Did the Metropolitan Line ever get a new signalling system? In 2009 I was working on enabling works for the new system. I also had a friend working on the main system in 2011/12. Just there is a lot of chat on a local group about signalling problems in the Wembley Park/Preston Road area. There was the inevitable comment about the Metropolitan Line being 150 years old so what to you expect. Just wondered if they did ever install a new state of the art system. Seems like they didn't.
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Metropolitan Line Signalling
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zwk500
Veteran Member
They are in the process of installing it, here is the thread discussing the project: https://www.railforums.co.uk/threads/ssr-resignalling.166182/
It covers all 4-subsurface lines (Circle, Hammersmith and City, District, and Metropolitan), and has currently covered the entire H&C and Circle lines, the Met south of Preston Road, and the District east of Barons Court.
The eventual plan will see the entire Met line converted (with Chiltern sharing the tracks on normal signals), but will leave the sections of the District line shared with other lines/trains on the existing signalling.
See also the wikipedia page: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Four_Lines_Modernisation
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I will take a look. A friend of mine was working on the design back in 2011/12, that was 14 years ago. Didn't the fire the original designer? Why is the taking sooooooooooooooooo long. I suppose everybody involved wants it to take as log as possible.
The original SSL signaling contract was let by Bombardier, an equity partner in the Metronet PPP Consortium (I was a Metronet employee at the time). They plumped for Westinghouse. The whole thing was a bit of a mess as I recall disputes about who was responsible for all the enabling works like equipment rooms and cable runs. So, the whole thing sorry debacle was binned when Metronet collapsed and TfL took control. As for me, I crossed the street to Tube Lines on Metronet's demise and found an altogether more structured and disciplined approach to programme management. In retrospect, delivered Jubilee Line resignaling just two years late was a paragon of virtue compared with multiple false starts on 4LM !
Old Walter
Member
From memory, by 2011 the Westinghouse project had gone - and the product on the table then was Bombardier Cityflo 650 (and C650 was planned to be on the whole SSR & Piccadilly line). The proposals at that time were a lot bigger than happened - for example the two sets of crossovers at Hammersmith (H&C) were to be replaced by a scissors crossover and one of the crossovers at Amersham was to be replaced the other way round to enable straight reversing from southbound platform 3.
I believe a lot of the reversing points would have stayed in on that scheme, but in the end on the (then) Thales scheme a lot of areas got simplified to make the project easier. Some extra moves at different places did get put in though with CBTC operation.
I believe a lot of the reversing points would have stayed in on that scheme, but in the end on the (then) Thales scheme a lot of areas got simplified to make the project easier. Some extra moves at different places did get put in though with CBTC operation.
zwk500
Veteran Member
Another thread reports a cracked crossing at points in the Wembley Park area, which apparently are hard to get overnight access to replace due to Night Tube hours.
What is the problem at Wembley Park?
I've noticed that the Met has been showing delays owing to a track fault at Wembley Park and all trains were semi-fast when I was at Baker St. Presumably it is a problem with the points. Does anyone know what the problem is and when it is likely to be fixed?
www.railforums.co.uk
This kind of failure would not be specifically related to the type and age of signalling in use.
Well, back then it wasn't LU's decision - the choice of technology and contractor had been abdicated to the PPP Contractors. As I recall, there were concerns that Seltrac was incapable of dealing with complex layouts, as was demonstrated when they struggled with the delts junction on DLR at Poplar. And the Jubilee was much closer to the ideal end-to-end layout that would make life easier for the contractor (if one sets aside the Met inter-running issues).
When you say back then, Metro net went under in 2007. TfL took over Tubelines in 2010. Not withstanding LU having approve everything that Thales did after 2010 every thing was down to LUL as part of TfL. I did have a damn good laugh, I was with Thales when it was Alcatel in 2005 I think through to 2007. I was then with Tubelines in 2009 as part of Tublines team putting together the claim to LUL. When TL got the response back LU said they rejected the claim for increased costs, LU just said that TL had stated in monthly reports that lack of progress was totally due to poor performance by Thales. TL had agreed the Thales claim to TL. I very nearly split my sides laughing when I read how TL had shot themselves in both feet.
And that failed "frustrated access" claim by Tube Lines, combined with TfL and Tube Lines failing to agree commercial terms for the second contract review period, led to TL handing back the keys. Big losers were Picc line passengers, as the contract award process for 73 TS replacement was well advanced (I know, I was on the bid evaluation team) and that project got canned in the mayhem of the moment. So the first new Picc train might have been in service 13 years ago. Funny old world !