Lille-Europe Platforms

[ryan125hst]

Lille-Europe has four platforms: Platforms 44 and 46 are under the main concourse and are used by Eurostar services to Brussels as well as trains from Calais to Paris and beyond; and platforms 43 and 45 which are used by London bound Eurostars. However, these platforms are also used by TGV’s to Calais, and TGV’s that terminate and head back towards Paris.

I see that there is a glass wall between platforms 43 and 45, and doors on each side of the bottom of the stairs from the concourse which allow an individual platform to be closed off from the rest of the station when a Eurostar is due, with Eurostar passengers having cleared passport control and security in Hall 4 before entering the platform via a separate escalator.

How come Eurostar don’t have a dedicated platform for their departures as it must be a nightmare to clear a 400m long platform every couple of hours before the Eurostar arrives only to open it back up again after its departure for use by TGV’s?

Are there any other stations where this occurs? St Pancras is segregated and I believe Paris Gare du Nord is too. Do Brussels, Rotterdam and Amsterdam stations have similar systems?

 

[StephenHunter]

Brussels Midi has platforms 3 and 4 on an island that are used for both shades of Eurostar, TGVs and ICE. 3 is the one used for Amsterdam to London services and has large doors that are closed off shortly before the Blue Eurostar arrives, with passengers being held in the waiting area until the area is ready.

Brussels starters use the segregated platforms 1 and 2.

 

[Amalie]

Rotterdam and Amsterdam

Rotterdam uses a side platform (platform 2), which also has a Eurostar blue terminal where passengers have to wait before their train arrives.

It’s used for regular trains, but a few moments before the Eurostar arrives, the platform exits are closed off and protected by guards.

Amsterdam also has a similar setup, with the difference being that the Eurostar terminal is under the platform (Platform 15) and has, I believe, its own stairs/lift to the platform.

The reason for this setup is that there simply wasn’t enough space for dedicated platforms. I do think they could have proper closable walls/doors on exits instead of a police-style tape across it and a guard (which would cost much more in the long term).

 

[DanielB]

Rotterdam uses a side platform (platform 2), which also has a Eurostar blue terminal where passengers have to wait before their train arrives.

It’s used for regular trains, but a few moments before the Eurostar arrives, the platform exits are closed off and protected by guards.

Besides that regular trains are only allowed to pass that platform empty during AFAIK 30 minutes before the Eurostar Blue arrives.
That led to trains having to run empty from The Hague to Dordrecht during works, involving diversions of most domestic trains via platform 2, somewhere earlier this year.

 

[Mike99]

Rotterdam uses a side platform (platform 2), which also has a Eurostar blue terminal where passengers have to wait before their train arrives.

It’s used for regular trains, but a few moments before the Eurostar arrives, the platform exits are closed off and protected by guards.

Amsterdam also has a similar setup, with the difference being that the Eurostar terminal is under the platform (Platform 15) and has, I believe, its own stairs/lift to the platform.

The reason for this setup is that there simply wasn’t enough space for dedicated platforms. I do think they could have proper closable walls/doors on exits instead of a police-style tape across it and a guard (which would cost much more in the long term).

Is platform 15 at Amsterdam the one furthest from the main frontage, where the trams arrive and depart?. I boarded a train going through to Germany as far as Osnaburg and I think that was 15. It was a long walk under the platforms into the tiniest lift up to platform level.

 

[Full Standing]

Related question: How are customs checks organised at Lille for ex-London services? Are there red/green lanes at the exists of platforms 44 and 46 that are used when ex-London eurostars arrive? What happens if after an ex-London departure there is a subsequent TGV departure from the same platform? Would that mean that you can get out of the station without passing red/green lanes (by boarding the subsequent TGV)? Caveat: I don't know much about customs, I'm just curious though as there are quite designated customs lanes at the Eurostar terminal at Bruxelles-Midi.

 

[williamn]

Related question: How are customs checks organised at Lille for ex-London services? Are there red/green lanes at the exists of platforms 44 and 46 that are used when ex-London eurostars arrive? What happens if after an ex-London departure there is a subsequent TGV departure from the same platform? Would that mean that you can get out of the station without passing red/green lanes (by boarding the subsequent TGV)? Caveat: I don't know much about customs, I'm just curious though as there are quite designated customs lanes at the Eurostar terminal at Bruxelles-Midi.

There are no customs checks at any of the EU terminals for Eurostar, only for passengers arriving into London.

 

[StephenHunter]

There are no customs checks at any of the EU terminals for Eurostar, only for passengers arriving into London.

There are some checks on the train and on arrival on a spot check basis.

 

[30907]

How come Eurostar don’t have a dedicated platform for their departures as it must be a nightmare to clear a 400m long platform every couple of hours before the Eurostar arrives only to open it back up again after its departure for use by TGV’s?

