Chiltern Evergreen 3 Bicester - Oxford

[CarltonA]

It is a pity the Thame route was never upgraded to a main line, I believe it was the shortest London-Oxford route. The Oxford Tube coach will be the loser when this scheme finally opens. The MIMBYs put paid to any Great Central reopening from Calvert to Rugby and now they've been landed with HS2. They may struggle to shut that one down.

 

[jimm]

The tree huggers are in control and will come up with new problems as the inquiry goes along.Bet Countryfile will send John Craven along to a do a peice on the enquiry and make Chiltern out to be vandals.This matter needs to be settled as soon as possible and the link and services started .

Perhaps you should try reading the thread before posting this kind of nonsense. All of seven posts back up the thread is a very clear statement of the only things that the reopened inquiry can discuss, so there won't be 'new problems' - it even includes the line - in bold, just to help you - 'The Secretary of State stated that she is “not inviting, and will not refer to the reopened inquiry, evidence on any other matters”.

 

[The Planner]

The Oxford Tube coach will be the loser when this scheme finally opens.

I don't believe it will, the Oxford Tube caters for a vast amount of people of the east side of the city, the new line still won't cater for these unless they drive up to Water Orton Parkway.

 

[CarltonA]

Not suggesting it would suffer greatly, after all it is the best used inter-city coach in the country. Oxford has always had a relatively poor rail service to London, the GWR was sarcastically called the Great Way Round in Oxford for running via Didcot.

 

[L&Y Robert]

I don't believe it will, the Oxford Tube caters for a vast amount of people of the east side of the city, the new line still won't cater for these unless they drive up to Water Orton Parkway.

YES! That's the idea, innit?

 

[aylesbury]

Also the Tube starts in the city bus station thats a plus for people who use it,although its not a long walk to the railway station .The student population tend to use it but alot of commuters do as well ,they even park under theM40at the Watlington turn .When I used to work around Oxford it was noticable that often the buses were empty except for the airport ones,but the trains always looked busy.

 

[swt_passenger]

I don't believe it will, the Oxford Tube caters for a vast amount of people of the east side of the city, the new line still won't cater for these unless they drive up to Water Orton Parkway.

Water Eaton, I should think...

 

[Rich McLean]

Water Eaton, I should think...

Its a long drive to Water Orton

 

[JGR]

The Oxford Tube coach will be the loser when this scheme finally opens.

I very much doubt it. The Oxford Tube is much cheaper, reasonably fast, runs 24/7, and has a huge catchment area.
By the time you've travelled travelled west or north across Oxford to get a train, you've lost so much time that you might as well have got the tube.

 

[The Planner]

Water Eaton, I should think...

Whats 70 miles between friends....

 

[Squaddie]

I very much doubt it. The Oxford Tube is much cheaper, reasonably fast, runs 24/7, and has a huge catchment area.
By the time you've travelled travelled west or north across Oxford to get a train, you've lost so much time that you might as well have got the tube.

When I was travelling frequently between London and Oxford I very quickly abandoned the train, which was expensive, overcrowded and subject to ticket restrictions that almost completely ruled out any flexibility, and began using one of the coach services (can't remember the name of it now - not the Oxford Tube but the other one). It was cheaper, more comfortable and, almost without exception, quicker.

 

[JGR]

When I was travelling frequently between London and Oxford I very quickly abandoned the train, which was expensive, overcrowded and subject to ticket restrictions that almost completely ruled out any flexibility, and began using one of the coach services (can't remember the name of it now - not the Oxford Tube but the other one). It was cheaper, more comfortable and, almost without exception, quicker.

Oxford Espress/X90, I suspect.

When I started uni here, you could get an advance single (with railcard etc.) a few days in advance from Oxford to London for £2.65, fat chance of that now. Using a pack of 12 singles ticket, the Tube is as near as matters a fiver each way, with no restrictions.

I know a number of people who commute daily between the two using the Oxford Tube. Unless the railways get significantly cheaper, I doubt that they'd bother switching to rail, even if the new line did offer nominally faster services.

 

[Tugboatden]

...but a lot of commuters do as well ,they even park under the M40 at the Watlington turn.

...and all along the verge of the B4009 too. I'm surprised that some enterprising individual in the highways department hasn't seen an opportunity to double yellow the road and put in a paying car park!

 

[route:oxford]

...and all along the verge of the B4009 too. I'm surprised that some enterprising individual in the highways department hasn't seen an opportunity to double yellow the road and put in a paying car park!

Stagecoach were refused permission to build/create a park & ride facility in the past.

 

[aylesbury]

Perhaps you should try reading the thread before posting this kind of nonsense. All of seven posts back up the thread is a very clear statement of the only things that the reopened inquiry can discuss, so there won't be 'new problems' - it even includes the line - in bold, just to help you - 'The Secretary of State stated that she is “not inviting, and will not refer to the reopened inquiry, evidence on any other matters”.

I have read the thread and felt that all the problems stem from the objections raised by inviromentalists .We will see what happens when the inquiry starts laywers are very good at circumventing gudelines,so perhaps its not nonsense.

 

[jimm]

Yes it is, that's why I said it was. The inquiry inspector takes his cue from the Transport Secretary, so he will not be hearing anything about any other issues than the ones listed - a point reiterated to the lawyers and others at a procedural hearing last month.

