Merseyrail semi-fast running antics.

[Bikeman78]

Understand the point being made, however last minute changes to the timetable have already caused confusion, changing those alterations again midway through a journey can cause additional issues.

My friend used to be a guard on the valleys. He would always ring up control if a train was back on schedule and suggest that it reverted to running as originally scheduled. They were usually happy for this to happen. Indeed, I've been on trains where it has happened.

 

[Krokodil]

My friend used to be a guard on the valleys. He would always ring up control if a train was back on schedule and suggest that it reverted to running as originally scheduled. They were usually happy for this to happen. Indeed, I've been on trains where it has happened.

Would that decision happen once the train had already started running fast? Or just before leaving the last call before the missed stations.

 

[Bikeman78]

Would that decision happen once the train had already started running fast? Or just before leaving the last call before the missed stations.

A bit of both. If someone has been driving/gaurding on the valleys for years, they are likely to know the timetable off by heart anyway. Likewise on Merseyrail.

== Doublepost prevention - post automatically merged: 23 Feb 2026 ==

So they should just turn up at the station on the off chance?

I wouldn't call turning up for the scheduled departure time turning up on the off chance. I'm from a generation where checking before I travelled wasn't a thing. Old habits die hard. I rarely check before I cycle to the station and even if I did, the problem could arise during the time it takes to get to the station. If I'm out and about, then a cancellation usually means hanging about on a station for half an hour. My phone telling me it's cancelled doesn't make any difference to the outcome.

 

[Peakrider]

They do factor in recovery time into the timetable. For example I often get on the train at Bache that can be say four minutes late, yet by Birkenhead Central it is on time. I find when the train leaves Bache or Chester on time it can be waiting 3 or 4 minutes at Birkenhead Central.

Yes quite often having left Bebington a few minutes early. Liverpool trains often arrive at RFY up to 4 mins early. Not really good enough.

 

[Horizon22]

My friend used to be a guard on the valleys. He would always ring up control if a train was back on schedule and suggest that it reverted to running as originally scheduled. They were usually happy for this to happen. Indeed, I've been on trains where it has happened.

Yes I have had this happen before and it is normally fine to confirm and then advise all other parties (info controller, NR controller) too.

The vast majority of time in my experience - I can't talk about Merseyrail - the amendment is not enough to get trains to run early, and rarely are they fully on-time after running normally (often 1-3 mins down) so such situations are very rare. Continuously having early trains after certain amendments suggests poor experience / training or guidance offered to controllers.

 

[Peakrider]

My local station is Spital, which is always missed out for semi-fast. I pay the same precept to Merseytravel via Council Tax as other Wirral residents but get a sub-standard service. On the day in question I took the earlier train to Chester, expecting it to stop at Chester. When travelling from Spital to Liverpool/Chester for a connection I always have to allow extra time for the frequent cancellations/semi fast running which is annoying.

== Doublepost prevention - post automatically merged: 18 Mar 2025 ==


Opening and closing of doors/setting off is definitely slower with the new trains which negates any savings due to better acceleration.

Yes the door opening and closing ceremony on the 777s seems to occur in agonisingly slow motion.
As reported by Roger Ford in Modern Railways, these units remain some of the most unreliable on the network.

== Doublepost prevention - post automatically merged: 23 Feb 2026 ==

I have noticed more recently that Merseyrail will send their trains non stop from Hooton - Birkenhead Central if 5 mins late, which would make more sense if they just ran it fast to Rock Ferry instead of Birkenhead Central - otherwise it leads to stuff like this:

View attachment 183259

(Screenshot shows a Chester - Liverpool service running non stop from Hooton - Birkenhead Central, arriving at Birkenhead Central nearly 5 minutes early, and the stop at Bromborough is an RTT error)

They like to arrive at Central on time or early so that the staff changeover is on time or (for the staff) ideally early, human nature being what it is. Trains often leave RFY early possibly for this reason.
It just adds to the popular feeling among its users that Merseyrail runs purely for its own convenience.

== Doublepost prevention - post automatically merged: 23 Feb 2026 ==

In PEP days there was always a standby unit parked up between the peaks in the siding at Birkenhead Central, ready to step in.
I don't know if that is still the case with 777s.
That never applied at weekends, through.

