Side lights only at night

[Christmas]

Hi to all of our older bus drivers out there. My question is, back in the 80s and 90s I can remember seeing buses in both London and Glasgow running around in the dark with only their side lights on. Watching old tv programmes from as far back as the 60s shows that buses hardly used their headlights.

Does anyone remember this or can explain why? Modern buses seem to run around with lights on all day, both external and interior. Perhaps something to do with saving battery power?

 

[E27007]

The Highway Code Rule 113. Motor vehicles at night. Sidelights are mandatory at night. Headlights not mandatory where the road has lit street-lighting, but note the "grey area open to interpretation" of the speed limit applying to those roads.

Rule 113​

You MUST

• ensure all sidelights and rear registration plate lights are lit between sunset and sunrise
• use headlights at night, except on a road which has lit street lighting. These roads are generally restricted to a speed limit of 30 mph (48 km/h) unless otherwise specified

 

[dan5324]

Most modern buses come with DRLs (daytime running lights. Some companies such as Arriva London have a headlights always on policy regardless of time of day.

 

[PeterC]

When I learned to drive in the late 60s it was common practice to drive on side lights at night in built up areas.

 

[Gloster]

I have a feeling that when I took my test in 1982 it was legal to drive a car at night with only sidelights on when there was full street lighting. I think that somewhere it stated that the streetlights had to be not more than a certain distance apart (and, presumably, to a certain minimum brightness). I would presume that this dated from the days when batteries and alternators weren’t so effective: drive slowly with all lights on while making lots of stops might well end with you stalling. (I write without any technical knowledge as I only understand the basics of how a car works: push that bit down and it moves, push that bit down and it stops, push that bit down and you avoid that nasty crunching sound.)

 

[Busaholic]

4 December 1951 - a troop of naval cadets were marching from their base in Gillingham, Kent to Chatham Dockyard on a foggy night when a double decker bus being driven on sidelights alone, as was customary at the time, ran into the back of the marchers killing 24 of them; it remains the county's worst ever road accident measured by casualties. Dock Road, Chatham, where the tragedy occurred, had street lighting whose quality was described as 'poor' in contemporary reports. Despite this, there seem to have been no moves to amend the law, though I dare say the Maidstone and District Omnibus Company may have issued later instructions outlawing the practice. Or was it still Chatham and District in the area then?

Somewhere among my fairly extensive library on London bus matters over the years I could probably find the definitive answer as to how and when London took up and later abandoned their policies on exterior bus lighting but I'm in no physical condition at present to search.

 

[Christmas]

4 December 1951 - a troop of naval cadets were marching from their base in Gillingham, Kent to Chatham Dockyard on a foggy night when a double decker bus being driven on sidelights alone, as was customary at the time, ran into the back of the marchers killing 24 of them; it remains the county's worst ever road accident measured by casualties. Dock Road, Chatham, where the tragedy occurred, had street lighting whose quality was described as 'poor' in contemporary reports. Despite this, there seem to have been no moves to amend the law, though I dare say the Maidstone and District Omnibus Company may have issued later instructions outlawing the practice. Or was it still Chatham and District in the area then?

Somewhere among my fairly extensive library on London bus matters over the years I could probably find the definitive answer as to how and when London took up and later abandoned their policies on exterior bus lighting but I'm in no physical condition at present to search.

Very interesting and a tragedy too. I suspect any bus being driven on side lights alone, even with street lighting, would be being flashed at by other road users.

 

[Gloster]

4 December 1951 - a troop of naval cadets were marching from their base in Gillingham, Kent to Chatham Dockyard on a foggy night when a double decker bus being driven on sidelights alone, as was customary at the time, ran into the back of the marchers killing 24 of them; it remains the county's worst ever road accident measured by casualties. Dock Road, Chatham, where the tragedy occurred, had street lighting whose quality was described as 'poor' in contemporary reports. Despite this, there seem to have been no moves to amend the law, though I dare say the Maidstone and District Omnibus Company may have issued later instructions outlawing the practice. Or was it still Chatham and District in the area then?

Somewhere among my fairly extensive library on London bus matters over the years I could probably find the definitive answer as to how and when London took up and later abandoned their policies on exterior bus lighting but I'm in no physical condition at present to search.

