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Tickets - who is at fault?

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mrcheek

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11 Sep 2007
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If you are stopped inside M&S the burden of proof is just the same...

In your example you said "outside", so in order to criticise your analogy, so did I. Nice to see you admit that your example was stupid.

But its possible to be in a shop "just visiting", and not intending to make a purchase. If youre on a train, you need a ticket simply to be present there. You dont have to make a purchase when you visit M&S.
 
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MikeWh

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Indeed I don't think you commit a crime of shoplifting until you actually leave the store without paying.
 

jon0844

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If you bought it, it's up to you to be able to prove you bought it. It might not be the best analogy but if I bought a tin of beans, then took them back for a refund it would be up to me to prove I'd bought them from the shop I took them to (by receipt) not the shop staff to prove I bought them there. (staff view and passenger)

The 'problem' there is that the larger supermarkets can afford to take your word for something, and just swap out or refund you without a receipt. It clearly pays off for them in the long run, but does perhaps make people expect everyone to work that way.

Sadly, there are too many people who are trying it on and the genuine, honest, people suffer. That's why I think the industry should have an appeals process that takes place later (so staff aren't in such an awkward situation) with an admin fee. If you're genuine, you'll be okay (less the fee) but if you were trying it on then you'll get nowhere without engaging in some seriously fraudulent activity that could (no, should) land you in deep water.
 
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