These days the spares are at RFY. Handy for me it’s my station!
At least when it rains & the lines near Hooton regularly flood there’s a shuttle RFY to the loop.
Also I’ve seen a quick cross platform changeover of passengers from a troublesome unit onto one of the spares at RFY a few times, with an extra crew on the spare replacement train. Impressively efficient!!

 

[Krokodil]

I wouldn't call turning up for the scheduled departure time turning up on the off chance.

You would on the Wrexham-Bidston line!

 

[Kite159]

Merseyrail train crew diagrams dont have all the stations listed on them (the guards certainly don't but im pretty sure the drivers dont either - sure someone could confirm, or advise if its changed recently). They just list main stations/relief points/terminus (see attached photo). Im assuming this is because of the large number of stops, theyd need 3 sheets for a diagram if it listed everywhere!

Other than that the crew have to go off platform CIS screens. Unsure if 777s have any way of showing the schedule in cab.

As said above, keep it simple to avoid things going even more pearshaped.

Image attachment shows a Merseyrail Guards Diagram from a few years ago.

== Doublepost prevention - post automatically merged: 23 Feb 2026 ==


In my mind it would have made sense to electrify platform 4 aswell as 7 in Chester but of course the electrification was done on the cheap! That would have given more options, although given capacity restraints at Chester it probably wouldnt help much these days. I cant see any additional platforms being built any time soon.

That's a diagram and those generally don't show everything, it's the daily schedule sheet which will show all the various station calls & timings which the staff should pick up when they sign on.

 

[jamesst]

Yes the door opening and closing ceremony on the 777s seems to occur in agonisingly slow motion.
As reported by Roger Ford in Modern Railways, these units remain some of the most unreliable on the network.

== Doublepost prevention - post automatically merged: 23 Feb 2026 ==


They like to arrive at Central on time or early so that the staff changeover is on time or (for the staff) ideally early, human nature being what it is. Trains often leave RFY early possibly for this reason.
It just adds to the popular feeling among its users that Merseyrail runs purely for its own convenience.

== Doublepost prevention - post automatically merged: 23 Feb 2026 ==


These days the spares are at RFY. Handy for me it’s my station!
At least when it rains & the lines near Hooton regularly flood there’s a shuttle RFY to the loop.
Also I’ve seen a quick cross platform changeover of passengers from a troublesome unit onto one of the spares at RFY a few times, with an extra crew on the spare replacement train. Impressively efficient!!

No spares kept at Rock Ferry during the day, any units you see there are there for a reason ie a changeover or a fault. If a changeover is hapoening the replacement unit will come from elsewhere.
Birkenhead North depot or Kirkdale is where any spares are kept.

== Doublepost prevention - post automatically merged: 23 Feb 2026 ==

That's a diagram and those generally don't show everything, it's the daily schedule sheet which will show all the various station calls & timings which the staff should pick up when they sign on.

Sadly what you see is what traincrew get, daily schedule sheets have never been a thing at Merseyrail.

 

[Phillipimo]

Sadly what you see is what traincrew get, daily schedule sheets have never been a thing at Merseyrail.

When every train stops at every station* the diagram is probably all you need.

*Except Capenhurst of course

 

[Krokodil]

*Except Capenhurst of course

Which does beg the question of how crew are informed of this. Is there a note on their diagram?

 

[jamesst]

Which does beg the question of how crew are informed of this. Is there a note on their diagram?

Correct

 

[Falcon1200]

My friend used to be a guard on the valleys. He would always ring up control if a train was back on schedule and suggest that it reverted to running as originally scheduled.

That is a great way of pro-actively managing the situation.

Which does beg the question of how crew are informed of this.

I travelled by Merseyrail to Chester last week and recall seeing a station sign saying 'Driver; Check your calling pattern'!

 

[Parham Wood]

So they should just turn up at the station on the off chance?

Not everyone checks train times on the web so some will be at the station and given we are talking about Merseyrail with the frequency of trains I expect many will opt to wait for the next train and be surprised by their intended train actually stopping. It really does not matter if anyone actually catches the train the point is that it has regained running to the published timetable and will benefit anyone who is at the stations.