There is a piece on Wikipedia under the title Gillingham bus disaster. It says that it was the Chatham & District and also that compulsory use of lights came in the 1970s. (So were we all breaking the law?)

(Nice to see you posting again.)

 

[Busaholic]

There is a piece on Wikipedia under the title Gillingham bus disaster. It says that it was the Chatham & District and also that compulsory use of lights came in the 1970s. (So were we all breaking the law?)

(Nice to see you posting again.)

I suspected it was during the last years of Chatham and District. I remember getting a copy of an A.A. newsletter in the 1980s, having passed my driving test in 1981, that brought the news of a court case taken to appeal regarding the necessity of driving with lights on during bad weather. It determined that 'lights on' meant headlights. not just side lights, dismissing the appeal of a driver, so maybe it tied in with a more general change?

Thank you for your kind comment - thought for a while I wasn't going to see my 75th birthday, but made it in the end.

 

[MotCO]

I'm not sure if the law changed, or whether driving with headlights at night (on cars as well as buses) just became 'custom and practice'.

I also remember Routemasters, and RTs before them, driving on sidelights at night with only the nearside headlight lit.

 

[matchmaker]

I have a feeling that when I took my test in 1982 it was legal to drive a car at night with only sidelights on when there was full street lighting. I think that somewhere it stated that the streetlights had to be not more than a certain distance apart (and, presumably, to a certain minimum brightness). I would presume that this dated from the days when batteries and alternators weren’t so effective: drive slowly with all lights on while making lots of stops might well end with you stalling. (I write without any technical knowledge as I only understand the basics of how a car works: push that bit down and it moves, push that bit down and it stops, push that bit down and you avoid that nasty crunching sound.)

Until the late 1960s/early 1970s, most cars were fitted with a dynamo, rather than an alternator. A dynamo didn't provide charge at low engine speeds, so you had to reduce the amount of load so that you didn't flatten the battery. The largest loads were heated rear window (if you had one - rare back then!) and headlights. Hence the use of only sidelights when there was streetlighting. You kept an eye on the ignition warning light - if it was on or flickering, the battery was discharging.

 

[E27007]

Until the late 1960s/early 1970s, most cars were fitted with a dynamo, rather than an alternator. A dynamo didn't provide charge at low engine speeds, so you had to reduce the amount of load so that you didn't flatten the battery. The largest loads were heated rear window (if you had one - rare back then!) and headlights. Hence the use of only sidelights when there was streetlighting. You kept an eye on the ignition warning light - if it was on or flickering, the battery was discharging.

With street lighting and reasonable night vision, the illumination they provide is usually adequate to see the road is clear ahead, headlights from oncoming traffic, especially if the beams are set too high, can dazzle and temporarily impair night vision which is not safe for the driver, recall public road safety films which advised to look away if the headlights of oncoming traffic dazzled the driver

 

[Trnsprt4Sctlnd]

Modern day rules of the road aside, most bus firms internally mandate the use of headlight for some reason. Perhaps the thinking is that it makes the vehicles more visible, despite potentially being painted in bright colours and being 14-15ft tall.

 

[duncombec]

Most bud firms internally mandate the use of headlight for some reason, perhaps the thinking is that it makes the vehicles more visible despite potentially being painted in bright colours and being 14-15ft tall.

There have been numerous studies - in fact, more than I thought when I googled it to see if I could find one to quote - across many countries that suggest running with headlights on during the day reduces accidents. Results suggest anywhere between 5 and 20%, although the first few links from suggest 5-10 is more common (20% was from Australia). From an insurance perspective, that has to be a good thing, and no surprises bus operators will use it.

In some European countries, it is mandatory to drive with headlights (or Daytime running lights) on at all times - not just in the far north of Norway, but even in Denmark, which fits an approximate latitude of Newcastle <> Inverness. Apparently, Danish cars come with a switch to turn the lights off, not to turn them on.

 

[Spartacus]

I'm not sure if the law changed, or whether driving with headlights at night (on cars as well as buses) just became 'custom and practice'.

I also remember Routemasters, and RTs before them, driving on sidelights at night with only the nearside headlight lit.

