Jubilee Line turnbacks

[Busaholic]

Can anyone help me, please? I'd like to know what turnback facilities exist on the Jubilee line, in which direction and whether any scheduled services use them (other than Wembley Park), also whether any conditions apply to use e.g. in dire emergencies only. Any info. on here will be gratefully received. Thank you.

 

[jopsuk]

this map shows the locations of crossovers, but obviously doesn't have the rules.

I'm pretty sure I've heard of engineering and events meaning turnbacks at North Greenwich (both directions) Waterloo and more. I think Green park can be used (from then to the north) with the empty trains reversing at Charing Cross.

 

[Clip]

Yeah there's a 3rd platform at north greenwich which I've been caught out on many a time but that's all I know.

 

[Via Bank]

Around a quarter(?ish) of trains on weekdays start/finish at Willesden Green where there's a turn back siding up to the north.

 

[tsr]

Waterloo is a relatively common location for turning back, both during planned and unplanned disruptions.

 

[Busaholic]

Waterloo is a relatively common location for turning back, both during planned and unplanned disruptions.

Is it a turnback from both directions, do you know? I've been doing a little more delving since my original question and discovered that TfL were adamant they needed a turnback facility at London Bridge, were told it couldn't be done but South Bermondsey was offered as an alternative (a very poor one, from the Stratford direction at least, I would have thought): in the end, the extra £1 million or so it would have cost to provide it was deemed 'too much'. It would have been a siding, not just a crossover, which I understand the Waterloo one is. Even this latter is not where TfL originally wanted it, being to the west rather than east of the station.

North Greenwich is an interesting one, provided in part in lieu of Canary Wharf which again was wanted but was impossible. I understand the possible addition of another branch at a later date was factored into the decision, if only to get the costs approved! I take it any thoughts as to another branch from NG are long dead.

 

[Clip]

AFAIK the extra platform is just accessed by a set of points at each end so I wouldnt know where you could start to build from nor too really if there was to be one.

Unless you wanted to do a single track off to LCA to save those having to change at Canning town.

 

[jopsuk]

Looking at the map (my first post):

There's a crossover to the west of London Bridge that would appear to allow an eastbound train to access the westbound platform (platform 3) to terminate.

Waterloo appears to do it the other way round, trains can terminate in the eastbound platform then use a crossover west of the station to depart west.

Canary wharf has a full scissor crossover to the west of the station

Platform 2 at North Greenwich can be accessed, and gives access to, both directions- it is effectively in the middle of a full crossover.

Green Park has (out of service) access to Charing Cross where there's a crossover.

Willesden Green, West Hampstead, and Wembley Park all have a turnback siding to the north west.

 

[edwin_m]

AFAIK the extra platform is just accessed by a set of points at each end so I wouldnt know where you could start to build from nor too really if there was to be one.

Unless you wanted to do a single track off to LCA to save those having to change at Canning town.

Assuming this refers to North Greenwich, it was probably intended, if an extension was ever built, to have two platforms westbound and one for both routes eastbound. This means if trains arrived on both branches at once they could both wait in a platform. There looks to be space in the tunnel east of North Greenwich for a junction off to the south.

 

[Busaholic]

Looking at the map (my first post):

There's a crossover to the west of London Bridge that would appear to allow an eastbound train to access the westbound platform (platform 3) to terminate.

Waterloo appears to do it the other way round, trains can terminate in the eastbound platform then use a crossover west of the station to depart west.

Canary wharf has a full scissor crossover to the west of the station

Platform 2 at North Greenwich can be accessed, and gives access to, both directions- it is effectively in the middle of a full crossover.

Green Park has (out of service) access to Charing Cross where there's a crossover.

Willesden Green, West Hampstead, and Wembley Park all have a turnback siding to the north west.

Thanks for that very full answer. It does seem that, on the extension at least and with the exception of North Greenwich, there could never really be scheduled short workings (e.g. Waterloo to Stratford) because, even if a crossover was in the right place, the through service would be compromised. So no trains starting from Canary Wharf in the evening peak, for instance, in the absence of the siding TfL wanted there, only if the service was already disrupted.

The reason for my query was that post-Crossrail traffic patterns will change and Jubilee passengers from Bond Street and northwards bound for Canary Wharf will probably use Crossrail, and the lesser numbers bound for Stratford too. It is quite feasible that, in peaks, the least- used part of the route will be the section between Green Park and Waterloo and there could well be scope for re-introducing the Charing Cross spur, especially as this will then attract SouthEastern passengers currently entraining at London Bridge or Southwark.Charing Cross could then act as a spur to somewhere else (NOT Waterloo).