Pig Replacements?

[Kris]

Just reading in Modern Railways about The Inter City Express program......

Quote 'This does bring hidden upsides. South West Trains commuters still bewailing the loss of the Class 442 can take comfort in a requirement in the IEP technical specification for a 750 DC version.'

Hmm - interesting.

Now - if only they'll do away with the stupid corridor connections and make them permanent 10 or 12 car units

 

[Tom]

Platform lengthenings would be required for most stations south of Southampton....

Certainly Totton, Ashurst, Beaulieu Rd, Sway, New Milton, Hinton, Christchurch, Pokesdown, Branksome (can't be lengthened), Parkstone (south probably), Hamworthy, Holton Heath, Wareham(?), Wool, Moreton, Dorchester South (perhaps a few metres) and Upwey...

Probably will be 10 car formation (23m coach) as a 12 car (23m coach) won't fit in Waterloo unless the Linford St flyover is modified for Main - Windsors and they then use Waterloo Intl.

 

[Kris]

Little known fact ......... Moreton used to be a 3 car platform and we had the facility on Pigs to open 3 coaches only when they first came out.

The door panel in the corridor used to be on the opposite wall too - nearest the platform.

 

[Tom]

Already known fact

Now you can only do local door only... shame the Desiros only have SUO, rather than SDO...

 

[Kris]

Platform lengthenings would be required for most stations south of Southampton....

Certainly Totton, Ashurst, Beaulieu Rd, Sway, New Milton, Hinton, Christchurch, Pokesdown, Branksome (can't be lengthened), Parkstone (south probably), Hamworthy, Holton Heath, Wareham(?), Wool, Moreton, Dorchester South (perhaps a few metres) and Upwey...

Probably will be 10 car formation (23m coach) as a 12 car (23m coach) won't fit in Waterloo unless the Linford St flyover is modified for Main - Windsors and they then use Waterloo Intl.

Unless of course they actually caught up with the 21st century and used the GPS to allow only the doors to open that can be accommodated on the platforms.

Nah! That's only for civilised countries and not this dingy backwater 4th World pile of poo.

 

[Tom]

That'll be why it exists with the 377s then

I think beacons would be better off on the platforms... less expense.

 

[Kris]

Belisha?

 

[Tom]

You what?! hock:

 

[Kris]

Belisha Beacons .......... What you get at Zebra Crossings

 

[Tom]

Oh!!

I think it's a low end radio transmitter that the train picks up... could work in a similar fashion to LUL, where you always have to stop on the mark or the doors will not release....

 

[Kris]

We'll go for that then - cheap 'n' nasty always wins the day

 

[Tom]

All we need is for it to be installed to the 159s

 

[Kris]

Don't start messing with the 159's thank you. I'm quite happy with them as they are.

 

[Tom]

Thought that would hit a nerve.

 

[Kris]

Does make you wonder - although they are the most reliable diesel in terms of MPC - would they still want to replace them with hybrids?

 

[Tom]

It all depends on the theoretical reliability - the 159s are good units and they're coming up for a mid-life refurb (once all the other 158s/159s are done the 159/0s are off to Donny) so I think they should do OK, which probably means that they will be one of the last lines to have HST2s, if they get them.

Would co-incide nicely with a WoE upgrade.

 

[Hentis]

Platform lengthenings would be required for most stations south of Southampton....

Certainly Totton, Ashurst, Beaulieu Rd, Sway, New Milton, Hinton, Christchurch, Pokesdown, Branksome (can't be lengthened), Parkstone (south probably), Hamworthy, Holton Heath, Wareham(?), Wool, Moreton, Dorchester South (perhaps a few metres) and Upwey...

Probably will be 10 car formation (23m coach) as a 12 car (23m coach) won't fit in Waterloo unless the Linford St flyover is modified for Main - Windsors and they then use Waterloo Intl.

Platform 2 at Poole would need lengthening as it cannot take a 12 car desiro!!! Platform 1 can (just with a few feet to spare) take a 10 car dessie but not 12.

12 car slammer would only just scrape into the platform at Poole even with the nose of the unit past the starting signal at Poole (PO4)

Cheers

Tony.

 

[Nathan]

Platform 2 at Poole would need lengthening as it cannot take a 12 car desiro!!! Platform 1 can (just with a few feet to spare) take a 10 car dessie but not 12.