One result of the Chatham crash (apart from marching columns were to have a tail lamp at night) was that buses had to have one nearside 'spot' light, usually mounted externally to the main bodywork on older buses, but integrated on newer ones, sometimes it stood out a lot, other times it was integrated quite nicely, like a fog light, either on it's own or with one of the offside that appeared to match but on close inspection was usually different. The spotlight requirement seems to have been dropped in the very late 70s or maybe 1980 looking at photos of buses with and without the extra light, probably when headlights at night became legal a requirement.

The RTs had a spotlight fitted externally, low below the front bodywork. The RMs were a bit of a halfway house, part integrated, part external. The RMLs with slightly bigger front bodywork had theirs externally below. I can't say I've seen an RML in modern times with the spotlight, I expect they were quite prone to damage down there, forever getting cracked (some small company probably went bust with the regulation change!), although most RTs seem to retain them.

 

[MotCO]

The RTs had a spotlight fitted externally, low below the front bodywork. The RMs were a bit of a halfway house, part integrated, part external. The RMLs with slightly bigger front bodywork had theirs externally below. I can't say I've seen an RML in modern times with the spotlight, I expect they were quite prone to damage down there, forever getting cracked (some small company probably went bust with the regulation change!), although most RTs seem to retain them.

My memory may be playing tricks, but I thought it was the headlight rather than the spotlight which was lit on the nearside. i.e. only one of the two headlights was lit.

 

[AndyPJG]

I have a feeling that when I took my test in 1982 it was legal to drive a car at night with only sidelights on when there was full street lighting. I think that somewhere it stated that the streetlights had to be not more than a certain distance apart (and, presumably, to a certain minimum brightness). I would presume that this dated from the days when batteries and alternators weren’t so effective: drive slowly with all lights on while making lots of stops might well end with you stalling. (I write without any technical knowledge as I only understand the basics of how a car works: push that bit down and it moves, push that bit down and it stops, push that bit down and you avoid that nasty crunching sound.)

I think it was in 1958 that the speed limit regulations were reviewed/unpdated. By default, roads with "street lighting" (defined as at least 3 street lights not more than 200 yards apart) would be 30mph and would not require 30mph repeater signs. If a road with lighting was other than 30mph then the appropriate limit signs were needed at intervals no greater than 200 yards apart, and conversely 30mph unlit roads needed 30 plates at the 200 yards spacing. (NB at this time there were no motorways, and they are also designated 'Special Roads' in the relevant legislation and so have their own rules.
As I understand the vehicle lighting regulations, headlight use is mandated on roads with a speed limit greater than 30mph (and unlit roads,+fog & falling snow etc), and only sidelights aka position lamps for lit 30mph roads.

(as a ret highway engineer)

Edit: the foregoing meant that (it used to be) simple, if there was street lights with no markings, it was 30mph, otherwise look for signs. Sdaly this has now fallen into disrepute as some highway authorities now put 30mph plates on street lights when not legally required, and also 20mph zones are a law unto themselves!

 

[CN04NRJ]

Modern day rules of the road aside, most bus firms internally mandate the use of headlight for some reason. Perhaps the thinking is that it makes the vehicles more visible, despite potentially being painted in bright colours and being 14-15ft tall.

When I worked for Cardiff Bus under the previous MD, during a period of "financial uncertainty" we were told to turn all sidelights, interior lights off during the daylight as "it puts strain on the battery and increases fuel consumption". I'm not sure how many pennies were saved during this

 

[Spartacus]

My memory may be playing tricks, but I thought it was the headlight rather than the spotlight which was lit on the nearside. i.e. only one of the two headlights was lit.

With the spotlight being low down and prone to damage I wondered if they wired the highlights to show just the nearside one to prevent having to refit spotlights time and time again? In fact now I'm looking at a few Great Smog photos there's some buses with both the spotlight and left headlight only lit, which means the left hand only modification must have been done, and quite early too. That said some have all three lit, some just the spotlight and others just the marker lights still.

 

[AndyPJG]

[...]
The RTs had a spotlight fitted externally, low below the front bodywork. The RMs were a bit of a halfway house, part integrated, part external. The RMLs with slightly bigger front bodywork had theirs externally below. I can't say I've seen an RML in modern times with the spotlight, I expect they were quite prone to damage down there, forever getting cracked (some small company probably went bust with the regulation change!), although most RTs seem to retain them.

