GTR Notice to Prosecution again

[Applemasherr]

Today I forgot to buy my Harringey to Stevenage anytime day return ticket as I ran onto the train. I realised and in haste purchased a ticket on the train which of course got flagged by the ticket inspectors and they issued me the witness statement slip saying the intent to prosecute notice will come in approx 2 months. This is my commute train, and I have purchased the same tickets multiple days a week for the last 2 and a half years, so normally I would be confident that they wouldn't take me to court and I would just pay whatever settlement they asked for. My concern is that this exact same incident happened around a year and a half/2 years ago where I forgot to buy the ticket and bought it on the train, in this case after replying to the notice they reduced it to a penalty charge. I obviously feel rather silly as I should have remembered this from last time, and my concern is that because of this prior incident that they won't accept my appeal and take me to court. What are the chances of this happening?
Let me know if I should include any other information.

 

[Fawkes Cat]

Today I forgot to buy my Harringey to Stevenage anytime day return ticket as I ran onto the train. I realised and in haste purchased a ticket on the train which of course got flagged by the ticket inspectors and they issued me the witness statement slip saying the intent to prosecute notice will come in approx 2 months. This is my commute train, and I have purchased the same tickets multiple days a week for the last 2 and a half years, so normally I would be confident that they wouldn't take me to court and I would just pay whatever settlement they asked for. My concern is that this exact same incident happened around a year and a half/2 years ago where I forgot to buy the ticket and bought it on the train, in this case after replying to the notice they reduced it to a penalty charge. I obviously feel rather silly as I should have remembered this from last time, and my concern is that because of this prior incident that they won't accept my appeal and take me to court. What are the chances of this happening?
Let me know if I should include any other information.

Welcome to the forum. I may use some rather blunt language, so I am sorry if it offends.

In broad terms, not having a valid ticket before you get on a train is an offence. As you have done it before, you are a repeat offender.

We don't see very many repeat offenders here so we don't have much of a knowledge base to say how the railway will respond. Against that, the railway company involved (GTR) have a record of being prepared to settle out of court almost the whole time. Our analysis is that they want to persuade people to pay the right fare, and generally being charged the full fare plus an admin fee has the desired effect.

But in your case, it doesn't seem to have worked. You are on GTR's books already, so they may connect the two incidents. They may then decide that if an out of court agreement hasn't worked, a more severe lesson is needed: you may have to be taken to court.

But given GTR's record of settling out of court, you shouldn't write off the possibility of them settling this time. So our usual advice stands:
- wait for the letter from the railway
- come back to us then, and we'll help you reply to whatever the railway has asked you to comment on
- and make an extra effort to always buy the right ticket at the right time.

 

[Applemasherr]

Welcome to the forum. I may use some rather blunt language, so I am sorry if it offends.

In broad terms, not having a valid ticket before you get on a train is an offence. As you have done it before, you are a repeat offender.

We don't see very many repeat offenders here so we don't have much of a knowledge base to say how the railway will respond. Against that, the railway company involved (GTR) have a record of being prepared to settle out of court almost the whole time. Our analysis is that they want to persuade people to pay the right fare, and generally being charged the full fare plus an admin fee has the desired effect.

But in your case, it doesn't seem to have worked. You are on GTR's books already, so they may connect the two incidents. They may then decide that if an out of court agreement hasn't worked, a more severe lesson is needed: you may have to be taken to court.

But given GTR's record of settling out of court, you shouldn't write off the possibility of them settling this time. So our usual advice stands:
- wait for the letter from the railway
- come back to us then, and we'll help you reply to whatever the railway has asked you to comment on
- and make an extra effort to always buy the right ticket at the right time.

Thanks for the quick reply, I will certainly follow the same procedure. Regarding your comment about them persuading people to pay the right fare, of course purchasing the ticket after departure is an offence however is was the correct ticket and the correct fare with no attempt made to short-fare (and this was the same last time). Do you think this could work in my favour despite the fact that I am a reoffender?

 

[Fawkes Cat]

Thanks for the quick reply, I will certainly follow the same procedure. Regarding your comment about them persuading people to pay the right fare, of course purchasing the ticket after departure is an offence however is was the correct ticket and the correct fare with no attempt made to short-fare (and this was the same last time). Do you think this could work in my favour despite the fact that I am a reoffender?

I don't think we have seen enough about what GTR do in this situation to be able to say. From first principles, it's unlikely to do any harm - but that's not the same as it doing you any good.

 

[WesternLancer]

Thanks for the quick reply, I will certainly follow the same procedure. Regarding your comment about them persuading people to pay the right fare, of course purchasing the ticket after departure is an offence however is was the correct ticket and the correct fare with no attempt made to short-fare (and this was the same last time). Do you think this could work in my favour despite the fact that I am a reoffender?

