Diversionary routes that aren't used anymore

[Class 33]

One of the good diversionary routes I remember using back in the late 1990's was between Bristol and Birmingham. Due to planned engineering work, services would take a very interesting and completely different route via Bath, Swindon, Oxford, Banbury, and Coventry. I can't recall if the services ran non-stop all the way between Bristol and Birmingham New Street, or whether they called at Oxford, Banbury, Coventry, etc enroute. They certainly didn't stop at Bath, Chippenham, and Swindon. Anyway, a great and interesting diversionary route. Sadly nowadays this diversionary route is no longer used for some reason. If there's any engineering work between Gloucester or Cheltenham and Birmingham, it involves a rail replacement bus service! Far less interesting! I don't know why they can't be pathed via Oxford and Coventry anymore.

Are there any other diversionary routes which aren't ever used anymore?

 

[LNW-GW Joint]

One of the good diversionary routes I remember using back in the late 1990's was between Bristol and Birmingham. Due to planned engineering work, services would take a very interesting and completely different route via Bath, Swindon, Oxford, Banbury, and Coventry. I can't recall if the services ran non-stop all the way between Bristol and Birmingham New Street, or whether they called at Oxford, Banbury, Coventry, etc enroute. They certainly didn't stop at Bath, Chippenham, and Swindon. Anyway, a great and interesting diversionary route. Sadly nowadays this diversionary route is no longer used for some reason. If there's any engineering work between Gloucester or Cheltenham and Birmingham, it involves a rail replacement bus service! Far less interesting! I don't know why they can't be pathed via Oxford and Coventry anymore.

Are there any other diversionary routes which aren't ever used anymore?

For the same original route (but only rarely used even in BR days) was Bristol-Birmingham via Severn Tunnel, Maindee, Hereford and Worcester.
Both the Cheltenham and Oxford routes must have been unavailable.
I stayed up late to watch the northbound Plymouth-Scotland sleeper go this way through Great Malvern once (this would be around 1980).
You could still do it today, although singling Hereford-Ledbury doesn't help.

 

[anthony263]

I am sure crosscountry have run some diversions via Swindon & Oxford especially when there has been disruption along the route between Swindon & Gloucester

 

[Whistler40145]

Several routes I can think of that aren't used anymore for diversions are Crewe to Wolverhampton via Shrewsbury, Bescot to Stafford via Cannock, Nuneaton to Coventry, Nuneaton to Wigston South Junction, Bedford to Bletchley.

 

[Rugd1022]

Probaly down to route and traction knowledge and not having enough Drivers available at a given point in time... including enough spare Drivers to conduct over part of the route as well). In BR days when these kind of diversions were commonplace, there were more spare crews available, these days a lot of TOCs don't want to pay us to just 'sit around' on spare turns.

 

[Class 33]

I am sure crosscountry have run some diversions via Swindon & Oxford especially when there has been disruption along the route between Swindon & Gloucester

Ah yes, that may well have happened. But it appears they don't do planned timetabled diversions along this route anymore. I've been looking for the past several years, though not consistently so there will be a number of weeks I didn't look up. But to no avail. Whenever the Gloucester/Cheltenham-Birmingham line has engineering works, it allways seems to be train from Bristol-Gloucester and then a rail replacement bus(or coach) to Birmingham.

 

[ATW Alex 101]

The halton curve

 

[D6975]

Bristol - Westbury via Swindon isn't used anymore either.
Not that it was ever particularly common - only done it once myself.
I dont think the Severn Beach line (as far as Avonmouth, then up to Filton) is used for Cardiff diversions anymore either. It's years since I last heard of it happening.

 

[PHILIPE]

Many of these diversions cannot take place due to privatisation. Traincrews no longer have such a variety of route knowledge rendering these impossible. For example, Bristol would work both the current XC and FGW routes but of course, split now.

 

[Class 33]

I dont think the Severn Beach line (as far as Avonmouth, then up to Filton) is used for Cardiff diversions anymore either. It's years since I last heard of it happening.

That line was used for Virgin Trains services as well.

But the only time I'm aware of these diversions ever being in use was back in Summer 2004 during the Filton Bank and Filton Abbey Wood additional track laying work. We should I expect see these diversions again within the next four years however, with the four tracks relayed up Filton Bank and the former stations of Ashley Hill and Horfield being rebuilt for passenger service. Come the start of GWML electrification, the new trains, and the new stations being opened/re-opened, it'll certainly be very interesting changes and times in the Bristol region.