I think London Transport used to be able the run much older buses (RTs & RFs etc) under special rules/derogation in the old GLC area, I can remember at a kid some buses in London had only one stop light, the rear indicator was a single double ended arrow etc. In later life you could see where a second arrow indicator was added on the nearside, with one end of the original double arrow plated over.

 

[RogerOut]

I’m not sure why anyone would drive any vehicle in the dark without their headlights on anyway! Regardless of the street lights.

 

[PG]

I’m not sure why anyone would drive any vehicle in the dark without their headlights on anyway! Regardless of the street lights.

Maybe a Hangover from the Blitz?!!

 

[Spartacus]

I’m not sure why anyone would drive any vehicle in the dark without their headlights on anyway! Regardless of the street lights.

As above, when you'd only got a dynamo to charge your battery, were typically running at low speeds creating little charge, but were also running the cabin lights every bit of electricity usage mattered if you didn't want to kill the battery.

 

[Busaholic]

My memory may be playing tricks, but I thought it was the headlight rather than the spotlight which was lit on the nearside. i.e. only one of the two headlights was lit.

My memory too, in relation to RMs anyway. I don't recollect RTs only running on one headlight (deliberately, anyway!}

In the current edition of Buses magazine in a photo accompanying a reader's letter, there is a photo taken late at night in 1959 of the first RM used on trolleybus conversion side by side with one of the last trolleybuses, both in service, as a new night bus route coincided with the last evening of the trolleys. The bus has both headlights on, whereas the trolleybus is running on sidelights, but I don't believe the 'one headlight' strategy was in use then, or even possible. Many modifications were made to the first few hundred Routemasters over the first two or three years in response to operational experience. AEC were as keen as London Transport to iron out difficulties as their continued survival depended upon it.

 

[Taunton]

Sidelights only at night in 'built up areas' were indeed commonplace until the 1970s, among other types for taxis, which stayed within the urban area and ran all night. Electrical circuits in cars were nothing like nowadays, my first car had the (DC generator) light start to glow if main beam headlights were on. Buses had a particular issue as they typically had the same electric capacity as comparable lorries, but had all the saloon lighting to handle.

I remember being stopped at the Mersey road tunnel tollbooths for HAVING headlights on in the tunnel in those early times - only sidelights were allowed, and most people went through with none at all.

An early visit to the USA, where headlights in daytime were universal on buses, looked decidedly strange. And of course all-day headlights on trains there go back to steam loco days. Countries where all-day road headlights are now compulsory, and vehicles have to be wired appropriately, tend to be northern ones with very extended twilight and long winter nights - Sweden started it, I think initially informally when they changed the side of the road in 1968, and it since spread to the rest of Scandinavia, Russia and Canada.

 

[Gloster]

I can remember that back in the 1970s my father used to get really annoyed by the way that Volvos had sidelights on all the time. I also remember that when I went to Denmark on 1990 I had to keep my sidelights, or possibly dipped headlights, on all the time: a bit of a nuisance in a battered old Mini.

 

[Roger1973]

My understanding is that when the RT generation of London bus was built, there wasn't the concept of main / dipped beam, so there were two switches, one for the nearside headlight, and the other (that later became the main / dip switch, closer to driver's left hand on an RT) for the offside headlight.

The nearside 'spotlight' on RT and RM generation was intended as a 'fog light' and marked as such on the switch panel - arguably these were needed less after the clean air acts.

Yes, RT and RM generation buses were built with a single brake light - RTs and RFs also only had one (small) tail light which also illuminated the rear registration plate. With RMs (as built) the two outer lights were tail lights, the central one was the brake light. I'm not sure there was any special relaxation of rules within the GLC area for this, as some red buses ran outside the GLC area in to the 80s, and the country area buses (many of which were LT buses inherited by London Country and ran in to the 70s) were to the same design and I'm fairly sure they weren't modified.

Many in preservation or heritage PSV use still have the original pattern of lights, although some owners have retro-fitted a higher standard or (with Routemasters) left later modifications in place while restoring to an older livery etc.

Generally speaking, if a road vehicle was built to the standards that were legal at the time, then it does not have to be modified, and can't fail an MOT for that reason (for example vehicles without any direction indicators, or with 'semaphore' direction indicators, cars with no seat belts or no rear seat belts and so on) - although some MOT testers can take a bit of persuading...