Inaccurate announcements.

[Qwerty133]

Nearly every time I travel on the 16:21 from Derby to London st pancras, on approach to leicester the announcement nearly always includes 'change here for Bedford and Wellingborough'.
However for the quickest journey to these stations you should stay on board the train and instead change at Kettering for the train from Corby.
This has been going on since EMT changed which group of train managers working the service a couple of months ago.
EMT are apprantly aware of the problem and I am aware that passengers have been delayed by this.
What should be the next step to get these announcements corrected?

 

[Cherry_Picker]

How have you reached out to EMT? They seem active on Twitter and they encourage emails plus they give out a phone number and a postal address on their website. (link)

I dare say the guards are just regurgitating a script which was probably written in 1992 or something.

 

[43074]

I dare say the guards are just regurgitating a script which was probably written in 1992 or something.

That's probably it, and most of the xx:21 Derby to London services don't stop South of Leicester anyway, so it's likely that its just the habit of advising people to change there on the other services. It's not really an issue though, because there are alternative services between Leicester and those stations anyway.

 

[Cherry_Picker]

Just checked the timetable, changing at Leicester in this instance adds an extra 30 minutes to the journey time.

 

[Michael.Y]

No idea if this is relevant in this particular instance but sometimes the quickest journey isn't always the better option - for example you can get to Cheltenham from Paddington by changing at Swindon OR Bristol Parkway - but which is the better option? In terms of passenger flow is it better to dump people onto an empty provincial unit at Swindon which takes just over an hour than a CrossCountry Voyager at Bristol Parkway which has been picking up since Exeter / Plymouth? Same applies if travelling to Temple Meads - do you join an in-service HST from Swindon via Chippenham or do you turf people onto an end-to-end DMU running between the two Bristol stations?


(This all assumes an Any Permitted Route ticket of course!)

 

[Qwerty133]

How have you reached out to EMT? They seem active on Twitter and they encourage emails plus they give out a phone number and a postal address on their website. (link)

I dare say the guards are just regurgitating a script which was probably written in 1992 or something.

I have a feeling that they weren't, but were just unaware of the connection or something. Spoke to the TM on Wednesday about it, and as it was the same one yesterday she advised me they are adding a note Not to announce it on to the job sheet for that diagram.
N.B there were 2 TMs on board on Wednesday and it was the other one who made the incorrect announcement on that day

 

[Flamingo]

No idea if this is relevant in this particular instance but sometimes the quickest journey isn't always the better option - for example you can get to Cheltenham from Paddington by changing at Swindon OR Bristol Parkway - but which is the better option? In terms of passenger flow is it better to dump people onto an empty provincial unit at Swindon which takes just over an hour than a CrossCountry Voyager at Bristol Parkway which has been picking up since Exeter / Plymouth? Same applies if travelling to Temple Meads - do you join an in-service HST from Swindon via Chippenham or do you turf people onto an end-to-end DMU running between the two Bristol stations?


(This all assumes an Any Permitted Route ticket of course!)

i've never been able to work this one out, I usually never recommend anything, or go by Avantex recommendations.

This is one where the customer knows best!

The one that gets me is passengers travelling on a HST to Swansea or Carmarthen who are going on to West Wales. They always get told to change at Newport, when they are better off to stay on the HST as far as they can, be it Swansea or Carmarthen. There are only a few services which need changing earlier to meet trains that go down the Swansea avoider.

 

[Michael.Y]

Certainly in cases of open tickets your point stands. However I may be right in saying that on Advance Purchase, the algorithm automatically uses the first available opportunity to change on the journey. Paddington to Fishguard insists you change at Newport even though the 15:46 you pick up also calls at all the subsequent HST stops too. Euston to Holyhead also insists you change onto a 3-car DMU at Chester, even though the Virgin Voyager goes all the way through to Bangor. I guess it's a condition of travel / cost but if I was doing work or snoozing or travelling 1C I'd rather change off a terminating service at Swansea and have a bit more time to exit the train, especially if travelling with luggage.

 

[Flamingo]

Yea, it's the algorithm is programmed to tell passengers to change at the first station, but not the most sensible one! Avantex is sometimes different, telling the last available station.

The prime example I see is passengers for Swansea getting on a Cardiff train at Didcot Parkway, being told to change at Swindon for Swansea.

