Will Thirsk ever be rebuilt ?

[Halifaxlad]

Everytime Thirsk crops up I can't help but think how silly it looks that the slow lines weave around the island platforms and I do wonder will the station ever be rebuilt to match Northallerton ?

 

[SuspectUsual]

Well they’ve just put lifts in * to solve the main operational problem so I’d be surprised if anything else happened for the foreseeable future



* all thanks to Kevin Hollinrake MP. According to Kevin Hollinrake MP

 

[Halifaxlad]

Well they’ve just put lifts in * to solve the main operational problem so I’d be surprised if anything else happened for the foreseeable future



* all thanks to Kevin Hollinrake MP. According to Kevin Hollinrake MP

Any pictures ?

I thought they had just received the funding ?

Huddersfield also got lifts from the same scheme and one of them is to be demolished so it's no big deal really.

 

[SynthD]

The road bridge has limited openings for the lines to pass through. You’d have to close the line and road, rebuild the bridge, and shift things around to make them less silly, all in one fast operation.

What about Northallerton should be copied? There aren’t fast lines in the middle, with platforms on the outside of the slow lines. Huntingdon has that.

 

[Bald Rick]

Everytime Thirsk crops up I can't help but think how silly it looks that the slow lines weave around the island platforms and I do wonder will the station ever be rebuilt to match Northallerton ?

What is the problem?

 

[zwk500]

Everytime Thirsk crops up I can't help but think how silly it looks that the slow lines weave around the island platforms and I do wonder will the station ever be rebuilt to match Northallerton ?

If anything, Northallerton needs rebuilding to match Thirsk, with slow line platforms and fast through lines!

What did you envisage when you say 'match Northallerton' - reducing the ECML through Thirsk to 2 lines wouldn't be a good move. Thirsk looks a bit odd because the fast line platform faces were taken out of use, but with the crossovers at the ends of the station it's got no issue having platforms only on the slow lines. It's fundamentally the same layout as a lot of suburban stations on the ECML and SWML (London-Bournemouth), just with platforms between the lines rather than outside.

There's a bit of a linespeed penalty on the slows (Up it goes from 80/SP90* to 40 through the platform then 65, Down it goes from 70 to 65 then 60 a bit south of the station, then to 80/SP90 before the Slow-to-fast crossover) but then if a train is stopping, or using the crossovers (which are 30-50mph), or limited to up to 75mph (freight) then the penalty isn't that bad of an impact.

*80/SP90 - 80mph for most trains, 90mph for trains that are authorised to use the 'Sprinter' speeds.

 

[yorksrob]

Yes, it's Northallerton that could do with island platforms IMO.

 

[Halifaxlad]

What about Northallerton should be copied? There aren’t fast lines in the middle, with platforms on the outside of the slow lines. Huntingdon has that.

I forgot they haven't done it yet but the plan is to extend the slow lines through the station and push the platforms backwards.

 

[zwk500]

I forgot they haven't done it yet but the plan is to extend the slow lines through the station and push the platforms backwards.

So what you want is really Thirsk rebuilding to match Sandy?

The sole benefit of this will be to mitigate the speed restrictions, which from a quick look at the Sectional Appendix are only partially the result of the platform curvature. The potential realiseable benefit may be as small as 15 chains of 40mph being raised to 65 on the Up Slow only. This would only benefit non-stopping trains on that line, of course. At best you may get a couple more miles at 80/SP90 in both directions.

The negative impacts include the disruption, cost, narrower final platforms for passengers, potentially worse facilities on those platforms as the current buildings may not be reprovided. And of course, to realise maximum benefit you would be demolishing and rebuilding the road overbridge to allow the tracks to straighten out. Oh, and also it would make it harder to reinstate fast line platforms if ever needed/wanted (such as after a HSR bypass of the ECML was built, if ever it was)

Out of interest what were you thinking rebuilding Thirsk would achieve?

 

[deltic08]

Yes, it's Northallerton that could do with island platforms IMO.

What is needed at Northallerton is a grade separated junction at the south end, where the ECML is on a high embankment, for the down slow line to cross underneath onto the east side. A new 2 track viaduct over the station car park with 2 platforms and lines connected to the Stockton/Middlesbrough lines would allow the flat junction to the north of the station to be closed together with closure of the Longlands loop. This would allow all passenger and freight to/from Teesside to have their own platforms and stay clear of the fast lines. Also increase capacity on the present two track section through the station.

 

[Halifaxlad]

What is needed at Northallerton is a grade separated junction at the south end, where the ECML is on a high embankment, for the down slow line to cross underneath onto the east side. A new 2 track viaduct over the station car park with 2 platforms and lines connected to the Stockton/Middlesbrough lines would allow the flat junction to the north of the station to be closed together with closure of the Longlands loop. This would allow all passenger and freight to/from Teesside to have their own platforms and stay clear of the fast lines. Also increase capacity on the present two track section through the station.

Network Rail have been looking at putting a flyover in North of the station to do the same thing.

 

[Failed Unit]

Yes, it's Northallerton that could do with island platforms IMO.

There are many examples on the ECML where the islands are like that, Brookmans Park, New Barnet, Oakliegh Park and New Southgate are a few I can think of.

However specifically about your Northallerton point. I have often thought that myself. Why don't they build platforms on the frieght line so passenger trains don't need to cross the ECML on the flat. I am not sure if a train to the Middlebrough does often impact the ECML. However I am sure using the Northbound frieght line must surely be an improvement.

Not sure if Thirsk has a speed restriction. Brookman's park is 50mph for fast trains on the slow line. However considering most trains on the slow are stopping anyway I can't see much justfication to straighen the line to remove it (if it exists)

 

[dodecahedron67]

Problem with putting platforms on the Longlands Loop is the ‘unacceptable amount of time the three level crossings would be down for each hour’ if all the services via Yarm used them