I think this will help you, yes

I agree with the gist of @Fawkes Cat comments though

One question - did you buy this ticket quickly after boarding or only when you actually saw ticket checking staff?
The former is obviously much better than the latter.

I can recall one recent case on here where a person had actually ended up in court twice for previous evasion (which could have been avoided had they come here for advice, but I think English was not their first language so they may not have found it easy to fid a source of good advice) and then got caught a third time - advice from here on this third time go them an out of court settlement (which personally I was supposed to see) and that was with GTR

Soi despite your poor track record I think if you engage and co-operate with them you have every chance of avoiding court action.

Your key next stage is to be 100% sure you receive anything they send you - hard copy post / e-mail / spam etc - so keep a close eye out for their communication

 

[Applemasherr]

I think this will help you, yes

I agree with the gist of @Fawkes Cat comments though

One question - did you buy this ticket quickly after boarding or only when you actually saw ticket checking staff?
The former is obviously much better than the latter.

I can recall one recent case on here where a person had actually ended up in court twice for previous evasion (which could have been avoided had they come here for advice, but I think English was not their first language so they may not have found it easy to fid a source of good advice) and then got caught a third time - advice from here on this third time go them an out of court settlement (which personally I was supposed to see) and that was with GTR

Soi despite your poor track record I think if you engage and co-operate with them you have every chance of avoiding court action.

Your key next stage is to be 100% sure you receive anything they send you - hard copy post / e-mail / spam etc - so keep a close eye out for their communication

Unfortunately it was seeing the inspector that made me realise I hadn't bought a ticket. Should have just accepted my fate but instead I panic bought!

As for your anecdote, you're saying an individual was denied settlement and went to court on 2 occasions, to then settle on the 3rd incident?

I have just moved and the address is correct on the slip so I shouldn't miss their letter! (the inspector told me it will be specifically a letter)

 

[WesternLancer]

As for your anecdote, you're saying an individual was denied settlement and went to court on 2 occasions, to then settle on the 3rd incident?

No - we don't really know what happened to them on the 1st two occasions. They may have ignored letters and then ended up with it going to court

Edit - I found the thread so you can look over it and see what I meant

https://www.railforums.co.uk/threads/witness-statement.295896/

I have just moved and the address is correct on the slip so I shouldn't miss their letter! (the inspector told me it will be specifically a letter)

That is the usual GTR method of operation as can be seen on many threads here

 

[Applemasherr]

Wow, yes that is quite the situation on that other thread. Though as you said, the circumstances around the first 2 court fines aren't clear, so it is taken with a pinch of salt.

 

[WesternLancer]

Wow, yes that is quite the situation on that other thread. Though as you said, the circumstances around the first 2 court fines aren't clear, so it is taken with a pinch of salt.

My hunch is that most prosecutions like that just happen because the person concerned has no clue how to deal with the consequences of their own fare evasion actions when caught, or who / where to ask to find people who do know - and obviously are not likely to be able to spend c£750+ on a solicitor who does
Even more difficult if you are not a native English speaker / not grew up in UK

 

[Applemasherr]

Hi All,

I received the notice of intention to prosecute today, I have drafted my response if you all wouldn't mind giving me any pointers. I will follow up with a copy of the notice as well.

Dear prosecutions team,


I am writing in response to the Notice of Intention to Prosecute regarding the incident on (date) where I boarded a train without a valid ticket.


I would like to offer my most sincere apologies for the incident. The Harringay to Stevenage train is one that I take almost every day to work for the last 2 years and I had no intention of dodging the fare, it was an honest mistake where I forgot to purchase a ticket when rushing for the train one morning.


Despite that, I understand it is entirely my responsibility and I am completely at fault, it certainly will not happen again. I am keen to settle this out of court and of course I will be willing to pay for the outstanding ticket fare, penalty fine and any administrative costs in dealing with this matter.

== Doublepost prevention - post automatically merged: 3 Jul 2026 ==

Here is the letter. I noticed that there is an option to submit the reply online. Is there any advantage or disadvantage to this that has been seen?

== Doublepost prevention - post automatically merged: 3 Jul 2026 ==

Apologies, my response has been redrafted slightly to this:

Dear prosecution team,

I am writing in response to the notice of intention to prosecute that I received on 01 July, in respect of the incident on (date), where I was stopped by the ticket instructor for not having a valid ticket.

I would first like to offer my sincerest apologies and regret for the incident. I take this train to Stevenage almost everyday as part of my work commute and have thus purchased this ticket many times. I had no intention of dodging the fare, and it was an honest mistake as I had forgotten to purchase the ticket when rushing to board the train.

I take full responsibility for the incident, which was an honest mistake of my own fault, of which I can assure will not happen again.

I would kindly request that we settle this matter out of court, and I am more than willing to pay the outstanding ticket fare, administrative fees and penalty fine.

I do hope you take the above into consideration.