The minutes of that hearing note: "The Inspector does not expect to hear evidence that does not relate to any of the four matters identified by the Secretary of State, nor will such evidence form part of his report."

All evidence on those four issues had to be lodged with him by 5pm today.

Minutes of the procedural hearing are here http://www.chiltern-evergreen3.co.uk/uploads/12April2012/X-29.pdf

 

[giblets]

Whilst for a lot of people, the Evergreen route will provide little or no advantage, for most anyone who lives in North Oxford (or North of), and there are some very wealthy areas up that way, the new route will be a great advantage.
Once you start including costs to get into Oxford (or across Oxford), and the time taken, the advantages start to add up.
If you get one of the Clubman carriages, working on the move is far easier too.

Even if they only took 10-15% of passengers off the tube, plus others who might have driven, FGW passengers, it would be a good result.

In terms of delaying the project, does this mean it can be included in the E-W project more easily?

 

[L&Y Robert]

Sorry folks, I haven't been following this as closely as I should, but what EXACTLY is the state of the game now? Have we had the Inquiry Extra yet? If not, when is it? If we have, what was decided? Is the job ON? or not?

 

[Rich McLean]

Wolvercote Tunnel has had the all clear to have lights put it, which come on when a train approaches to alert the bats that there is a train coming. Once the train has gone through, the lights go off again.

So the project is back on as planned

 

[jimm]

Wolvercote Tunnel has had the all clear to have lights put it, which come on when a train approaches to alert the bats that there is a train coming. Once the train has gone through, the lights go off again.

So the project is back on as planned

If only it were so simple.

The inquiry resumed today in Oxford. It will last the rest of this week, adjourn next week and then resume on Monday June 11 for a few more days.
As noted above there are other issues being reexamined as well as the bats.

The inquiry inspector will then report to the Transport Secretary and she will say yes or no to granting the order allowing Chiltern to proceed.

All the paperwork can be found here http://www.chiltern-evergreen3.co.uk/index.php/twa-inquiry

 

[cle]

Is there any mention of doubling through the tunnel and other single track bits.

I know Chiltern meant to do it initially, but then down scoped, saying it could be a part of the E/W project if that ever came around.

And now it has, so will the tunnel works be done? Or will the single section be expected to take 2tph Oxford (Chiltern), 2tph Marylebone, 2tph E/W Oxford/Reading, 2tph Bletchley and onwards - plus freight and possible cross country services? That's already possibly 10 tph passing through.

 

[swt_passenger]

The decision to do the phase 2a tunnel works as part of the Chiltern works was agreed quite a while back, it was discussed in an earlier thread.

DfT have specifically funded certain work to allow track redoubling without further major closures, this includes formation lowering for freight gauge clearance:

From one of the proofs of evidence on the TWA documentation list:

4.104. In order to provide adequate clearance for these proposed future uses, it will be necessary to lower the level of the track within the tunnel and on the approaches to it. This work will be highly disruptive to the railway and requires the closure of the line for several months. In order to avoid disruption to the new London Marylebone – Oxford services within the first few years of operation and to avoid the additional cost of carrying out the works separately at a later date, the Department for Transport has agreed to fund the undertaking of track lowering works through the tunnel in advance of the remainder of the East West Rail Link. These works, which together with works to certain other structures over the railway form Phase 2A of the scheme, will be undertaken during the period the railway is closed for the construction of Phase 1 works.

 

[cle]

Some foresight! Good to hear - also good to see DfT actually expending on E/W Rail ostensibly. Must be quite committed, if only for the freight...

Thanks hen.

 

[DXMachina]

Will the additional clearance from freight clearance have headroom factored in for OHLE?

I know that Chiltern line -, E/W Rail -, and Oxford-Birmingham electrification isn't scheduled for any time soon or even really planned for but it's a possible future project and factoring in the possibility now could reduce unnecessary closure and remodelling on the same location 20 or 30 years hence.

 

[jimm]

Will the additional clearance from freight clearance have headroom factored in for OHLE?

I know that Chiltern line -, E/W Rail -, and Oxford-Birmingham electrification isn't scheduled for any time soon or even really planned for but it's a possible future project and factoring in the possibility now could reduce unnecessary closure and remodelling on the same location 20 or 30 years hence.

For goodness' sake, do you really think that DfT would give Chiltern £18m to spend and not expect them to factor in every possible future scenario, such as electrification? The tunnel (more an extended bridge actually) will be cleared to W12 loading gauge, the biggest on Network Rail. There is masses of detail and track layouts for the Oxford-Bicester route in an article about the East-West project in the current issue of Modern Railways.

Report on the reopening of the inquiry here http://www.oxfordmail.co.uk/news/yo..._back_on_agenda_as_rail_link_inquiry_resumes/

 

[giblets]

Wolvercote Tunnel has had the all clear to have lights put it, which come on when a train approaches to alert the bats that there is a train coming.

Stupid question, but aren't bats blind!? Wish they would get a move on with the enquiry!

 

[Cherry_Picker]

Bats arent blind, it's just that they use sonar to hunt/navigate rather than eyesight.

 

[giblets]

Please Delete

 

[twoag]

Is the enquiry finished?... Anybody know when the transport secretaries decision is due?

 

[route:oxford]

Is the enquiry finished?... Anybody know when the transport secretaries decision is due?

The enquiry finished on Friday 15th June.

There are too many pressure/lobby groups these days.