they were Hastings services, but I can't remember.

No additional stops at Southern stations were made, to my knowledge.

In addition, diversions via Redhill can be made during emergency situations, although this is probably more unusual!

 

[eastwestdivide]

Still on Hastings, while the Hastings line was being electrified in the mid-80s, there were diverted Hastings diesels via Paddock Wood-Ashford-Rye.

And earlier in the 80s, I did Leicester to Euston on a Sheffield-London service, diverted via Bedford-Bletchley for Sunday engineering works. 45 + Mk2s all the way to the Euston buffer stops. Shame it went up the slow lines on the WCML though.

 

[Eagle]

Still on Hastings, while the Hastings line was being electrified in the mid-80s, there were diverted Hastings diesels via Paddock Wood-Ashford-Rye.

I do wonder if there would be a market for Hastings–Ashford–HS1–St Pancras services, assuming the Marshlink got electrified. It would likely be somewhat faster than the current service.

 

[D1009]

And earlier in the 80s, I did Leicester to Euston on a Sheffield-London service, diverted via Bedford-Bletchley for Sunday engineering works. 45 + Mk2s all the way to the Euston buffer stops. Shame it went up the slow lines on the WCML though.

More recently than that; I couldn't put a year on it but probably in the very early days of WCRM, the Bletchley-Bedford line was used for WCML diversions which were dragged between Bletchley and Bedford, but the electric locos worked Bedford to St Pancras. A friend of mine worked one of these trains, and he asked his route conductor where the 110 mph started. The conductor said he didn't know as 317s were limited to 100 !

 

[Martin_1981]

Leicester to Birmingham via Coventry was a diversion used by a small number of direct Leics-BHM trains when engineering works were taking place between Birmingham and Nuneaton and in particular during 1993 when Arley Tunnel underwent major repairs. This diversion is no longer possible since the Nuneaton remodelling in 2004 as trains from Leicester can't access the Coventry line and vice-versa. Also capacity between BHM and Cov is an issue, which is why most services from Leicester and beyond used to terminate at Cov during the Arley tunnel blockade.

 

[Welshman]

I remember many years ago, when maintenance work in the Woodhead tunnel meant trains from Manchester London Rd to Sheffield Victoria were diverted via Huddersfield[reverse]and the Penistone line.

It may not be possible today for Manchester-Sheffield services to be diverted that way due to pathing constraints following the singling of parts of the Penistone branch, but wasn't there talk recently of one TPE south service from Sheffield to Manchester being diverted via Wakefield/Huddersfield?

 

[Buttsy]

On a trip up to Scotland with a mate in 1985, we took a usual croos-country service (the Dorset-Scot possibly) that from Oxford went via Worcester Shrub Hill to Birmingham New Street, thence to Stafford via the Cannock line and the final diversion was from Wigan North Western to Lostock Junction and thence to Preston. We were disappointed as as we'd spent a lot of time away from the ususal route, we'd get a diversion through Clitheroe and up the S&C. no such luck...

 

[paul1609]

I do wonder if there would be a market for Hastings–Ashford–HS1–St Pancras services, assuming the Marshlink got electrified. It would likely be somewhat faster than the current service.

You'd have to remodel Ashford International Station to do this as there is no connection possible between Marshlink and HS1 without 2 reversals at present. Much of Marshlink would also need a complete rebuild, line speed is only 40 mph between Ore and Doleham and 60 between Doleham and Ashford.

 

[Southern]

For anyone interested, the Hastings services are booked to run non - stop Tonbridge - London Bridge via Redhill on the 18th November. I'm pretty sure either early this year or last, additional calls at Redhill and East Croydon were made...remember some years ago diverted services being all stations Tonbridge - Purley, East Croydon, Norwood Junction and London Bridge. Extensions of the Tunbridge Wells - London Bridge stopper with whatever VEP/CIG Connex had lying around, I imagine. I remember one Saturday night boarding a 12 Vep at London Bridge LL that called at a couple of stations (East Croydon was one, can't remember the rest) down to Tonbridge before dividing; front 8 to Hastings and rear 4 to Ashford.
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Does anyone know if there were ever any diversions through Birkbeck? I remember occasionally seeing the Orient Express but that's all.

 

[eastwestdivide]

I do wonder if there would be a market for Hastings–Ashford–HS1–St Pancras services, assuming the Marshlink got electrified. It would likely be somewhat faster than the current service.

Interestingly, without any improvements (from 2011 timetable):
Hastings-Ashford 42 mins*
Ashford-London via HS1 38 mins
Total 80 mins

Hastings-Charing Cross direct 93 mins

So it's not so far-fetched an idea.
How much could you take out of the timings with:
a) electric acceleration
b) better max speeds
c) fewer station stops
on the Rye section?

*sorry, originally posted 52 mins - must learn to add up.
*in my 1978 timetable, Hastings-Ashford was 44 mins with all 7 intermediate stops. Not much progress!

And how much could you take out of the "via Battle" service?

 

[Whistler40145]

Does the Anlaby Road curve in Hull see any diversions?