 

[Hyphen]

The one that gets me is passengers travelling on a HST to Swansea or Carmarthen who are going on to West Wales. They always get told to change at Newport, when they are better off to stay on the HST as far as they can, be it Swansea or Carmarthen. There are only a few services which need changing earlier to meet trains that go down the Swansea avoider.

There is something about changing at Newport that the journey planners love. For passengers travelling between stations west of Cardiff onto the XC Cardiff-Nottingham trains, it tells you to change at Newport in both directions.

On paper I suppose Newport looks easier because it is usually always a same-platform change, although that's not always guaranteed (I've done a few 1-->2 and 3-->4 runs in my time). I do prefer changing at Cardiff in both directions as even if the platform changes, you stay on the same island. You can also go up the far east/west end of the platform (whereas most blindly wait by the stairs) at Cardiff to await your train, and be guaranteed a seat when it arrives.

 

[causton]

There are only a few services which need changing earlier to meet trains that go down the Swansea avoider.

To take things off-topic slightly, which trains are those? Or how do I find them on RTT etc?

Slightly more on-topic, during weekend engineering works where the trains that normally call Kings Cross - Finsbury Park - Potters Bar - Hatfield - Welwyn - Welwyn North - Knebworth - Stevenage have been calling Kings Cross - Finsbury Park - Alexandra Palace - Stevenage (non-stop via Hertford North) drivers sometimes still announced at Finsbury Park "change here for inner suburban services via Alexandra Palace"... despite the train stopping at Alexandra Palace! Thankfully they all remembered to stop as well

 

[Flamingo]

I usually need to look up the calling pattern on Avantex. I'm sure somebody will be along soon to say how to do it online!
--- old post above --- --- new post below ---

There is something about changing at Newport that the journey planners love. For passengers travelling between stations west of Cardiff onto the XC Cardiff-Nottingham trains, it tells you to change at Newport in both directions.

On paper I suppose Newport looks easier because it is usually always a same-platform change, although that's not always guaranteed (I've done a few 1-->2 and 3-->4 runs in my time). I do prefer changing at Cardiff in both directions as even if the platform changes, you stay on the same island. You can also go up the far east/west end of the platform (whereas most blindly wait by the stairs) at Cardiff to await your train, and be guaranteed a seat when it arrives.

The plan hasn't changed since Newport Station was overhauled a few years ago.

 

[greatkingrat]

To take things off-topic slightly, which trains are those? Or how do I find them on RTT etc?

Trains booked to use the Swansea District line are

Mondays to Fridays:
1B96 1040 Newport - Fishguard Harbour
1V62 1830 FX Manchester Piccadilly - Carmarthen
1W48 0503 Carmarthen - Manchester Piccadilly
1B97 1329 Fishguard Harbour - Cardiff Central
Saturdays:
1V56 1630 Manchester Piccadilly - Milford Haven
1W48 0504 Carmarthen - Manchester Piccadilly
Sundays:
1E16 1216 Cardiff Central - Milford Haven

 

[edwin_m]

Where both trains use the same stretch of line, wouldn't it be more sensible for one operator's Advance tickets to maximize the use of that operator's train?

One that used to annoy me was travelling from Bradford-on-Avon to Nottingham by the slower route with only one change off the Southampton-Cheltenham-wherever to the Cardiff-Nottingham. The tickets always gave a change at Gloucester, which northbound involves climbing a windswept footbridge with no lifts, instead of Cheltenham where it is the same platform. At least once the first (First) conductor suggested we stay on until Cheltenham, but we had several seats booked at a table and I was worried about losing them.

I think Gloucester now has lifts, but I don't do that journey any more.

 

[Flamingo]

Where both trains use the same stretch of line, wouldn't it be more sensible for one operator's Advance tickets to maximize the use of that operator's train?

One that used to annoy me was travelling from Bradford-on-Avon to Nottingham by the slower route with only one change off the Southampton-Cheltenham-wherever to the Cardiff-Nottingham. The tickets always gave a change at Gloucester, which northbound involves climbing a windswept footbridge with no lifts, instead of Cheltenham where it is the same platform. At least once the first (First) conductor suggested we stay on until Cheltenham, but we had several seats booked at a table and I was worried about losing them.

I think Gloucester now has lifts, but I don't do that journey any more.

Gloucester does now have lifts.

Of course, bring cynical, if a TOC tells passengers to change early, it means the crowding will be on another TOC's trains...