 

[30907]

Most importantly, delete the bit at the end about a penalty fine - no train company is allowed to do that.

Also, if you travel 4-5 days a week, wouldn't you be better off using a season ticket?

 

[AlterEgo]

Obvious detail that leaps out is that you don't have a season ticket and Stevenage allows gateless exit through the fare evaders' lift.

 

[riceuten]

Obvious detail that leaps out is that you don't have a season ticket and Stevenage allows gateless exit through the fare evaders' lift.

Quite often have revenue protection staff at this particular lift. Much to the chagrin of fare dodgers, all of whom got on the train at Knebworth, and "the ticket machine didn't work" (and there was no stopper in the last 15 minutes...). One mildly irritating things is the same staff standing in front of the tap out post, and demanding to see my ticket...as if they'd never seen a Key Card before...

 

[WesternLancer]

Hi All,

I received the notice of intention to prosecute today, I have drafted my response if you all wouldn't mind giving me any pointers. I will follow up with a copy of the notice as well.

Dear prosecutions team,


I am writing in response to the Notice of Intention to Prosecute regarding the incident on (date) where I boarded a train without a valid ticket.


I would like to offer my most sincere apologies for the incident. The Harringay to Stevenage train is one that I take almost every day to work for the last 2 years and I had no intention of dodging the fare, it was an honest mistake where I forgot to purchase a ticket when rushing for the train one morning.


Despite that, I understand it is entirely my responsibility and I am completely at fault, it certainly will not happen again. I am keen to settle this out of court and of course I will be willing to pay for the outstanding ticket fare, penalty fine and any administrative costs in dealing with this matter.

== Doublepost prevention - post automatically merged: 3 Jul 2026 ==

Here is the letter. I noticed that there is an option to submit the reply online. Is there any advantage or disadvantage to this that has been seen?

== Doublepost prevention - post automatically merged: 3 Jul 2026 ==

Apologies, my response has been redrafted slightly to this:

Dear prosecution team,

I am writing in response to the notice of intention to prosecute that I received on 01 July, in respect of the incident on (date), where I was stopped by the ticket instructor for not having a valid ticket.

I would first like to offer my sincerest apologies and regret for the incident. I take this train to Stevenage almost everyday as part of my work commute and have thus purchased this ticket many times. I had no intention of dodging the fare, and it was an honest mistake as I had forgotten to purchase the ticket when rushing to board the train.

I take full responsibility for the incident, which was an honest mistake of my own fault, of which I can assure will not happen again.

I would kindly request that we settle this matter out of court, and I am more than willing to pay the outstanding ticket fare, administrative fees and penalty fine.

I do hope you take the above into consideration.

You want to be offering to pay any fare owed plus their administration costs.
Do not offer to pay any fines as well.

 

[iamraymond]

Is it still an honest mistake with no intention if its repeat offence? I'd suggest to remove that if you can as they wont believe that

 

[Applemasherr]

Most importantly, delete the bit at the end about a penalty fine - no train company is allowed to do that.

Also, if you travel 4-5 days a week, wouldn't you be better off using a season ticket?

I take the train 3-4 times a week and they don't allow me to apply the 25-30 railcard on the season ticket so it is almost double the price per month, otherwise I would just get one.

I'll remove the fine bit too thanks!

== Doublepost prevention - post automatically merged: 4 Jul 2026 ==

Is it still an honest mistake with no intention if its repeat offence? I'd suggest to remove that if you can as they wont believe that

The original offence was almost 3 years ago and there will be a robust payment history during that time as well. Obviously for me it was just a mistake because I am a numpty but I feel that 'evidence' supports the fact that I just made an error and wasn't trying to dodge?

== Doublepost prevention - post automatically merged: 4 Jul 2026 ==

I take the train 3-4 times a week and they don't allow me to apply the 25-30 railcard on the season ticket so it is almost double the price per month, otherwise I would just get one.

I'll remove the fine bit too thanks!

== Doublepost prevention - post automatically merged: 4 Jul 2026 ==


The original offence was almost 3 years ago and there will be a robust payment history during that time as well. Obviously for me it was just a mistake because I am a numpty but I feel that 'evidence' supports the fact that I just made an error and wasn't trying to dodge?

I realize in the original post is said a year and a half / 2 years ago was the original offence but I later checked and it was closer to 3

 

[milooo]

Obvious detail that leaps out is that you don't have a season ticket and Stevenage allows gateless exit through the fare evaders' lift.

If it was terminating at Stevenage it would have likely have used the bay platform, which has barriers before you get to the lifts.

 

[Haywain]

If it was terminating at Stevenage it would have likely have used the bay platform, which has barriers before you get to the lifts.

It's only trains from the Hertford North line that use that platform.

 

[Applemasherr]

It's only trains from the Hertford North line that use that platform.

Yes that is the train that I get that terminates at stevenage on platform 5 has the lifts behind the barrier.