 

[starrymarkb]

Bristol - Westbury via Swindon isn't used anymore either.
Not that it was ever particularly common - only done it once myself.
I dont think the Severn Beach line (as far as Avonmouth, then up to Filton) is used for Cardiff diversions anymore either. It's years since I last heard of it happening.

I think the issue with the Severn Beach is that the branch service is more intensive then it was so less room for diversions

 

[DXMachina]

I understand in the past WCML services have been diverted via Aylesbury from Bletchley & Calvert (on the to-be-reopened link) and down the GC to London. Can't happen now as the rails are up....

 

[Whistler40145]

May happen again if the line is reopened.

 

[cm39275]

i don't know if it was used in BR days but last time there was an engineering blockade at Reading over christmas a few years ago and is also being planned for next easter. Services from Bristol/south Wales and a handful of services via Bristol from the south west were diverted from swindon via foxhall curve (Didcot), Oxford to Banbury then reverse via High wycombe along the Chiltern route to Greenford where eastbound ran via Greenford branch to rejoin GWML at West Ealing to Paddington and westbound ran direct from Old oak to Northolt.

 

[Whistler40145]

I am not sure about that as the recent diversions required an extra signal to be installed at Banbury.

 

[CockneySparrow]

Probaly down to route and traction knowledge and not having enough Drivers available at a given point in time... including enough spare Drivers to conduct over part of the route as well). In BR days when these kind of diversions were commonplace, there were more spare crews available, these days a lot of TOCs don't want to pay us to just 'sit around' on spare turns.

Also the reason might have something to do with train paths, TOCs are running trains to the max with freight being squeezed in too, take the route between Ely and Peterborough, nowadays there are three passenger trains an hour each direction plus the freight which has pushed it to the max, this then makes it difficult to divert the ECML trains like before in BR days

I remember back in the 80s when BR used the slam door carriages there was only one train per hour of around six to nine carriages behind a Stratford Class 31, this rolling stock has over time been replaced with DMUs 2 or 3 carriages three times an hour, basically changing one train to three which wastes two paths per hour, smart move lol

Before anyone jumps in and say they still do use this route on diverts from ECML, yes they do but it will only be a limited service on a Sunday during winter months replacing a few freight paths and the vacant Ipswich to Peterborough trains, Mon to Sat is impossible,

 

[ainsworth74]

You do realise that one of the main drivers of passenger growth is a frequent service? I think increasing the frequency of services is probably a pretty smart move to be honest...

 

[TheBigD]

Also the reason might have something to do with train paths, TOCs are running trains to the max with freight being squeezed in too, take the route between Ely and Peterborough, nowadays there are three passenger trains an hour each direction plus the freight which has pushed it to the max, this then makes it difficult to divert the ECML trains like before in BR days

I remember back in the 80s when BR used the slam door carriages there was only one train per hour of around six to nine carriages behind a Stratford Class 31, this rolling stock has over time been replaced with DMUs 2 or 3 carriages three times an hour, basically changing one train to three which wastes two paths per hour, smart move lol

Before anyone jumps in and say they still do use this route on diverts from ECML, yes they do but it will only be a limited service on a Sunday during winter months replacing a few freight paths and the vacant Ipswich to Peterborough trains, Mon to Sat is impossible,

There's an average of 2.5 passenger trains each way each hour. Freight varies, some hours you'll get a liner and an engineers train to/from Whitemoor, other hours just a stone train. Some hours nothing but the passenger trains. For instance this week I didn't signal a single freight for about 4 hours one morning, yet Saturday morning saw over 20 liners.

The big constraint on the Peterborough-Ely route is the Ely North Junction. All trains from Peterborough, all train to/from Norwich and Kings Lynn have to use one set of points on the single lead junction.

 

[Welshman]

I remember in the past when the WC main line was closed north of Preston, some Anglo-Scottish services were diverted from Crewe to Stockport, Denton, Manchester Victoria and Bolton to Blackburn and the Ribble Valley, then S&C to Carlisle. Now, the few that do run via the S&C seem to reverse at Preston and back along the East Lancs line to Blackburn. I suppose the single line sections on the Blackburn-Bolton stretch make pathing difficult, and that Preston is too important a commercial centre to miss.

