Longer trains on WCML - How much capacity would they have added, compared to HS2?

[HSTEd]

As a frame for comparison, a 400m single unit Class 395 could carry north of 1200 seated passengers, with the exact number depending on the number of toilets.

520m would be about 1600 or so.

 

[Nottingham59]

As a frame for comparison, a 400m single unit Class 395 could carry north of 1200 seated passengers, with the exact number depending on the number of toilets.

520m would be about 1600 or so.

Good. How else are we going to achieve significant modal shift?

 

[stuu]

Spain has also had issues from its fast-build programme, leading to lower specs for new lines (single-track high speed lines must be a nonsense).
There are also new line sections from nowhere to nowhere in empty country, with no plan to complete.
All funded with EU money (some of which came from the UK).

The line to Léon is single track for long stretches, but that's fine for a 300 km/h service that runs hourly at best, so not sure why that's nonsense? The political goal is national cohesion rather than the price

None of the high speed lines since 2000 have received much EU funding - 20/30%. Just like TEN/regional projects in the UK were

 

[A S Leib]

The line to Léon is single track for long stretches, but that's fine for a 300 km/h service that runs hourly at best, so not sure why that's nonsense? The political goal is national cohesion rather than the price

How much of China's high-speed rail network's single-track, given that I suspect that national cohesion's a large motivation behind that as well (and I think worse flight reliability and higher relative air fares than in e.g. Spain?)?

 

[Bald Rick]

Does the ETCS system allow changes to track layout to be made relatively easily without requiring a huge effort in moving signaling systems.

Easier in some ways, harder in others. AIUI The ‘map’ of the ETCS controlled line(s) is in the onboard part of the signallign system, and that has to be altered whenever there is a change.

Agreed because with short blocks you can easily have the equivalent of closing up 'signals' at all stations on a busy metro style route. You can even have additional block markers along the length of platforms like the Thameslink central core where the next train can start to enter a platform before the previous one has completely cleared it. ETCS also dramatically improves junction signalling in many cases as speed can be regulated gently down to the precise turnout location rather than trains being subject to a very restrictive approach release from red at a signal half a mile before reaching the junction for a slow speed divergence.

Indeed, as has been done at Welwyn viaduct. Should help matters there.

 

[Technologist]

Good. How else are we going to achieve significant modal shift?

We aren't, forget about it, (any freed path for cars will just be filled by another car on any route a car and train compete on) the name of the game is increasing marginal capacity for the transport system as a whole.

 

[MarkyT]

Easier in some ways, harder in others. AIUI The ‘map’ of the ETCS controlled line(s) is in the onboard part of the signallign system, and that has to be altered whenever there is a change.

In addition to having a complete map of all possible routes onboard already, I believe it's possible to send the fixed data in sections as required together with the movement authority, or have it encoded with simple ID and position data in track balises. I don't know the approach UK is taking currently, though I've heard there are restrictions on how much data you can encode in a balise message due to the specs already being a little old! With little ETCS mileage today, a local system data version for each area/fleet preloaded at the depot is probably practical. When the system becomes more widely deployed in the future and some long-distance trains will be traversing multiple equipped areas widely spaced on different regions, then the sheer size of the map and the version management become more challenging.

 

[Mgameing123]

How about we make people walk the HS2. Saves us tons of resources and would boost the hotel industry!