Unknowingly Expired Railcard Since September 2023

[Mapola2001]

Hi,

I was stopped today after finding that my 16-25 railcard had been expired since September 2023. Foolishly I never checked the expiry and didn’t think twice about using it for my journeys. This is totally my fault and I get that.

I have looked back on Trainline and I have taken 27 journeys since it expired totalling around £200 (railcard price) or £300 (full price).

I was cautioned by the ticket inspector and he took my details and asked me some questions e.g. if I was able to pay for the ticket, did I know I was travelling with an expired railcard. All of which I answered honestly and was pleasant to him throughout.

He then said that since this is such a long period of time for it to be expired that it will be sent off to be investigated and that I may go to court and if found guilty I would receive a criminal record.

I am studying my PhD and never got into any trouble before and can’t help but worry about this. Part of me hopes because it’s £300 I can just get away with an out of court order but I read that this is not the attitude that the companies take.

If anyone has any advice or any ideas on what will happen that would be much appreciated.
Thank you

== Doublepost prevention - post automatically merged: 30 Jan 2025 ==

Hi,

I was stopped today after finding that my 16-25 railcard had been expired since September 2023. Foolishly I never checked the expiry and didn’t think twice about using it for my journeys. This is totally my fault and I get that.

I have looked back on Trainline and I have taken 27 journeys since it expired totalling around £200 (railcard price) or £300 (full price).

I was cautioned by the ticket inspector and he took my details and asked me some questions e.g. if I was able to pay for the ticket, did I know I was travelling with an expired railcard. All of which I answered honestly and was pleasant to him throughout.

He then said that since this is such a long period of time for it to be expired that it will be sent off to be investigated and that I may go to court and if found guilty I would receive a criminal record.

I am studying my PhD and never got into any trouble before and can’t help but worry about this. Part of me hopes because it’s £300 I can just get away with an out of court order but I read that this is not the attitude that the companies take.

If anyone has any advice or any ideas on what will happen that would be much appreciated.
Thank you

I should add this was on a West Midlands train

 

[Cuthbert]

Which train company was it?
Regarding the cost of them asking for money back you are looking at a standard single per trip. So if you did a return journey on a day that will be two Standard singles with no rail card. And most companies tend not to deduct what you have already paid.
Then admin fee between £95-£150.

The majority of ToCs (Train Operating Company) will prefer an out of court settlement. We have had cases of £20k+ owed and still no court.

The pros on this forum will be able to help with reply when you recieve the letter if you do post it on here with all details and reference number redacted.
It can take up for 4 weeks sometimes to get a letter. Sometimes more.

 

[Mapola2001]

Which train company was it?
Regarding the cost of them asking for money back you are looking at a standard single per trip. So if you did a return journey on a day that will be two Standard singles with no rail card. And most companies tend not to deduct what you have already paid.
Then admin fee between £95-£150.

The majority of ToCs (Train Operating Company) will prefer an out of court settlement. We have had cases of £20k+ owed and still no court.

The pros on this forum will be able to help with reply when you recieve the letter if you do post it on here with all details and reference number redacted.
It can take up for 4 weeks sometimes to get a letter. Sometimes more.

Thanks for the reply, It was a West Midlands railway train.

Happy to pay them back for the tickets as it is totally my error.

 

[30907]

Part of me hopes because it’s £300 I can just get away with an out of court order but I read that this is not the attitude that the companies take

Welcome!
The good news is that in practice most train companies, including WMT, will offer to settle with anyone who engages with them.
They essentially want you to pay the correct fare in future and to get back some of the money they should have had in the first place. They don't particularly want to have to go to court.

You will need to wait till they contact you, which may be quite some time.

Meanwhile (1) make yourself a list of the fares you have carelessly avoided,
(2) make sure you can get hold of your post reasonably promptly, including during holiday periods or if you move house and
(3) buy yourself a new Railcard

 

[Cuthbert]

Thanks for the reply, It was a West Midlands railway train.

Happy to pay them back for the tickets as it is totally my error.

Yes they will definitely prefer out of court settlement. Seen many on here.

If you can renew the railcard as soon as possible before you get the letter and the forum guru's help you with a reply you can add in "Since that day I bought a new Railcard".
Helps a lot.

I know it's easy for me to say typing away on here but just chill and wait for the letter.

 

[Mapola2001]

Welcome!
The good news is that in practice most train companies, including WMT, will offer to settle with anyone who engages with them.

Thanks for the reply! That makes me feel a bit better at least. I still feel like an idiot tho haha

== Doublepost prevention - post automatically merged: 30 Jan 2025 ==

Yes they will definitely prefer out of court settlement. Seen many on here.

If you can renew the railcard when you get the letter and the forum guru's help you with a reply you can add in "Since that day I bought a new Railcard".
Helps a lot.

I know it's easy for me to say typing away on here but just chill and wait for the letter.

Amazing, I will definitely take that advice

 

[Cuthbert]

Thanks for the reply! That makes me feel a bit better at least. I still feel like an idiot tho haha

== Doublepost prevention - post automatically merged: 30 Jan 2025 ==


Amazing, I will definitely take that advice

I edited my post but seems it did not change in yours. I meant to get the Railcard renewal if you are still travelling as soon as you can.

 

[WesternLancer]

Thanks for the reply, It was a West Midlands railway train.

Happy to pay them back for the tickets as it is totally my error.

With help from here you can almost certainly avoid court. It’s vital you check for post or e mail including spam though as you must reply to them or it will go to court automatically.

The problem will be that they are likely to charge for replacement tickets at the punitively expensive Anytime Single fare, even if your journey was off peak. So your £300 estimate may be too low.

If you trawl your journey record we can advise you how to look up those fares. That may help you analyse the sort of money you may need to have ready. I think in exceptional circumstances we have seen WM Trains allow paying in instalments but that isn’t the usual approach.

Check any e mail accounts linked to your ticket purchases. Make sure you can safely receive post at the address you gave. You usually have to reply to them quite quickly, but it may be a while before they write to you.

 

[SCDR_WMR]

I think in exceptional circumstances we have seen WM Trains allow paying in instalments but that isn’t the usual approach.

Actually, as long as you engage fully, WMT are usually happy to accept installments, not just in exceptional circumstances. Our Digital Fraud department is quite open with staff about this.

 

[WesternLancer]

Actually, as long as you engage fully, WMT are usually happy to accept installments, not just in exceptional circumstances. Our Digital Fraud department is quite open with staff about this.

Thanks. That’s helpful to know. Seems not so many other train companies do that. Thanks for clarifying.