Also, when the route via Standedge was closed some TPE services were diverted via Bradford Interchange[reverse] and the Calder Valley, but I gather TPE crews no longer sign Bradford Interchange.

And finally, one from the past. In the late 1950s/early 60s, I just remember when they were modernising the Leeds-Wakefield Westgate line, Bradford Exchange/Leeds Central - London Kings Cross services were diverted via Low Moor, where they were joined/divided, and then the Spen Valley line through Cleckheaton to Thornhill and Wakefield Kirkgate. Another diversion not possible today, but those trains were quite a sight on a line which normally saw only Fairburn tanks then 2-Car dmus!

 

[Max]

Out of interest, does anybody know if the Selby avoiding curve (connecting the former ECML from the south to the Selby-Leeds line to the west) has ever been used for diversions? I have never heard of any passenger trains using that route, they tend to go via Askern if the ECML is closed for work.

 

[Morden Via CHX]

I remember back in the 80s when BR used the slam door carriages there was only one train per hour of around six to nine carriages behind a Stratford Class 31, this rolling stock has over time been replaced with DMUs 2 or 3 carriages three times an hour, basically changing one train to three which wastes two paths per hour, smart move lol

Not really changing 'wasting' two paths an hour is it, the passengers are getting a much more frequent service, no one can moan about that

 

[CockneySparrow]

Not really changing 'wasting' two paths an hour is it, the passengers are getting a much more frequent service, no one can moan about that

Yes a more frequent service is better, couldn't agree more from a passengers point of view, I live in Ely and I can just turn up at Ely anytime and within say 20 minutes there is a train to Peterborough

However from NR point of view its two extra trains an hour that could be used for another service such as diversions or freight

 

[LNW-GW Joint]

Out of interest, does anybody know if the Selby avoiding curve (connecting the former ECML from the south to the Selby-Leeds line to the west) has ever been used for diversions? I have never heard of any passenger trains using that route, they tend to go via Askern if the ECML is closed for work.

Yes it was run quite recently when there was disruption between Doncaster and Wakefield.
The EC HST which is visible on the public tracker was one of them and I was able to follow it over this route via Hambleton.

 

[Tomnick]

Presumably that ran directly between Temple Hirst and Hambleton, along the 1980s 'deviation'? That's quite a common diversionary route, and I'm sure things are booked that way. I think Max is referring to the south-to-west curve of the triangle at Selby itself, which I'm sure sees rather less use! Not sure who (on the passenger side at least) would have route knowledge that way.

 

[Crossover]

Several routes I can think of that aren't used anymore for diversions are Crewe to Wolverhampton via Shrewsbury, Bescot to Stafford via Cannock, Nuneaton to Coventry, Nuneaton to Wigston South Junction, Bedford to Bletchley.

My bold - I suspect part of this comes down to a lot now being electric and the Chase Line being diesel only operation.
It would be interesting, once electrificationa dn resignalling is completed on the line, whether they do use it again for diversions (not sure on pathing/traction clearance, but I'd have thought it in some ways better for likes of XC to divert this way instead of down to Tamworth, reverse, and in via Water Orton)

Also, when the route via Standedge was closed some TPE services were diverted via Bradford Interchange[reverse] and the Calder Valley, but I gather TPE crews no longer sign Bradford Interchange

I doubt they do - neber heard of them going there and I doubt they sign via Bramley either.

Nowadays, when Standedge is shut (which it will be in about a months time for, what I guess is, the remodelling of Stalybridge), the TPE's come the normal route to the junction of the Huddersfield/Manchester Victoria line and then progress towards Rochdale (and some do every night for route knowledge)
Some will also go to Huddersfield, reverse (which usually confuses the PIS!) and take the chord onto the line towards Manchester Victoria.

If the line via Dewsbury is shut, they can go via Wakefield Kirkgate and rejoin at Thornhill LNW(?) junction.

If both are shut, I guess they would probably be a bit stuck if they don't sign via Bramley and Bradford Interchange!

 

[QJ]

Out of interest, does anybody know if the Selby avoiding curve (connecting the former ECML from the south to the Selby-Leeds line to the west) has ever been used for diversions? I have never heard of any passenger trains using that route, they tend to go via Askern if the ECML is closed for work.

Yes. I can confirm the Selby avoiding curve was used at least once in BR days as a diversionary route. I was on a train that went that way owing to an incident at a level crossing on the ECML north of Selby (before the Hambleton line was constructed).