Lille-Eurooe isn't exactly busy: the TGV service is (1) "Province-Province" avoiding Paris via the Interconnexion (2) Dunkerque/Boulogne-Paris (3) Dunkerque-Lille TER-GV. which I doubt amount to more than 3 departures an hour. Sterilising two platforms for half an hour wouldn't be a major problem even if ES ran hourly.

 

[ryan125hst]

Brussels Midi has platforms 3 and 4 on an island that are used for both shades of Eurostar, TGVs and ICE. 3 is the one used for Amsterdam to London services and has large doors that are closed off shortly before the Blue Eurostar arrives, with passengers being held in the waiting area until the area is ready.

Brussels starters use the segregated platforms 1 and 2.

Is there a reason why platforms 1 and 2 aren't used for Amsterdam to London services? I don't know the layout of Brussels Midi so I assume either platforms 1 and 2 are terminating platforms or the track layout doesn't allow easy access?

Rotterdam uses a side platform (platform 2), which also has a Eurostar blue terminal where passengers have to wait before their train arrives.

It’s used for regular trains, but a few moments before the Eurostar arrives, the platform exits are closed off and protected by guards.

Amsterdam also has a similar setup, with the difference being that the Eurostar terminal is under the platform (Platform 15) and has, I believe, its own stairs/lift to the platform.

The reason for this setup is that there simply wasn’t enough space for dedicated platforms. I do think they could have proper closable walls/doors on exits instead of a police-style tape across it and a guard (which would cost much more in the long term).

Do they clear the platforms of anyone on them? I ask because I saw a couple of videos where the Eurostar's departure was filmed from the same platform at Amsterdam and Brussels which I was surprised about. Surely only passport controlled cleared passengers would be on the platform at that point.

Lille-Eurooe isn't exactly busy: the TGV service is (1) "Province-Province" avoiding Paris via the Interconnexion (2) Dunkerque/Boulogne-Paris (3) Dunkerque-Lille TER-GV. which I doubt amount to more than 3 departures an hour. Sterilising two platforms for half an hour wouldn't be a major problem even if ES ran hourly.

That's a fair point, and I think I'm right in saying they only need to sterilise one platform as there are separate doors for each at the bottom of the stairs? It's a long platform to sterilise though!

 

[Full Standing]

Is there a reason why platforms 1 and 2 aren't used for Amsterdam to London services? I don't know the layout of Brussels Midi so I assume either platforms 1 and 2 are terminating platforms or the track layout doesn't allow easy access?

Platforms 1 and 2 are dead-ends and only accessible from the south (i.e. towards Lille and London).

 

[DanielB]

Do they clear the platforms of anyone on them? I ask because I saw a couple of videos where the Eurostar's departure was filmed from the same platform at Amsterdam and Brussels which I was surprised about. Surely only passport controlled cleared passengers would be on the platform at that point.

With the old terminal, when only half a Eurostar could be filled in Amsterdam, only the section of platform with the terminal (15b) was closed with a big fence halfway the platform. The other half of the platform then was in use for domestic services and also accessible. (The train not obviously, as it had the doors of the half standing along the unsecured platform shut).

Back then a Eurostar could also never be diverted via Woerden from Amsterdam to Rotterdam, as that would result in the not security swept half ending up along the secured platform half in Rotterdam and vice versa.

 

[ryan125hst]

Platforms 1 and 2 are dead-ends and only accessible from the south (i.e. towards Lille and London).

That's a valid reason

With the old terminal, when only half a Eurostar could be filled in Amsterdam, only the section of platform with the terminal (15b) was closed with a big fence halfway the platform. The other half of the platform then was in use for domestic services and also accessible. (The train not obviously, as it had the doors of the half standing along the unsecured platform shut).

Back then a Eurostar could also never be diverted via Woerden from Amsterdam to Rotterdam, as that would result in the not security swept half ending up along the secured platform half in Rotterdam and vice versa.

Oh right, so only have a Eurostar was used when they first started going to Amsterdam. Presumably the whole train can be used now?

When only half was filled, was the other half still used for Brussels passengers?

 

[rvdborgt]

Oh right, so only have a Eurostar was used when they first started going to Amsterdam. Presumably the whole train can be used now?

Yes indeed. Capacity of the terminal in Amsterdam was increased and they need to use the complete train now.

When only half was filled, was the other half still used for Brussels passengers?

They did that for a while but very few people booked it.

 

[Mike395]

It’s worth noting that only one end of the platform is used at Rotterdam also - though I think it fits most (all?) of the 16 car train. You can see the first of two fences in this photo, the second one is more substantial at the top of the ramp from the Eurostar departure lounge.

 

[rvdborgt]

It’s worth noting that only one end of the platform is used at Rotterdam also - though I think it fits most (all?) of the 16 car train. You can see the first of two fences in this photo, the second one is more substantial at the top of the ramp from the Eurostar departure lounge.

Rotterdam Centraal can handle a double Thalys, so a 400 m Eurostar can also be accommodated.

 

[Amalie]

Is platform 15 at Amsterdam the one furthest from the main frontage, where the trams arrive and depart?.

