Ticketing sites offering TFW "Clwb 60" advances without checking entitlement

[AdamWW]

The lesson is: TOCs needs to understand the implications of proposed out-of-the-ordinary changes to products and to discuss these with retailers first, before agreeing on a plan to implement them well. Retailers are absolutely striving for the best customer experience - TOCs should be doing so too.

Sadly I have seen very little to make me think that in any area TfW are able to satisfactorily consider "customer experience".

They are however excellent at putting out press releases putting a positive spin on things and ignoring anything negative.

 

[nwales58]

Perhaps TFW set up the promotion to attract new customers who did not have the £35 Senior Railcard?

That is the obvious reason, and good marketing.

It would have been clearer if they had called it ‘Over 60’s Special Deal’ as that would have made it cear that this was for over 60’s only.

From memory, we have had over-50s offers before which were implemented clearly and sensibly but I cannot remember the details. TfW's marketing people implementing this in the way they did confirms my prejudices about the wrong people being in the job currently. Same as the random advance fare generator that does not match likely loadings.

The use of the Welsh word ‘Clwb’ means nothing to most people and is discriminatory against the English speaking majority.

Meaningless words are used all the time in advertising. What does 'Revolut' mean?

Where I live, people who can only read english are a small minority. 'Clwb' appeals to the majority.

 

[AdamWW]

That is the obvious reason, and good marketing.


From memory, we have had over-50s offers before which were implemented clearly and sensibly but I cannot remember the details. TfW's marketing people implementing this in the way they did confirms my prejudices about the wrong people being in the job currently. Same as the random advance fare generator that does not match likely loadings.

I found this screen grab from an old thread from 2019, showing a "Clwb 50" ticket being offered by the TfW booking engine alongside other tickets and making the restrictions clear.

Fairly obvious not to pick it if you don't qualify, though it might still have caused trouble with split ticketing sites though I'm not sure how common they were in 2019.

Of course it's rare that it's possible to be offered an invalid ticket without explicitly choosing a discount you don't qualify for beforehand.

Anyway I presume that TfW have learned from their experience this time round, though it might be argued that they could have seen the problems it would cause beforehand without finding out the hard way.

 

[Krokodil]

Sadly I have seen very little to make me think that in any area TfW are able to satisfactorily consider "customer experience".

The seats on a 197 are better than they could have been (originally the same seats as on 195s were planned). Otherwise yes.

From memory, we have had over-50s offers before which were implemented clearly and sensibly but I cannot remember the details.

Arriva had "Club 55", it's before my time but I'm pretty sure that they were sold as return tickets.

TfW's marketing people implementing this in the way they did confirms my prejudices about the wrong people being in the job currently. Same as the random advance fare generator that does not match likely loadings.

Your sentiments are widely shared among frontline retail staff, the ones bearing the brunt of each new bright idea.

 

[gallois]

I found this screen grab from an old thread from 2019, showing a "Clwb 50" ticket being offered by the TfW booking engine alongside other tickets and making the restrictions clear.

Fairly obvious not to pick it if you don't qualify, though it might still have caused trouble with split ticketing sites though I'm not sure how common they were in 2019.

Of course it's rare that it's possible to be offered an invalid ticket without explicitly choosing a discount you don't qualify for beforehand.

Anyway I presume that TfW have learned from their experience this time round, though it might be argued that they could have seen the problems it would cause beforehand without finding out the hard way.

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This is clearer, but highlighting cheapest in this context is wrong IMO, being drawn to something that most are ineligible for. I can't think of any other situation where something highlighted as 'cheapest' is not only something most don't want, it's something most can't have.

Anyway, look what was shown when clicking 'additional information' on a 'Advance CLWB 60 ticket'

The same information that is displayed fo'r a standard Advance ticket. In fact, on the tickets selection and all the way up to checkout, there was no information about the need to be over 60. I pulled this up with TFW and they said that the relevant information is on the national rail link there, which is astounding. The fact that the additional information button doesn't mention the appropriate restrictions and that you need to open a website just to say 'over 60's only' is terrible UX design. Even on the National Rail link with CLWB 60 info, you still have to scroll down to see the age restriction information.

I'm still awaiting a response to my formal complaint to TFW. Customer service basically denied any issue.

 

[AdamWW]

This is clearer, but highlighting cheapest in this context is wrong IMO, being drawn to something that most are ineligible for. I can't think of any other situation where something highlighted as 'cheapest' is not only something most don't want, it's something most can't have.

Yes I agree completely.

Anyway, look what was shown when clicking 'additional information' on a 'Advance CLWB 60 ticket'

The same information that is displayed fo'r a standard Advance ticket. In fact, on the tickets selection and all the way up to checkout, there was no information about the need to be over 60. I pulled this up with TFW and they said that the relevant information is on the national rail link there, which is astounding.

I agree. It's appalling.

There is a separate link for "ticket restrictions" and while I appreciate that an age limit isn't what they mean by restrictions in that sense, it's totally unreasonable to expect someone to realise that there's a restriction on who can use the ticket under "additional information".

Even on the National Rail link with CLWB 60 info, you still have to scroll down to see the age restriction information.

Indeed - it leads with the very misleading: "Advance Clwb 60 tickets are single (one-way) tickets for many longer and some shorter distance journeys, are available in Standard class and offer the best available price for each journey."

If they were desiging things to catch people out they couldn't have done a lot better.

It's rather unimpressive that the Trainline native web site did a much better job of dealing with these than using TfW's own web site or app.