Don't blame the Desiros! Simular story for the 442s surley, which class is longer?

 

[Tom]

10 car 442s are 23m long, so 230m roughly.
12 car 450s are 20m long, so 240m roughly.

I think Poole is about 235m long

 

[Hentis]

Don't blame the Desiros! Simular story for the 442s surley, which class is longer?

10 Car pig fitted in nicely on Platform 1 & 2 :headbang: :boxing: milebox:

Tony.

 

[Tom]

444s IIRC are about 2.5m longer in a 5-car formation than a pig in a 5-car formation.

 

[Oracle]

Ay Ashurst you could extend the platforms as there is room in my opinion but at the moment it's just as easy to get all those who want to get off at ANF in the front car.

You're too young to remember the 8-VAB unit. In the late Sixties it often ended up with a 4-car unit [4-TC it seems rather than a 4-VEP] to make a 12-car 2-unit train that ideal to take the masses down to Bournemouth in the summer. At New Milton the combos used to frequently have to let passengers out, then the train would move forward and let the passengers out of the rear unit. No central locking in those days!

 

[Hentis]

Ay Ashurst you could extend the platforms as there is room in my opinion but at the moment it's just as easy to get all those who want to get off at ANF in the front car.

You're too young to remember the 8-VAB unit. In the late Sixties it often ended up with a 4-car unit [4-TC it seems rather than a 4-VEP] to make a 12-car 2-unit train that ideal to take the masses down to Bournemouth in the summer. At New Milton the combos used to frequently have to let passengers out, then the train would move forward and let the passengers out of the rear unit. No central locking in those days!

Oh yeah too young to remember that.

Although seeing 12 car tc's going to Bournemouth was fun 33+8 car TC + 33+4 car TC on the rear. That formation happened quite regularly.

I think it was the Boat Train portion as well.

Cheers

Tony

 

[paul1609]

That'll be why it exists with the 377s then

I think beacons would be better off on the platforms... less expense.

377s work on GPS except where there is a conflict such as on platform 14/ 15 at Clapham Junction and at Billingshurst where there are local beacons.
Im assured that 377/1 & 377/4s are programmed for all stations between Eastleigh and Southampton West and then on the branch right down as far as Bournemouth.

 

[Oracle]

That formation happened quite regularly.

Yes I remember!

The last time I travelled on a 33/1 and 8-TC was on the Portsmouth-Bristol which was 'all stops' from Fareham to Southampton Central that called at Netley about 0730. Back in 1982ish? The 33/1 + 4-TC combo I have been on Basingstoke-Reading and Reading-Redhill from the bay.

 

[Kris]

We used to have the '442 Zero Option' back in 1988. This was whilst awaiting delivery of the Pigs.

One would witness all sorts of formations - mostly 2 E.D.'s and 8 T.C. but I did take over an E.D. - T.C. - E.D. at Southampton. It had arrived 17 minutes early hock: ........... No Black Box and all that power !

Most memorable formation was T.C. - 33 - T.C. ...... wish I had a picture of that.

We used to have a V.E.P. or C.I.G. combined with a 2 H.A.P. as a regular 6 car working from Weymouth to Brock' in the morning. Brock' Brat special - where they'd try and hide in the non - corridor H.A.P. to avoid paying the fare.

 

[Hentis]

We used to have the '442 Zero Option' back in 1988. This was whilst awaiting delivery of the Pigs.

One would witness all sorts of formations - mostly 2 E.D.'s and 8 T.C. but I did take over an E.D. - T.C. - E.D. at Southampton. It had arrived 17 minutes early hock: ........... No Black Box and all that power !

Most memorable formation was T.C. - 33 - T.C. ...... wish I had a picture of that.

We used to have a V.E.P. or C.I.G. combined with a 2 H.A.P. as a regular 6 car working from Weymouth to Brock' in the morning. Brock' Brat special - where they'd try and hide in the non - corridor H.A.P. to avoid paying the fare.

For me it had to be this one Class 47 + 8TC to Weymouth

Apparently the 33 failed and all that was left to put on it was a 47!!!

Had to do this down to Poole mind. Fantastic!!

There are some shots of the 73's working the 4TC's on the Poole page of the BR Years section on the site.

 

[Kris]

Never saw that one but I did have a 'Special Stop Order' on an Inter-Regional one morning. All stations to Brockenhurst.