What silly clearance rules are in force?

[sprinterguy]

I have to confess i've often wondered this. What part of a 165/166 is out of gauge to prohibit it from other parts of the network? Especially when you consider 365/325/465's have the same bodyshell and, jointly, operate over a fairly wide area of the network.

The electric Networkers only have 20m bodyshells though, whereas the Networker Turbos have 23m carriages.

 

[Whistler40145]

Any thoughts on Class 40s on the former Southern Region?

Why is it no go with Network Rail, but was permissible with BR?

 

[tbtc]

Any thoughts on Class 40s on the former Southern Region?

Why is it no go with Network Rail, but was permissible with BR?

40s were banned in a few places (I think the only way they could get to Glasgow was via Kilmarnock)

 

[heart-of-wessex]

I cant see the reason why 165/166's would be allowed through Trowbridge, it can't be a length issue as HST's pass here on diversion, and on the timetable change they will be through here everyday weekday.

 

[tbtc]

I cant see the reason why 165/166's would be allowed through Trowbridge, it can't be a length issue as HST's pass here on diversion, and on the timetable change they will be through here everyday weekday.

165/166 coaches are as wide as 150 coaches (2.81m), but as long as a Mk3 (IIRC Mk3s are around 2.7m wide).

You can have "long and thin" coaches or "short and fat" coaches, but the 165/166s are both (due to the generous clearances on the GWML)

 

[Old Timer]

I cant see the reason why 165/166's would be allowed through Trowbridge, it can't be a length issue as HST's pass here on diversion, and on the timetable change they will be through here everyday weekday.

It could possibly be to do with whats called centre-throw which is the distance that the centre of a vehicle is displaced from the track centreline when going round a bend.

 

[starrymarkb]

They have been though Trowbridge, a couple of units were trapped by Ufton Nervet and the only way to extricate them was via Trowbridge

 

[ChrisCooper]

Trains will often be able to run at low speed on routes they are not cleared for. Part of clearance is kinematic envelope which includes the movement the train body makes on it's suspension. By running at lower speed they will miss things that they might hit at line speed. It's the same as going over a speedhump in a car, go over at reduced speed and you will have no problem, go over too fast and some part of the car will hit the hump or the road. Depending on the static clearance, suspension travel and suspension stiffness the speed at which a car can pass over a hump without touching it or the road will differ. The other thing with both speedhumps and trains is that if you are going slow and anything does hit it won't do as much damage. Kinematic envelope is even a factor in some places where trains are normally cleared for a route. There are some tunnels on the Southern Region where 23m stock such as HSTs, 442s and 444s are restricted to I think 10mph slower due to kinematic envelope. A fairly recent big issue with kinematic envelope was when the DVTs were introduced on the GEML and it was found the part of the bogies (it was either the yaw damper or the steps, or both) would hit some platforms at line speed, so they had to have speed restriction though the effected platforms until either the platform edges were altered.

 

[ashworth]

Pacers supposedly aren't allowed a few places (e.g. south of Chesterfield), which is odd when you consider how short their fifteen metre carriages are (so less "swing" than a 23m carriage)...

I've always wondered about why they aren't allowed south of Chesterfield. It's a good thing, because it stops Northern occasionally using them on Leeds-Nottingham services, which I am sure would have happened by now if allowed.

 

[tbtc]

I've always wondered about why they aren't allowed south of Chesterfield. It's a good thing, because it stops Northern occasionally using them on Leeds-Nottingham services, which I am sure would have happened by now if allowed.

Yeah, I'm not aware of any clearance problems south of Chesterfield or any other units which are banned from the East Midlands - perhaps this is just the good people of the East Midlands knowing that they had to take a stand against Pacers?

As you say, they'd be there otherwise (on Leeds - Sheffield - Nottingam when there's not enough 158s), the Nottingham - Mansfield - Worksop route is common to many routes Northern use Pacers on too.

 

[Orange Box]

357s banned from Platform 3 (Up Electric) at Ilford but OK for all the others. Not very helpful for the ECS moves from Ilford/Seven Kings!

 

[d1015fan]

I was on the Ness Monster Tour, & we were held for a good twenty minutes In a Loop outside of Ashford Station. The signaller did not allow to the tour to proceed until they had spoken to the NWR Route Controllers to make sure that the Dungeness Branch was cleared for Class 66 operation. I dont believe it was due to the loco not belonging to the right FOC but I stand to be corrected on this!. Odd considering DB Schenker had already sent a 66 down there in the recent past!:roll: It was a great tour highlight for me was the Class 73 on Diesel power into Marylebone.

i was there too. the usual railtour farce and a great tour none the less and added a bit of spice with the fast running back towards london and the looped Southeastern units.

 

[Whistler40145]

I thought LHCS was barred from Wemyss Bay, is this correct?

 

[Kneedown]

The electric Networkers only have 20m bodyshells though, whereas the Networker Turbos have 23m carriages.

Aaaaaaaaaah. Cheers for solving that mystery!

 

[TEW]

The problems with 165/166s at Trowbridge is that they may scrape the platforms.