What is going wrong at Avanti West Coast?

[Winthorpe]

After a particularly traumatic event on TPE, I'm afraid I consider it every person for themself on the trains now, and if this train goes where I want, I'm not getting off it to "help out"

I hate to read this experience and I’ve had similar.

I once stepped off a crush loaded train to allow passengers to get off. The passengers waiting to board elbow me out of the way. So I ended up left on the platform as the train departed!

 

[Towers]

It is a recent phenomenon for trains to be 'too crowded', and is yet another example of trains becoming ever more 'delicate' as they cram more and more computerised control onto them. It used to be the case that people squeezed on until asphyxiation set in, and the train just ran! It may be unpleasant on a crammed long-distance train, but it's better than stranding.

It isn’t; the Pendolinos have always had loading sensors that will trigger an alert if particular coaches are over-full, as it affects the tilt capabilities. No other train has any such issue, they are designed to operate crush loaded. Staff may choose to provide a variety of explanations if attempting to encourage people to detrain, of course!

== Doublepost prevention - post automatically merged: 16 Feb 2025 ==

I remember being on a crush loaded HST at Paddington (P1) about 20 years ago in the evening peak, and the guard kept saying over the tannoy that the train was too heavy to leave and urging Reading commuters to get off and grab an alternative service as the train couldn’t leave with the volume of passengers onboard.

I’ll defer to the experts on whether HSTs had some sort of weight restriction / way of measuring it, or whether the guard was embellishing somewhat?

They didn’t!

 

[Jimini]

It isn’t; the Pendolinos have always had loading sensors that will trigger an alert if particular coaches are over-full, as it affects the tilt capabilities. No other train has any such issue, they are designed to operate crush loaded. Staff may choose to provide a variety of explanations if attempting to encourage people to detrain, of course!

== Doublepost prevention - post automatically merged: 16 Feb 2025 ==


They didn’t!

I suspected that might have been the case! Thanks for confirming

 

[peteb]

Knowing Avanti's current reputation I was dreading a trip to Edinburgh last Wednesday. Imagine my surprise when the 0807 Birmingham New Street to Edinburgh formed of an 11 coach Pendolino ran on time, had a decent buffet, and choosing to sit in coach I meant there was loads of space, nice & quiet.

The return journey at 1456 on Thursday also ran to time. I think this was a 9 coach consist, there being no coach U, however coach C was unreserved throughout and not rammed to the gills, except for commuter traffic between Preston and Warrington. The only minor gripes were a) very warm carriage b) no power to plugs.....hence battery anxiety(!) c) coffee machine at buffet out of order.

To be fair, sitting at a second class seat at a table for four with window on Avanti Pendolino is as good as any EU high speed train in my opinion.

 

[Ghostbus]

To be fair, sitting at a second class seat at a table for four with window on Avanti Pendolino is as good as any EU high speed train in my opinion.

Well you certainly have time to enjoy the view....

 

[AlterEgo]

To be fair, sitting at a second class seat at a table for four with window on Avanti Pendolino is as good as any EU high speed train in my opinion.

As long as it's actually moving, which is becoming a rarity due to how poorly Avanti are handling disruption.

 

[43066]

I’ll defer to the experts on whether HSTs had some sort of weight restriction / way of measuring it, or whether the guard was embellishing somewhat?

They didn’t.

I suspect that, in reality, it was simply too crowded to pass through, and they wanted to give a convincing sounding reason to get people to disembark.

 

[voyagerdude220]

I’ll defer to the experts on whether HSTs had some sort of weight restriction / way of measuring it, or whether the guard was embellishing somewhat?

At the risk of going off topic..
I suspect your scenario was simply the Train Manager trying to ensure that as many longer distance passengers were able to board their train.

I remember GWR deliberately ran a relief train one Friday evening in place of a London to South West England train which was never booked to call at Reading because GWR knew how busy it would be and many selfish Reading commuters were caught out by this, despite the Train Manager announcing several times about it not stopping at Reading before leaving London.

 

[LNW-GW Joint]

Im Surprised they go down this route. Easier way to do it is to no longer stop at certain stations, run express to Carlisle or something, that way the numbers are forced to go down. Then seek ticket acceptance with other operators (if available or feasible) if their train comes first.

The airline answer to overbooking is to offer cash/upgrade incentives to take other services, until everybody can be seated.
Something the railway doesn't even try to do, apparently.

The TGV equivalent is only to book seated passengers to start with.

 

[Howardh]

These days I almost always use LNR instead of Avanti for Milton Keynes to Euston, more space, more trains and clock face timetables

I'll be in Milton Keynes this week and will avoid Avanti to/from London, LNR might be slower but I'm pretty much guaranteed a seat!

 

[dk1]

The airline answer to overbooking is to offer cash/upgrade incentives to take other services, until everybody can be seated.
Something the railway doesn't even try to do, apparently.

That’s because we have a fabulous walk on service and choose to stand should a service be full. A seat reservation/advance ticket usually comes with a seat.

 

[PyrahnaRanger]

I hate to read this experience and I’ve had similar.

I once stepped off a crush loaded train to allow passengers to get off. The passengers waiting to board elbow me out of the way. So I ended up left on the platform as the train departed!

Ah - sounds nasty. I escaped physical injuries, but one cold winter evening after a trip to the Christmas market, I was asked by the TM to move our buggy from where it was to the other end of the train, which was impossible to do on the train, and they assured me they would ensure I could get on and that they would definitely not leave without me. There was no way I could get back on, and despite explaining to the staff they either needed to get me on, or the wife and child off, the train left with neither of those things happening. The Mrs and our 12 month old disappeared off to Buckshaw Parkway, unaware I was still on the platform at Piccadilly trying to get staff to either get me a taxi, or get a message to BSV as I had coats, bags, car keys and my wife's handbag with her mobile in the carrier of the pram. Needless to say, TPE couldn't have cared less if they froze to death waiting for us.

The only minor gripes were a) very warm carriage b) no power to plugs.....hence battery anxiety(!) c) coffee machine at buffet out of order.

Seems fairly normal for Avanti!