Although I don't have the details to hand IIRC the date was a Thursday and the train involved was the overnight Newcastle to Kings Cross TPO that conveyed passengers. I could be totally incorrect with my recollection but the loco was definitely a class 46. I do remember arriving at York on a train from Doncaster that was scheduled to arrive after the afore mentioned southbound service had departed. I went to check out the reason for the delay (hoping the loco had failed and one of York or Healey Mills finest was going to be bolted on the front). Having been informed that the train needed diverting between York and Doncaster I decided to catch the train anyway, for the novelty of running off the ECML on a weekday, though I expected the train to run via Knottingley and the Askern line to rejoin the ECML.

To my surprise the train ran via the Selby avoiding curve and I scratched a new line in the book as a result.

I have spent many a happy hour, often overnight, travelling on trains diverted from the normal route for such trains. One route I recall travelling over that cannot be done now (without a reversal) is that from Bath to Swindon via Bradford on Avon and Melksham. Leamside, the goods line around the back of platforms 4 and 5 at Basingstoke and the Abbeyhill loop in Edinburgh are other examples.

In the days of the Manchester to Gatwick (and vice versa) through trains I have been on such trains diverted via weird and wonderful routes around West and South London (including run rounds in Victoria station - I managed to change trains once at Acton Main Line chasing these trains). The Basingstoke to Reading line being closed resulted in Cross Country trains running to Woking, being dragged back to Guildford by an assisting loco and then reaching Reading via Wokingham. The Reading to Guildford line being closed resulted in class 119 DMUs running via Basingstoke and Woking between the two towns. It is a shame that FGW's Reading to Gatwick service doesn't do the same when the Reading to Guildford line is closed.

In discussing the reasons why the MDTR doesn't use some routes that have been used in the past may happen to be blocked by engineering work at the same time. This was certainly the case when replacement buses were being used to ferry passengers between Bristol's Temple Meads and Parkway a year or two ago. The Avonmouth, Swindon to Gloucester and the Swindon, Oxford and Banbury routes were not available because of work taking place at the same time on those lines. In fact the Avonmouth line was blocked by the same work that prevented trains running between Parkway and Temple Meads. It isn't always the case that the TOCs don't want the use alternative rail routes. Sometimes NR track work prevents them doing so.

 

[DarloRich]

The Leamside Line isnt used anymore
--- old post above --- --- new post below ---

Out of interest, does anybody know if the Selby avoiding curve (connecting the former ECML from the south to the Selby-Leeds line to the west) has ever been used for diversions? I have never heard of any passenger trains using that route, they tend to go via Askern if the ECML is closed for work.

Selby Canal Junction - Selby West Junction?

 

[fgwrich]

Ah yes, that may well have happened. But it appears they don't do planned timetabled diversions along this route anymore. I've been looking for the past several years, though not consistently so there will be a number of weeks I didn't look up. But to no avail. Whenever the Gloucester/Cheltenham-Birmingham line has engineering works, it allways seems to be train from Bristol-Gloucester and then a rail replacement bus(or coach) to Birmingham.

Whilst as you say there's now no booked / planned timetabled diversions along that route, it can still happen as shown by this HST on diversion via Didcot / Oxford last year:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kPbfX4U98Uk

 

[Requeststop]

I wonder if FGW would use the diversionary route I took many years back on the night milker from Paddington to Penzance when I woke up much to my shock, stationary at Worcester SH? It appears we'd done Didcot-Oxford-Worcester and then went onto Hereford, Maindee North, Maindee East, Severn Tunnel to Bristol TM. Remember it was in a Mark 1, no loudspeaker announcements and all in the compartment asleep with the blinds down, not a care in the world as to where we were.

 

[Rugd1022]

i don't know if it was used in BR days but last time there was an engineering blockade at Reading over christmas a few years ago and is also being planned for next easter. Services from Bristol/south Wales and a handful of services via Bristol from the south west were diverted from swindon via foxhall curve (Didcot), Oxford to Banbury then reverse via High wycombe along the Chiltern route to Greenford where eastbound ran via Greenford branch to rejoin GWML at West Ealing to Paddington and westbound ran direct from Old oak to Northolt.

I was one of the conductor Drivers on this over Christmas 2010, a very interesting week that. The first night we had thick fog all the way from Banbury into Padd.... we could barely see the two new semaphores that had been instaleld at Banbury it was that bad