Indeed. In The Netherlands, platform 1 is typically the platform closest to the front of the station which itself is closest to the city centrum.

Is there a reason why platforms 1 and 2 aren't used for Amsterdam to London services?

Besides the track layout issue, those platforms would be significantly more challenging to secure.
Platform 1 isn’t long enough, and securing Platform 2 would block off a general station exit, platform 1 access, and several food stalls for non-Eurostar blue passengers.

 

[zwk500]

Besides the track layout issue, those platforms would be significantly more challenging to secure.
Platform 1 isn’t long enough, and securing Platform 2 would block off a general station exit, platform 1 access, and several food stalls for non-Eurostar blue passengers.

I believe @ryan125hst was asking about Brussels-Midi/Zuid, where platforms 1 and 2 are definitely long enough for Blue Eurostar and don't block any exits or food stalls as they are the designed security platforms.

 

[STINT47]

The bigger question about Lille Europe is why the platforms are numbered from 43?

Everything I pass through I always wonder what happened to the 42 other platforms.

 

[signed]

The bigger question about Lille Europe is why the platforms are numbered from 43?

Everything I pass through I always wonder what happened to the 42 other platforms.

My first guess would be to prevent conflicts and confusion with Lille Flandres? As Lille Flandres platforms run 1 (or 2 can't remember)-16

 

[rvdborgt]

The bigger question about Lille Europe is why the platforms are numbered from 43?

Everything I pass through I always wonder what happened to the 42 other platforms.

It's a good thing they don't use platform numbers that are used at Lille Flandres. Not sure though why they started at 43 and not at e.g. 20.

 

[Cloud Strife]

I do think they could have proper closable walls/doors on exits instead of a police-style tape across it and a guard (which would cost much more in the long term).

I'm surprised they haven't done this, as it's very cheap and easy to implement compared to having guards and tape.

There are no customs checks at any of the EU terminals for Eurostar, only for passengers arriving into London.

Correct me if I'm wrong, but wasn't Brussels changed to accommodate an arrival customs corridor? Having said that, the EU generally doesn't put much effort into arrival customs checks from wealthy countries without tax issues, as you can also see on the Norwegian and Swiss borders. Only Italy seemingly still has a strong customs presence on the Swiss border, but they mostly exist for catching people crossing with expensive jewellery/watches/cash.

The risk from UK-origin passengers will be incredibly low, so there's likely very little point in organising proper customs arrival facilities. France in particular has massively cut back on their customs presence on the Swiss borders to the point where they've demolished or closed most of the road/rail infrastructure.

 

[Mike395]

Brussels does have a customs channel at the end of the platform (you walk through red/green channels much like an airport) but it's very much 'random and (at least when I was selected) exceeding cursory luggage check' - as @Cloud Strife says, the risk from UK-origin passengers will be very low (and even more so on Eurostar, customs tend to be more concerned with vehicle movements via Dover where someone is statistically much more likely to be carrying commercial quantities of stuff).

 

[Cloud Strife]

Brussels does have a customs channel at the end of the platform (you walk through red/green channels much like an airport) but it's very much 'random and (at least when I was selected) exceeding cursory luggage check' - as @Cloud Strife says, the risk from UK-origin passengers will be very low (and even more so on Eurostar, customs tend to be more concerned with vehicle movements via Dover where someone is statistically much more likely to be carrying commercial quantities of stuff).

Thanks, I thought I'd read about this somewhere! I'm surprised they even bothered with red/green lanes to be honest.

Yes, despite Brexit, not much has changed on the customs front at all. I don't think France even bothered putting customs facilities in place for cars in Calais in the new part of the port, and they didn't build anything new in the old part either.

 

[AdamWW]

Thanks, I thought I'd read about this somewhere! I'm surprised they even bothered with red/green lanes to be honest.

Yes, despite Brexit, not much has changed on the customs front at all. I don't think France even bothered putting customs facilities in place for cars in Calais in the new part of the port, and they didn't build anything new in the old part either.

When I used the Eurostar to Paris recently, there did seem to be a customs person behind a table at the end of the platform and someone being dealt with, but there were no red/green channels to walk through and the crowd mostly just swept past it.

 

[Full Standing]

I don't think France even bothered putting customs facilities in place for cars in Calais in the new part of the port, and they didn't build anything new in the old part either.

Dunkerque port has customs, however. At least, I passed some kind of customs area when I was there with my bike (see trip report here: https://www.railforums.co.uk/thread...dfds-ferry-dover-dunkirk.288291/#post-7343066). But the cyle lane (and one of the two roads leading out of the port) were quite a few meters away from the customs building. The other road out of the port, however, runs directly next to the customs building. Both roads run in parallel, and I don't know how it is decided which one you use.

 

[ryan125hst]

The bigger question about Lille Europe is why the platforms are numbered from 43?

Everything I pass through I always wonder what happened to the 42 other platforms.

I wondered the same! It must cause some worry for first time travellers seeing their train is soon due and they need to get to platform 46!