Oyster plus rail replacement bus.

[londonbridge]

Not sure if this has been asked before. Are there any rules for using PAYG on national rail where part of the journey involves a rail replacement bus service?

 

[MikeWh]

I had a long late-night conversation with someone at TfL and again with South Eastern shortly after Oyster was introduced. It didn't seem as though the concept of replacement buses had been thought through, or if it had it hadn't been communicated to customer service staff. As far as TfL were concerned, on their services you get the bus portion free. What I didn't push about was if you use trains either side of the bus and the combination of two train tickets is more than the overall journey would you get a refund. I guess they might look for touch out/touch in at either end of the bus and process "operational refunds" after the event.

TfL wouldn't commit to what southeastern might do and southeastern didn't have a clue back in January. I haven't needed to ask since.

 

[talltim]

Surely it just counts as part of your train journey, same as if you had a 'normal' train ticket

 

[clagmonster]

I have done Underground replacement bus services before and the bus leg when sandwhiched between two Underground legs is treated as an out of station interchage.

 

[swt_passenger]

Surely it just counts as part of your train journey, same as if you had a 'normal' train ticket

That's a given, but the problem is whether or not the Oyster PAYG system is set up to automatically handle replacement bus services which could, amongst other things, cause a PAYG journey to be timed out, or treated as two separate journeys if the NR station barriers remain in use.

LU and London buses have software systems in place to automatically deal with planned bustitution on either TfL buses or special buses, the presumption is that NR haven't.

 

[londonbridge]

If the train is the first leg of the journey,you touch in at the starting station,but do you touch out at the station where you transfer to the bus,or at the station where you get off the bus (assuming that's the end of your journey)? It might be that your destination station is completely closed and you can't access a reader,meaning you'll be charged for an incomplete journey. On the other hand,if you touch out when you get off the train,and then get the bus which takes you into the next fare zone,you won't have paid the full fare.

Alternatively,what if the bus leg is the first part of the journey and there is nowhere to touch in before boarding the bus? Again,if you wait and touch in at the station where you change to the train,you may not have paid the full fare. And as suggested,the total time of train + bus could cause the journey to time out,again leading to a penalty charge for an incomplete journey.

 

[mallard]

If the train is the first leg of the journey,you touch in at the starting station,but do you touch out at the station where you transfer to the bus,or at the station where you get off the bus (assuming that's the end of your journey)? It might be that your destination station is completely closed and you can't access a reader,meaning you'll be charged for an incomplete journey. On the other hand,if you touch out when you get off the train,and then get the bus which takes you into the next fare zone,you won't have paid the full fare.

Alternatively,what if the bus leg is the first part of the journey and there is nowhere to touch in before boarding the bus? Again,if you wait and touch in at the station where you change to the train,you may not have paid the full fare. And as suggested,the total time of train + bus could cause the journey to time out,again leading to a penalty charge for an incomplete journey.

TfL consider RRBs (at least Tube replacements) to be free, so not paying the full fare is not a problem. The issue is that it is unclear whether National Rail buses in the zones are also free, and if they are, are refunds for a train->RRB->train journey processed correctly.

 

[embers25]

Maybe I'm being stupid here but how do you swipe in/out on a tube replacement bus if the station is shut and there is no access to the barriers as the reader on the bus, if it has one, won't be on. In this case aren't you technically fare dodging even though TfL may consider them free thats not stated anywhere? In the case on Nat Rail the station would normally still be open but the barriers would be off so again how does that work as surely thats a great way to fare dodge now? I'm sure this issue must have been addressed given the North London Line is bustituted most weekends and surely they can't be letting everyone travel free???

 

[Magicake]

As a general point about replacement buses, I always think it's pretty mean to make you pay full rail fare when the journey normally ends up taking about three times as long!